Streamripping [Archive] - Winamp Forums

onekit

20th May 2004, 14:48

Originally posted by soulful1
If you want to listen later, just tune into the stream then. C'mon you are fooling nobody here. The purpose of stream ripping is to aquire music for free. Which is exactly what the RIAA and BMG don't want you to do. Listen to the streams...if you like the music, go to the store and buy it.

soulful1

If I like the music in good CD quality, then I go to the store and buy it. Sure, I am agree.

But stations cast maximum at 160 kbps.
CD quality means at least 320 kbps and more.

Every record from your stations is only "demo version" of this music. Good quality music everyones buying in store.

Jay

20th May 2004, 17:01

Originally posted by onekit
If I like the music in good CD quality, then I go to the store and buy it. Sure, I am agree.

But stations cast maximum at 160 kbps.
CD quality means at least 320 kbps and more.

Every record from your stations is only "demo version" of this music. Good quality music everyones buying in store. this does not justify streamripping. If you rip a very popular station and take slots away from active listeners then you need to be banned. That's that.

KiwiPatriot2000

20th May 2004, 20:08

this person ripped about 9 hours of my programming - got suspicious 10 mins ago, i stopped the program, started it up again - and woolah!!!(i'm hoping this ip address was ripping)

************************************************************ SHOUTcast Distributed Network Audio Server
** Copyright (C) 1998-2004 Nullsoft, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
** Use "sc_serv filename.ini" to specify an ini file.
************************************************************
Event log:
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [SHOUTcast] DNAS/win32 v1.9.4 (Mar 17 2004) starting up...
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] loaded config from C:\Program Files\SHOUTcast\sc_serv.ini
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] initializing (usermax:5 portbase:8000)...
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] No ban file found (sc_serv.ban)
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] No rip file found (sc_serv.rip)
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] opening source socket
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] source thread starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] opening client socket
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] Client Stream thread [0] starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] client main thread starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [source] listening for connection on port 8001
<05/23/04@16:10:26> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/23/04@16:10:28> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting

onekit

20th May 2004, 20:32

Originally posted by KXRM
this does not justify streamripping. If you rip a very popular station and take slots away from active listeners then you need to be banned. That's that.

You said "ACTIVE LISTENER". What different between ACTIVE LISTENER and LISTENER who save in mp3 simultaneously (at the same time)?
In these both cases we have only one connection. Only one busy slot.

Your ACTIVE LISTENER can be passive and going down to minimal sound volume (you don't know), but user with ripper can listen radio and at the same time save to mp3. And this user can be really big lover of your station. He love your station, that because he save it to mp3.

P.S.: Sorry for software names and titles. I do not obtain goal get advertise here. I just want to know why ripping software do not like station-owners.

Jay

20th May 2004, 20:37

well now you know why, we hate ripping software, and most of it is not active at all, just some program setup to archive the stream. Now the only time I would agree with you is if a person runs a talk show or other original programming, but any music station that get's ripped is being ripped for the pure purpose of having the music to trade on p2p, or to skip having to buy the Music legitamately. Personally I no longer care, I have setup my station specifically with the idea that you aren't going to rip it without getting garbage in your saves.

onekit

20th May 2004, 21:06

2KXRM:

Thank you.

As you see, comrade - everything depends on man.
If that honest man, then he be honest man.
And he will do not rip audio for p2p trading.
But if this dishonest man, he don't need special ripping software. He will record it using standard windows accessories from standard Stereo Mixer.

Software is not guilty.

All of your hates of ripping software like iRadio is only to people. But not exactly to software.

Jay

20th May 2004, 21:28

well the problem is that those software help those who hurt us. Especially when they forge information.

KiwiPatriot2000

21st May 2004, 01:12

Hey KXRM - sorry for being a pain bro, everytime I start the station, the ip keeps trying to connect:

<05/20/04@21:12:46> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/20/04@21:12:47> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/20/04@21:12:49> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting

How do I get rid of this?

Thanking you for your advice.

MegaRock

21st May 2004, 06:23

Log into the admin panel of the Shoutcast DNAS server and ban the IP. What you're seeing isn't really a big deal, it just shows someone is trying to connect and your stream isn't up yet. Even after banning them they may continue to attempt to connect for awhile but eventually they will go away.

If it's a major deal I'd advise in both banning the IP in the server and change the active port although this move would effect other listeners as well until they get used to the new port.

KiwiPatriot2000

21st May 2004, 13:46

Thanx Rob - when somebody listens for nearly 12 hours must be either a Classic Rock Junkie, or is ripping the Program.
(anti - "streamripping")....i know I'm really powerless to do anything about it.

Thanx for your advice!

Jay

21st May 2004, 17:50

there really is no behavioral science to it, you would be surprised at some of the reasons people could be listening that long.

jwhalen

21st May 2004, 18:38

i have people that listen from the minute they get to work till the time they leave

only to tune back in when they get home and leave it playing

love those kinda listeners

KiwiPatriot2000

21st May 2004, 20:41

That's true - thanx to all for your replys.:D

yesman567

24th May 2004, 02:46

Ok seriously, we are getting this music for free anyway, so what is the difference if I listen to it now or half an hour later after I have "ripped" it while I was gone? It's nothing illegal in any way, because it's not like I'm going and selling it for a profit, or that I'm getting anything for free that I shouldn't (i.e. The music is already there, I'm just listening to it at a later time)
This whole debate just stems from everyone who downloads music illegally and burn it to CD's or whatever. I would feel no guilt whatsoever if I "ripped" a half an hour of music from a shoutcast station and then listened to it later.

MegaRock

24th May 2004, 03:26

Originally posted by yesman567
Ok seriously, we are getting this music for free anyway,

I wish.

Vchat20

24th May 2004, 03:28

take our word for it. streamripping is illegal (depending on the music being broadcasted), immoral and just plain wrong.

OTR4ME

24th May 2004, 22:02

Originally posted by Vchat20
take our word for it. streamripping is illegal (depending on the music being broadcasted), immoral and just plain wrong.

Talking about just plain wrong!!! I can only support a few connections, usually just 3 so I have some bandwidth leftover for me... and I just caught someone eating ALL 3 of my SLots!!!!! he had 3 different client s/w connected.

Name: ool-182eedfa.dyn.optonline.net
Address: 24.46.237.250

Ban him from your servers for the next hour!!!! I know He'll just reboot. This is like the 5th time I've had a streamripper from the optonline.net

Check this out... they offer "free custom radio"

http://www.optonline.net/Registration?referer=%2Ffreeradio&domain=%2Ffreeradio

:mad: Bob :mad:

ujay

24th May 2004, 22:42

yesman567 - :up:

If all you require is a time shift, can I suggest you use an output recorder instead. This doesn't use up extra slots and upset the small guys and doesn't create any arguments.
I mainly use this for stations that don't send track info so I can pick it up from the DJ.

UJ

yesman567

25th May 2004, 00:29

Haha I don't even streamrip, I just think it's dumb that these people think its sooo wrong... I AM getting this music for free anyway, and if you're paying for it, you're getting screwed over my friend... Shoutcast stations are free.
But what would the difference by between an output recorder and a program that records the stream directly? It's not like a program should need more than one connection to pick up a stream, so unless I'm mistaken, it wouldn't make much of a difference...
And as for the immoral claim... That is completely subjective to who you're talking to. I personally see no way that anyone is losing anything from someone recording and then playing later, so don't tell me what's right and wrong. The world is going to hell anyway, why not take it while you can? ;-)

jwhalen

25th May 2004, 02:51

what an idiot.

OTR4ME

25th May 2004, 09:23

Originally posted by yesman567
Haha I don't even streamrip, I just think it's dumb that these people think its sooo wrong... I AM getting this music for free anyway, and if you're paying for it, you're getting screwed over my friend... Shoutcast stations are free.

You miss the entire point. I could careless if somebody was recording for listening later... but to use 2 or 3 connections to do this is wrong.

AND I do have to pay for my content. OTR programming at decent quality is not free. I recently paid $70 to have an old 16" transcription disc cleaned up and tranferred to CD, so I could add it to my playlist. Normally I'm spending $15 to $20/month to add programs.

NOR is running a ShoutCast station free. The software is free... but there is the time and energy put into running a station. I spent 4 hours Sunday editing id3 tags so they would have a consistent look.

onekit

25th May 2004, 21:28

I guess you meant 2 kinds of rippers.

1. Ripper - machine.
2. Ripper and listener at the same time.

Stream ripping is not illegal if you keep it on your HDD and do not copy anywhere.

I think that type "2" of rippers is not bad for radio stations owners. But type "1" is real enemy.

Jay

25th May 2004, 21:30

either way we can't distinguish the difference at the server because they use the same software typically. This is likely due to the fact that they are uninformed about just how bad they are being by using the poorly designed software.

Vchat20

25th May 2004, 21:44

if you are hellbent on ripping streams, just ask the station manager if you can rip their station. of course, most will say no, but their are a random few that will let you rip it no problem.

ProFM

25th May 2004, 22:11

I get e-mails from people telling me that the rip my stream to burn it on cd and listen to that in their cars...
They say: in this case i'm able to listen to your station allways...

So what's good and what's not...you hardly can control that.As long as nobody rips my stream to use my music to drive his own station or sell it, i think it's not a big problem.I'll make it harder to use pro automation software so the music crossfades,and add voiceovers and sweepers into the playlist.

yesman567

26th May 2004, 02:08

Alright, does anyone listen at ALL here? I AM NOT a station owner, I WAS NOT referring to running a station, and I DON'T DOUBT that you have to pay for the music... BUT I DON'T! I was saying that *I* will get it for free either way, so what's the difference if I listen to it now or later? I frankly do not care how much you spend on music and/or operating costs as long as I don't have to pay for it. That is all that I meant by "Free"
Now, like I said, I DO NOT "streamrip" and I don't really have anything I NEED to listen to later, I am just wondering how saving a stream is any different from listening to the station in realtime.
And I am glad I never listen to any of your stations, you all don't deserve listeners for being so damn bitter.

Vchat20

26th May 2004, 02:15

problem is, its more or less based on trust. sure some people will save it and listen to it later in a legit manner. but you dont know that. you dont live with them. theres quite a number of people out there who will rip it and either share it on numerous p2p's, sell it, etc..

so alot of station owners just play it safe and ban any rippers that come along.

OTR4ME

27th May 2004, 12:32

I take issue with guys who connect like this... tying up 2 slots. I went thru my logs and he was using combinations of RealAudio/jetAudio and WinAMP2.9/JetAudio near simultaneously for several days:

<05/24/04@17:07:00> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 5)[L: 2]{A: jetAudio}(P: 1)
<05/24/04@17:07:15> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 6)[L: 3]{A: WinampMPEG/2.9}(P: 2)
<05/24/04@17:11:06> [dest: 24.46.237.250] connection closed (245 seconds) (UID: 5)[L: 2]{Bytes: 992499}(P: 1)
<05/24/04@17:11:06> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 7)[L: 3]{A: jetAudio}(P: 3)
<05/24/04@17:11:56> [dest: 24.46.237.250] service full, disconnecting
<05/24/04@17:12:10> [dest: 24.46.237.250] connection closed (65 seconds) (UID: 7)[L: 2]{Bytes: 81920}(P: 3)
<05/24/04@17:12:12> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 9)[L: 3]{A: jetAudio}(P: 1)

feelo24

29th May 2004, 00:39

I agree, these guys that take up two and three slots are just plain selfish. I have had people rip my streams and they switch from my two different bit rates. Let's be honest, all of us who run our stations care about the music we play, and the content that is in our station. We take pride in setting up our broadcasts so that listeners will enjoy our broadcast. If you want to rip the stream then why not just go to Kazzaa or Limewire and download it that way instead of taking up slots that belong to real listeners. Let me put it in terms some of you that think this is o.k. to do will understand. If you personally take the time and effort to create a business, a niche and you are doing well, and someone comes in one night breaks into your office and steals your plans, wouldn't you feel violated? Especially when a few months later they start up the same business and cut in to your customer base!

DerbyJunglist

29th May 2004, 19:02

I own a station, and dont have a problem with people streamripping - i always notice people doing it - and if people want to listen to a show at a later time, like if they go out, then whats the problem? And if people do share the shows on kazaa, then who cares as long as they are not making a profit from our work?
However, I cant understand why people would need to take up 3 slots - this would annoy me, but its not exactly hard to ban an IP.

---
http://ukbassradio.co.uk

ProFM

29th May 2004, 19:10

I can understand that your not happy when you run a small station with limited slots when people take out 2 slots or more.
Luckily i don't have bandwith problems so for me it's not a big issue right now.However,when there comes a time in the future when all slots (i hope) are filled,i sure will be a little more selective.

HiddenPlanet

4th June 2004, 19:16

I had a guy ripping me the other night. I actually don't mind it, because I still have a ton of vacant slots, and if they wanna rip some of the best unsigned bands in the world, I along with the bands encourage it. I did notice something though. They appear to take up 2 slots, 1 unique. So, if you are concerned about ripping, and can't see a streamripper present on the DNAS log, just look to see if the number of unique listeners is the same as the actual total listeners. That's probably an indication of a streamripper......or someone that likes to load 2 versions of the same stream just to hear it echo....LOL. :blah:

128k (http://64.62.252.134:3112/listen.pls) 24k (http://64.62.252.134:3114/listen.pls)

ProFM

4th June 2004, 19:28

Last night i had somebody taking 4 slots at the same time.......what are those guys doing??? ripping that show 4 times??? weird...:)

MegaRock

7th June 2004, 21:13

I've noticed this alot but I think it's errant connections not stream rippers. I say this because I notice it from ISP's running proxy servers alot and also from major corporations that I know wouldn't have workers stream ripping on a daily basis.

Usually I just kick any of the extra connections and they don't usually reconnect. A ripper usually reconnect and also in some cases your log files will show the ripper program.

urbansoulnation

7th June 2004, 21:33

Hey they are quite a few people who have a LAN at home. And at work...they will tell their co workers about the station and they log on. Hence the multiple connections. So be careful with kicking people. You may be kicking potential fans.

John_Shumate

7th June 2004, 21:35

I really don't see that much of a problem as its just like me taping a TV show of something of that sort.

If ya ask me, the RIAA Should focus on the people that stream rip streams rather than the broadcasters. Maybe, we wouldn't be troubled by royalities.

MegaRock

7th June 2004, 21:37

Usually there is little harm in it. Since the connect either through the Shoutcast generated playlist or the playlist on my site if they get bumped they just connect immediately to another server and rarely even hear a blip. if it's an unused connection it goes away.

I do see what you're saying and hopefully it don't mess up too many people but it's either that or I have to institute a max 3 hour connection to keep dead connections from hogging up resources and this solution seems easier to deal with.

I really don't see that much of a problem as its just like me taping a TV show of something of that sort.

Indeed and since I crossfade my tracks they can't rip a single song and if they did it's only at 56k so the quality is only as good as FM.

John_Shumate

8th June 2004, 03:22

Well..I use to do that but, now I'm upgrading to 128k. So, I'll just do more crossfading so the streamripper can't tell the difference beteween songs.

SAM2 Was worth the $199 :)

MegaRock

8th June 2004, 09:22

Indeed.

I think I'd go to 128 faster if it seemed the listeners wanted it. I tried it a few times and the listener numbers actually dropped so for the time being I'm good with what I run (not to mention it's cheaper).

All in time I guess. For now it was enough to pay to cover my ass on all the royalties. Now that I'm legit they can lick my hairy ones and I cam move on to better things.

And yes, SAM2 kicks the shinizzle.

John_Shumate

8th June 2004, 09:45

and how much do you pay in rolalties exactly?

praktikal

8th June 2004, 15:00

I've used a stream ripper to record streams AND burned them to CD.

I did so because the office frowned upon streaming all day, so I listened to the CD's at work.

However, I looked around and read up on the rippers and although the one I used had the option, I don't make the ripper appear as a winamp listener, so it probably does get logged as a ripper. However, there is also an option that specifically mentions that if toggled off, it will use one slot to rip AND another to actually stream the music to winamp. I made sure to cause as little bandwidth leeching possible by having this toggled on so I use up only 1 slot.

Although I don't need to do this anymore because my current employer doesn't mind if I listen to streams during work, I never had a problem in doing this as I didn't feel I was ripping any artists off nor was I profiting from it nor was I keeping anyone else from enjoying the stream.

Recently the streams are crap and keep disconnecting, timing out and rebuffering so I feel the impulse to go back to old habits, but I'll stick to listening to my CD's for now.

Just my 0.02$ ... even if I am a Shoutcast forum noob.

MegaRock

8th June 2004, 17:41

Originally posted by John_Shumate
and how much do you pay in rolalties exactly?

A base of $250.00 to ASCAP, BMI and SESAC and $2,000.00 to SoundExchange plus a percentage of profits if they exceed a certian level which of course varies from quarter to quarter.

embed68k

18th April 2005, 03:28

Why use a stream ripping program that sends out an ID. If you just record your WAVE master device through a third party program nobody will know that you are "ripping" the stream.

Germ

18th April 2005, 11:46

Wow, thanks for dragging up this old thread to give us stream ripping advice.

THEMIXTURE

18th April 2005, 12:02

I am not shure about anyone else but I know I hate people that stream rip. Look people that are real broadcasters do not need people steal from there hard work. When it comes to my station I think I have it down pretty good on looking out for stream rippers. If you want music that bad why not just go buy it it would be better then stealing.

soulful1

18th April 2005, 12:27

Amen!

overXposure

13th July 2005, 19:11

I cannot believe that as old as this thread is that NOBODY argued the true depth of who gets ripped off by stream rippers. The station programmers argue about their work (which is in and of itself intellectual property), the stream rippers argue their integrity and "rights". Fact of the matter is it is all about the artist. Without the artist, we station programmers would have no stations to run and the streamripping douchebags would have no impetus to record our stations or to try and circumvent our efforts to thwart them.

I love music with an obsession and I sympethize with the artist who does not get paid for their work. I cannot believe how quickly some of the best albums go out of print these days. The rigors of funding, marketing, promoting and releasing an album AND to keep a frigging day job AND you streamripping jerks sleep well at night calling yourselves "fans" of these artists, like you're doing the artist some kind of favor by taking interest? You think the people who make the music you steal are all rich? Most are not - EVEN those wankers who get all decked out in their videos with luxury cars and jewelry (yeah, you KNOW what I'm sayin'). How would YOU like working your ass off all the time only to be told "yah, you did great work, you've made our lives a whole lot better and we love you dearly but tough shit, you're not getting paid."

I had a fan of my own station alert me in November 2004 to some punk who had ripped a bunch of material over an extended period of time and was posting the resulting mp3's as a series of compilations on Usenet to his own credit, of course. (I run highly distinguishable stream titles, BTW) By the time I caught him, he was on volume 13 of his series. Is that right? Not only am I being ripped off, but the artists were all being ripped off much bigger. :mad:

And to that guy earlier in the thread who was developing a streamripping tool - I see that you only give a free 14-day trial, how would you like it if someone cracked it and started passing it around? Wouldn't you feel ripped off - kind of like an artist whose music is being given away by so-called "fans" at an exponential reproduction rate? BTW: I tried out your tool for a few minutes on my station and got a good laugh. :D

So to you streamrippers - you like them golden eggs? Feed the geese! Keep the stations running by supporting them and BUY THE ARTISTS' WORK!

iasanders

9th November 2005, 03:48

In the beginning you paid a scribner to scribe a book for you, each book may take 6 months to scribe and the common people couldnt afford to learn to read or write.

Once the printing press was invented the price for a book dropped to 1/20th its previous price, newspapers were born and the common people learned to read and become educated. Scribners lost there jobs or had to learn a new technology.

How much did television change the newspaper business, how has VCRs, DVDs, changed how we watch Television?

Is the internet delivery of Music, Television, or Film all that different from the changes brought about by the printing press, radio, broadcast telivision?

The business model will adapt to the technology, you dont see very many scribners (copy machines), but writers (the artist) are still in business. Content is King!

Cheers,

dotme

9th November 2005, 03:55

Originally posted by Germ
Wow, thanks for dragging up this old thread...
...again

overXposure

9th November 2005, 05:18

WTF does this have to do with streamripping? Why don't you try reading from the *beginning* of a thread before responding to one if you're such a booksmart noob!

Originally posted by iasanders
In the beginning you paid a scribner to scribe a book for you, each book may take 6 months to scribe and the common people couldnt afford to learn to read or write.

Once the printing press was invented the price for a book dropped to 1/20th its previous price, newspapers were born and the common people learned to read and become educated. Scribners lost there jobs or had to learn a new technology.

How much did television change the newspaper business, how has VCRs, DVDs, changed how we watch Television?

Is the internet delivery of Music, Television, or Film all that different from the changes brought about by the printing press, radio, broadcast telivision?

The business model will adapt to the technology, you dont see very many scribners (copy machines), but writers (the artist) are still in business. Content is King!

Cheers,

DJ Matt

9th November 2005, 05:51

The latest SAM3 release includes a PAL script that changes your title to a list of banner messages during tracks to thwart stream rippers. I don't care if they rip to listen offline, I want the people who are trying to steal songs by an automated streamripper to stop...

soulful1

10th November 2005, 00:42

Hello DJmatt, I have Sams 3.1.8 Where might I find that script? Is this version too old?

overXposure

10th November 2005, 00:53

Originally posted by soulful1
I have Sams 3.1.8 Where might I find that script? Is this version too old?

Actually SAM3 (or any subrelease) does not include any scripts at all. You may find the purported script by searching the vendor's forums. There you might also find any necessary support for it if you decide to implement it. SAM3's proprietery language is VERY klugy and its logical constructs are diminished.

soulful1

10th November 2005, 01:01

Thanks overXposure.

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 01:15

You'll find several useful scripts in the PAL subdirectory inside the SAM3 folder.

Overxposure is full of shit too by the way.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 01:27

Originally posted by DJ Matt
You'll find several useful scripts in the PAL subdirectory inside the SAM3 folder.

Overxposure is full of shit too by the way.

You bet, I'm totally full of shit. SAM3 comes complete with every Festerbot ever written. Just ask the cowboys on the SAM3 forums...or just ask DJ Matt for some helpful and polite guidance. We're all on these forums just to be asses anyhow, right Matt? But in case your copy of SAM3 does NOT come with those Festerbots you find in the forums, just look for the script called EXAMPLE.PAL. You'll know which one because it is the ONLY one in the PAL folder.

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 01:40

Here's what the SAM3 download will install:

Example.PAL
KickSource.PAL
LinerOverlay.PAL
RemoteShow.PAL
SQL.PAL
TitleStreamBanners.PAL

Now go piss off Overxposure, it's obvious you're clueless and not using SAM.

soulful1

10th November 2005, 01:51

Thanks DJMatt. Didn't mean to start a feud.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 01:55

Originally posted by DJ Matt

Now go piss off Overxposure, it's obvious you're clueless and not using SAM. [/B]

Even though I took in two Web Radio Awards this year with MY station which is NOT REALLY driven by SAM3, I just want you all to think that it IS because it makes us all so frigging warm and fuzzy.

DJ Matt is the expert. Just listen to what he says. Even if he's a troll.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 01:57

Originally posted by soulful1
Thanks DJMatt. Didn't mean to start a feud.

No, Matt started the feud. Must be his Irritable Male Syndrome getting the best of him and making a troll out of him. Better cut out the Mountain Dew, Matt kiddo.

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 01:57

Yeah lovely award, I supposed they give you that for using MP3Pro, you're a moron

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 01:58

Total Posts: 8 (0.01 posts per day)

Wow registered for 2 years and saying almost nothing, aren't you just useless.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 02:31

Originally posted by DJ Matt
Total Posts: 8 (0.01 posts per day)

Wow registered for 2 years and saying almost nothing, aren't you just useless.

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato

Guess this explains the unwarranted mudslinging from DJ Matt. It must take ALL your time being a troll. If I was truly useful myself, maybe I would be on these forums doing the same instead of running an award-winning radio station.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 02:36

Originally posted by DJ Matt
Yeah lovely award, I supposed they give you that for using MP3Pro, you're a moron

Yea, all of the awardees were mp3PRO streaming morons like me. Right. But I'm an even bigger moron than any of them, I guess, for cutting my bandwidth costs and at the same time giving my listeners a MAXIMUM bitrate stream equivalent to 224-256kbps in classic MP3. In fact, four Bang & Olufsen dealers are so impressed with my moronic mp3PRO production that they play it in their showrooms and demonstrate their equipment with it. And you know Matt, the morons that buy B&O equipment pay more than you earn in a year for these things. But that ain't just the half of my stupidity.

And BTW: I'll be even dumber when the new AAC+ plugin comes out for SAM3 and I will actually pretend to install it on my imaginary deployment of SAM3.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 02:41

Okay, sorry folks for feeding the troll. But one thing case-in-point that helps in deterring streamrippers is streaming at a lower bitrate. I guarantee that I would require more listener slots like some of the larger stations streaming at 128kbps not because my station is mp3PRO but more to do with the minimum bitrate of choice of the streamripping community - obviously, they will hog your listener slots! I cannot tell you how many would-be streamrippers have complained about the 96kbps bitrate - or even of the lower bitrate streams that I once offered.

If you can, go with something like a 48 or 56kbps AAC+ stream, now that modern versions of Winamp and iTunes support it. Believe it or not, XM Radio uses this codec and it's no wonder why (and guess what, it came from the same folks who developed mp3PRO yet is even MORE efficient). Most streamrippers will simply pass you by and save you the effort of having to thwart their efforts anyhow!

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 02:43

Award winning, PFFTT. you only have 470 slots...

overXposure

10th November 2005, 02:44

Originally posted by DJ Matt
Award winning, PFFTT. you only have 470 slots...

Ain't life grand!

Be my guest to occupy one of those listener slots sometime. Maybe you will chill the f**k out if you do! Or maybe male hormone therapy is what you need.... You sure seem to have a bad case if IMS!

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 03:09

This arguement has no point and isn't going anywhere positive, I have better things to do... A mod has been PMed to lock this topic.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 03:16

Originally posted by DJ Matt
This arguement has no point and isn't going anywhere positive, I have better things to do... A mod has been PMed to lock this topic.

Yeah, I know, you shouldn't have started an argument in the first place, what with all your rudeness, purility and unwarranted mudslinging. But then you couldn't resist because you have so much to say. Honestly, though, I do not really think that you with your streams should be so concerned with streamripping, that BEING the topic of this thread anyway.

DJ Matt

10th November 2005, 03:23

Listen here asshole, I don't appreciate people like you spouting off about software you don't know shit about.

soulful1

10th November 2005, 03:26

Enough already! I appreciate your help, but I mean to start all of this. These forums were friendly at one time.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 03:28

Originally posted by DJ Matt
Listen here asshole, I don't appreciate people like you spouting off about software you don't know shit about.

Yeah, well you certainly have MORE to prove than the fact that you have NO life (according to your signature)! Like I - or anyone else - cares!~

Just for the sake of trivia - does PAL support switch statements? How about "else if"? Know what a "for loop" is cochese - does PAL have that? Don't bother with the SAM3 technical reference - it's PAL documentation is only marginally helpful.

MegaRock

10th November 2005, 04:08

Originally posted by overXposure
just look for the script called EXAMPLE.PAL. You'll know which one because it is the ONLY one in the PAL folder.

Granted there aren't many included but Example.PAL is NOT the only scripts included in the install of SAM. These are also now included on a standard fresh install/upgrade:

kick source.pal
remote show.pal
title stream banners.pal
liner overlay.pal

The stream ripper script is however NOT a PAL script but a PHP script and can be downloaded from WebcasterU.Com and requires that you have PHP installed and running on your webserver and only works with one stream server ip/port at a time.

Sadly you'll never get useful information like this from the know-it-alls (they know who they are).

As far as streamrippers are concerned I ban them from all the HQ streams. If you want to rip my 24k stream feel free to.

Ok, back to the arguing.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 04:28

Thank you, MegaRock.

There is one big problem with banning every streamripper though - after your ban list gets to be about nine pages long, SHOUTCast will get the hiccups really badly and not hold a steady stream anymore. When that happens, the only remedy is to flush your ban list and what good is that?

The WebcasterU.com script is fantastic and I built a powerful application from its simple foundations. The main ingredient is not actually *banning* the streamrippers but *bouncing* them instead. You have your noticeable and typical streamrippers who use the usual clients to get on. That's the tip of the iceburg. However, many of these guys will come from European locales where dial-up is faster than ISDN and they will just come back the next day on a different IP address. Don't even bother trying to ban these guys, simply BOUNCE them every 30 seconds or so. If you examine the POST parameters of the SHOUTCast administrator and observe what the KICK command requires, you can begin to expand the WebcasterU.com script to do more than simply ban your usual suspects and get down to the fighting back the real phuckers. It is actually the *unusual* suspect that a webcaster concerned with streamripping needs to develop against. Since SHOUTCast has a bug with ban lists getting to be too long, just ban the guys who knowingly manipulate their user-agent info. Another useful tool in this combat is a PHP script Tom Pepper wrote that allows you to watch listener activity in real-time. Optimize it (sorry Tom!) and color-code user-agent info - even send mailers to yourself for previously unknown "agents" (while you're sleeping of course!) and you have the best grip on this possible.

I don't claim to "know it all" but I do have a lot of streamripping forums complaining about my methods and pissed off because I have dramatically narrowed their odds of being successful.

CraigF

10th November 2005, 10:46

wonderous. however, scripts filtering out user connects can be heavily taxing on large stations with lots of users. id agree that for small stations, apache could probably handle the load, but i wouldnt want to be proxying people off apache when i have an application designed for this anyway.

If you know networking (which you should do to run the shoutcast server apropriately imho), and you know php or asp, many different things are possible. nobody disputes that, and we've seen many streams come up with some rather creative ways to handle things. tom's old php scripts were just the tip of the iceburg, as anyone who has hacked "registered users" streams together will tell you. maybe in the future, when i have lots of time free i'll publish a bunch of scripts that people can use, but im not really in the mood for making this game easy.

also, your mention of dialup being faster than isdn amuses me.

please keep the flaming out of the thread, only i will win.

overXposure

10th November 2005, 14:39

Ah, yes, there is a type of dial-up in Europe that is more than twice as fast as what is available in the US and is faster than ISDN (Deutsch Telekom is one such provider). In fact, I have seen these guys many times a day effectively doubling up on my 96kbps stream (largely in effort to rip the stream) for more than a year.

Would love to see your scripts - or even your finer methods - someday.

CraigF

10th November 2005, 15:53

then it isnt dialup. prehaps adsl delivered in a dialup-like fashion (pppoe/dynamic ip addressing).

SpookyMommy

25th November 2005, 03:50

If I store a melody, words, aura of a song in MY brain is it a ripping?

Probably, yes.

And what would be to prevent it?

Modification of genome of human being in order to prevent to remember music?

What the brave new world would be!

!!! Imagine, to listen a song many times as if you listen it first time!!!!
===================================================
So let me just cite, "The world is going to hell anyway......"

CraigF

25th November 2005, 09:19

YOU SO FUNNY

jhuxter

29th October 2006, 10:23

Once upon a time you could record music from the radio to a thing called a "casette" - you could then listen to the "casette" on a thing called a "casette player" - not just the one it was recorded to - any one, belonging to anyone. People could make copies of the music to play in their car, or in their portable casette players, or at their friends' houses.

Now, we have a digital revolution in which when you buy the music, the distributor controls who can play the music and what kind of software they can play it on. If you subscribe to the more greedy services, you lose the right to play the music you've paid for if you don't keep up your subscription. And people here have the gall to say that recording a stream is immoral? I could tell you what is immoral, but it would talk too long.

Listen, if you don't want people to record what you are broadcasting, I suggest you stop broadcasting - see how that affects sales. And if running your station is too expensive, maybe it's you who's the sucker. Ever think of that?

soulful1

29th October 2006, 15:44

That's a pretty ignorant statement. I'm not even going to waste my time explaining the difference between a casette recording and a digital recording. Evetually you will figure it out.

dotme

29th October 2006, 17:50

Originally posted by jhuxter
...And people here have the gall to say that recording a stream is immoral?

No, you twat. It's illegal in the UK and the USA. Webcasters under the DMCA are obligated to take whatever measures are technically possible to stop nimrods like you from recording. It's posts like yours that help me stay motivated to make my station almost impossible to slice automatically. Thanks :)

jhuxter

29th October 2006, 19:20

"Twat" is it? Nice to see the art of civil discourse hasn't been lost. Be that as it may, this whole copy-protection racket is driven by "twats" who try to make money being middlemen - talentless opportunists who want to make money off the artists' efforts and creativity.

Streaming has made commision salesmen out of the lot of you. I'd rather give the artist themselves 80p for the right to download their music, provided they dont then try to tell me how or when or where I can play it. Like I said - if you are paying a record label for the right to promote their music, I think you've been had, big time.

Record labels and wannabe distributers - get twatted.
Long-live mySpace.

dotme

30th October 2006, 02:10

Originally posted by jhuxter
"Twat" is it? Nice to see the art of civil discourse hasn't been lost.
Originally posted by jhuxter
"And if running your station is too expensive, maybe it's you who's the sucker. Ever think of that?
Hey - call me a "sucker" and I'll call you a twat. Seems fair to me.

;)

I pay royalties because I have to. It's the law. Doesn't mean I love throwing money over to the RIAA every month. I know very little of it reaches the artist. But the same could be said about tax dollars and welfare recipients. Are you a tax dodger, or do you fork over the money?

Point is, I love music, and the ability to share it with others. But since the artists do the work, I'd prefer my listeners to go download music they like from iTunes, not "lift" it from my stream. At least the artists get *something* that way.

jhuxter

30th October 2006, 02:20

I promote good music via mySpace - it costs me nothing and I don't waste time trying to control people's lives. Fu*k the RIAA beaurocracy. But to each their own...

dotme

30th October 2006, 02:24

Fair enough. Depends on what you're in it for. What I do is just a hobby. Totally for fun, not profit. On a good month, I break even. But I'm having a blast, and most hobbies cost money. At least we both agree that music is king, the RIAA isn't, and we'll leave it at that.

jhuxter

30th October 2006, 02:26

Originally posted by dotme
Fair enough. Depends on what you're in it for. What I do is just a hobby. Totally for fun, not profit. On a good month, I break even. But I'm having a blast, and most hobbies cost money. At least we both agree that music is king, the RIAA isn't, and we'll leave it at that.

LOL! We all like a happy ending!
Peace...

CraigF

30th October 2006, 11:20

Oh sorry, i forgot we all supported the RIAA. I think you'll find that pretty much all of us here hate them, but what can you do?

fc*uk

3rd November 2006, 21:55

Originally posted by CraigF
Oh sorry, i forgot we all supported the RIAA. I think you'll find that pretty much all of us here hate them, but what can you do?

Option 1: cry your self to sleep every night

Option 2: Drink yourself to sleep every night

Option 3: Plot evil ways to torture the RIAA into doing only your will. However, you must NEVER actually carry these plans out. An attack on an orginization with its head as far up the government's ass as the RIAA's is is only going to end badly for you. So, be good and just amuse yourself with your thoughts.

laptophfx

25th March 2007, 12:02

These winamps 5.0, are they streamrippers? It looks like this
<03/25/07@08:59:00> [dest: 89.52.93.238] starting stream (UID: 41)[L: 1]{A: WinampMPEG/5.0}(P: 0)

sputnik radio

25th March 2007, 13:21

Originally posted by fc*uk
Option 1: cry your self to sleep every night

Option 2: Drink yourself to sleep every night

Option 3: Plot evil ways to torture the RIAA into doing only your will. However, you must NEVER actually carry these plans out. An attack on an orginization with its head as far up the government's ass as the RIAA's is is only going to end badly for you. So, be good and just amuse yourself with your thoughts.

I like to send them emails telling them how much "potential" money they are losing from people ripping music from digital radio and satellite TV