A.O.L.

[imuser1]

ahhh,

i just downloaded WinAmp and notice that the publisher of the application file is ahhhh, A-O-L, Inc. Is that like AOL as in America on Line ?

I am sure this is no news to most of you, but hell, if America on Line publishes WinAmp I am no better off then I would be with Windows Media Player from our friends Microsoft. Media giants; Corporate Amerika. Track my move, monitor your every keystroke, Corporate Corporate, more rights than a human being for god's sake. The World is my Onion Corporate. The anti thesis.

Tell me brother, am I mistaken.?

[Psythik]

Welcome to the forums.

[imuser1]

is that a yes ?

[mikm]

AOL has owned Nullsoft/Winamp since 2000 or so. Before that, it was developed/owned solely by Nullsoft.

Winamp has no tracking software installed at all. If you are truly paranoid, use a firewall to block all access requests ny Winamp.

There's no reason why you should avoid Winamp just because AOL owns it. Winamp, imo, is a very well-developed product. Its (former) developers worked to keep AOL from dictating everything.

Keep in mind that AOLTimeWarner owns many companies, and if you are so anti-aol, you have to give up all of these (http://www.cjr.org/tools/owners/timewarner.asp) and more.

If you want another media player: http://www.foobar2000.org/

[Phyltre]

Well, see, the thing is, WinAmp is not a product of the machinations of AOL. It's just been bought by them.

[imuser1]

thank you gentlemen.
i was simply taken aback. i agree with you comments and information; i am simply taken aback.

no paranoia particularly. i live my life despite the madness that bring the brave into the streets. thank the gods for youth. it IS their place to see the truth. knowing it is another matter; perhaps the task of we the older now. who would have thought, Winamp is now owned by AOL. God bless the nullsoft crew. they were (are) pretty cool huh ?

again, thanks.
the shock took me back there for awhile....
its like RELEASE without most of the words.

[Psythik]

Originally posted by imuser1
is that a yes ?


I just don't like it when people start asking questions about nullsoft without properly introducing themselves.

Don't listen to me though, I'm a hypocryte. :p

[imuser1]

major

if there is a problem it is mine. apologies.
hypocrite i believe, with an eye.
like i said, time flies, and nuffsoft packed up and moved on. its a shock.
i am happy for them.
no offense to PEOPLE of AOL either.
its the inhuman part of corporations that worry me.
they live, they breath, they grow, they die, they get stronger, like some movie, the world is a phantasia. Frankly, its a bit hard to take if you really try to take it. like swallowing a horse pill.
and i would not wish it to be any other way.

addendum:
happy to meet you, etal.
you know me now too.
life is good.

[Mattress]

hi!

[S-uper_T-oast]

I didn't know timewarner owned the atlanta braves...

[PrintScrn]

Originally posted by imuser1
ahhh,

i just downloaded WinAmp and notice that the publisher of the application file is ahhhh, A-O-L, Inc. Is that like AOL as in America on Line ?

I am sure this is no news to most of you, but hell, if America on Line publishes WinAmp I am no better off then I would be with Windows Media Player from our friends Microsoft. Media giants; Corporate Amerika. Track my move, monitor your every keystroke, Corporate Corporate, more rights than a human being for god's sake. The World is my Onion Corporate. The anti thesis.

Tell me brother, am I mistaken.?

yes. It is owned by AOL. Don't believe the people above me. Winamp is a horrible piece of software. It monitors your music genre habbits and your IP so it knows what mood your in, and in what location, and then AOL/TW adjusts is advertising in those areas accordingly. It also monitors what websites you visit while listning to Winamp so it knows what music to use when selling certain products.

The only way to stay safe is to disconnect from the internet all together and prepare you tinfoil hats.

[S-uper_T-oast]

Then buy my album and all your problems will disappear in a magical blue cloud of smoke. That's right, blue and magical.

[missyob]

Hi Ya imuser1 Welcome to the forums.

Yes Winamp is owed by AOL. However it is the best music player out there. AOL did not develop winamp hence it being such a great product! There is no spyware and it does not hog up your system resources. It is much better than windows media player.

I totally understand your concern about it being owned by AOL cuz they suck, however I reassure you that winamp is a wonderful product. I am not a technical person so you would have to ask the knowledgeable people around here for questions about plug-ins ect.... I just know I have been using winamp for a long time and my computer hasn't blown up because of it :)

Feel free to hang around here.

Have a great day!

~ Missy

[siebe83]

Originally posted by imuser1
major

if there is a problem it is mine. apologies.
hypocrite i believe, with an eye.
like i said, time flies, and nuffsoft packed up and moved on. its a shock.
i am happy for them.
no offense to PEOPLE of AOL either.
its the inhuman part of corporations that worry me.
they live, they breath, they grow, they die, they get stronger, like some movie, the world is a phantasia. Frankly, its a bit hard to take if you really try to take it. like swallowing a horse pill.
and i would not wish it to be any other way.

Ok, after all the optimistic posts in this thread, I will now put in some pessimism...
Sorry... :(

http://www.gedikian.com/2004/10/i-havent-forgotten-and-we-will-never.html
http://www.gedikian.com/2004/10/closing-of-chapter.html
(written by Steve, the former most senior employee at Nullsoft...)

And welcome to the forums! :)

[MonKeyRum]

yeah why does winamp ask to connect to the internet when I add certain playlist items?

I block it with my firewall, but think it's weird cause I chose to turn of the agent in the preferences

[siebe83]

Did you also turn of these options?

Prefs > General Preferences > 'Check for new versions of Winamp at startup'
Prefs > General Preferences > 'Allow Winamp to report anonymous usage statistics'
Prefs > Media Library > tab Library Options > 'Do not allow media to automatically switch to "Now Playing"'
Prefs > Media Library > tab Library Options > 'Display "Show Info" in media and album views'

That's all I can think of atm...

If you want to be entirely sure Winamp doesn't try to access the internet, select 'Not connected to the internet' under Internet Connection Settings (Prefs > General Preferences). Though in that case, Internet Radio/TV, etc. won't work either...

[whiteflip]

WinDude? Winamp does have its annonomys useage statistics. Who really knows how annonmys those statistics are? And what about the random net access spikes that occur when running Winamp? They MUST be spying on you! Better download Sonique or Foobar.

[imuser1]

siebe83

thank you for the links.
Note fellow readers where our friend here is living; out-side the USA. I found the following quote from one of the two articles siebe83 linked to (note. it is NOT in response the exchange here; it does address some of what is rumbling around in this post however):

"Before you go off and start hating AOL. Stop. One thing that everyone has to realize is that AOL is a machine, just like every other big corporation. It consumes smaller companies in order to absorb them and use them for technologies, expertise, patents, etc. Every acquisition leads to the destruction of the acquired identity and their products. It's inevitable."

Steve Gedikian
http://www.gedikian.com/2004/10/closing-of-chapter.html

I woke up the day after and felt a bit remorseful about starting such a ruckus. PLease, it is not personal; except to me. Winamp is a piece of software. The wonder and glory here is the story of Winamp. Steve called Winamp his baby. Everybody loved Wimamp because Winamp was born, nurtured, and grew up in a home of love. Then one day, for reasons that are as old and human as breathing and eating and shitting, Winamp was sold, indentured, and may or may not be the same after losing its loving home and becoming resident in a corporation and institutionalized.

The story here is lesson about life in this world. Read Steve's comments in the links provided by siebe83. A remarkable experience for one so young, as many of you appear to be. And hopefully wisdom follows.

Steve said don't hate AOL; I say do not ultimately become discouraged, bitter, or loose your ideals. Temper them with the maturity you will gain from winning, the pains of losing, and just being in this world. And be careful. There are energies at work, (forget where they come from, often from 'us') that are very powerful, beyound your control, and often employed in what appears to be a very reckless, narrow, and self serving manner. These forces are our creation also. WE decide how our creations will behave; for good or ill. They are under our control. But - and I do not use that word much - remember; "we, us, our" is the collective US. Take time to allow yourself to reflect but (there is that word again) don't allow youself to become morose, apathetic, or too angry. Have fun. Live. Help US.
thank you to all of you.

[ScorLibran]

Originally posted by mikm
If you want another media player: http://www.foobar2000.org/
foobar2000 is set to be purchased by Ahead Software, and Ahead Software already runs the reference forum hosting the fb2k forums: HydrogenAudio.org.

Know that nowadays almost any successful small company is already owned by (or will soon be purchased by) a large corporation.

If you dedicate your life to avoiding the products of large corporations you'll go through life naked, homeless and hungry.

There's one solution though: If you have unlimited means, you can have your home, cars, clothes, food, music players, and everything else you need produced specifically for you by independant producers you contract with. They'd also have to produce all the source components from scratch, as almost all of those otherwise would be coming from large corporations. It would be complicated, and very expensive, but it would be possible.

To have unlimited means, you'll need a strong financial plan. Perhaps you could start a company that becomes a large corporation and get rich enough to not have any affiliation with large corporations.

Wait.....nevermind. :confused:

[imuser1]

vicous circle what?

nothing wrong with big corps, money, or power. It is how it is used. Right now worldwides are sucking the life right out of the planet and everything on/in it. I quess they figure technology will provide an escape, at least for them and their families.

fine. i say we the people control them. let worldwides and government serve the people. what is that you say reader?. government serves itself and the worldwides you say. that's right they do. and you will not hear that from any active member of the democrat or republican party; they are two sides of the same coin. nader tries.

i'll trust my fate to the founding fathers, not one or two but the majesty that they created together. people think the revolution is over. hell it may be just because those that believe that don't want to hear or know that what we have still takes work, guts, blood, and votes. Franklin was quoted as saying to a woman who asked, "what kind of government have you given us sir?". "A republic madam", he replied,"IF you can hold on to it." Nuff said.

[JRSellers]

Originally posted by mikm
Keep in mind that AOLTimeWarner owns many companies, and if you are so anti-aol...

I'm anti-AOL, but not anti-:winamp:. It's a great little MP3 player. Not too shabby playing vidz either.

[siebe83]

imuser1:

Good you read the stuff! I think Steve has given some nice views on how things work behind the scenes. That's why I gave you the links.

I won't get into political/economical discussions here (I don't say you shouldn't, don't get me wrong), I will just give my views on this topic, though I don't have a lot to add...
Without AOL, Winamp wouldn't have gotten as far as it has now, I think. As mikm already pointed out, AOL has owned Nullsoft for quite some years now. This enabled Nullsoft to continue developing this great product. Without AOL, maybe Winamp would have been already dead 3 years ago. Maybe, maybe not, we'll never know...

Anyway, for me personally Winamp isn't dead. If Winamp 5 wouldn't exist, I would still be using Winamp 2, I think. Why wouldn't I still use this Winamp 5 version a few years from now? Other media players just don't do what I want them to do. Maybe foobar2000 comes close and will in the future...
Besides, as long as development of plugins will continue, Winamp will stay fresh and attractive to me. If new versions (forced by AOL) of Winamp don't please me, I'll just keep using 5.05 (or 5.06), just as I kept using 2.91 when Winamp3 came out.

[PrintScrn]

Originally posted by JRSellers
I'm anti-AOL, but not anti-:winamp:. It's a great little MP3 player. Not too shabby playing vidz either.
Well then your also anti:

Time Warner - Books
Time Warner Book Group
Warner Books
The Mysterious Press
Warner Vision
Warner Business Books
Aspect
Warner Faith
Warner Treasures
TW Kids
Little, Brown and Company
Little, Brown Adult Trade
Little, Brown Books for Young Readers
Back Bay
Bulfinch Press
Time Warner Book Group UK
Time Warner Audio Books

Time Inc.
Southern Progress Corporation
Sunset Books
Oxmoor House
Leisure Arts
Time Warner - Cable
HBO
CNN
CNN International
CNN en Espanol
CNN Headline News
CNN Airport Network
CNN fn
CNN Radio
CNN Interactive
Court TV (with Liberty Media)
Time Warner Cable
Road Runner
New York 1 News (24 hour news channel devoted only to NYC)
Kablevision (53.75% - cable television in Hungary)
In Demand
Metro Sports (Kansas City)
Time Warner Inc. - Film & TV Production/Distribution
Warner Bros.
Warner Bros. Studios
Warner Bros. Television (production)
The WB Television Network
Warner Bros. Television Animation
Hanna - Barbera Cartoons
Telepictures Production
Witt - Thomas Productions
Castle Rock Entertainment
Warner Home Video
Warner Bros. Domestic Pay - TV
Warner Bros. Domestic Television Distribution
Warner Bros. International Television Distribution
The Warner Channel (Latin America, Asia - Pacific, Australia, Germ.)
Warner Bros. International Theaters (owns/operates multiplex theaters in over 12 countries)
Time Warner Inc. - Magazines
Time
Time Asia
Time Atlantic
Time Canada
Time Latin America
Time South Pacific
Time Money
Time For Kids
Fortune
All You
Business 2.0
Life
Sports Illustrated
Sports Illustrated International
SI for Kids
Inside Stuff
Money
Your Company
Your Future
People
Who Weekly (Australian edition)
People en Español
Teen People
Entertainment Weekly
EW Metro
The Ticket
In Style
Southern Living
Progressive Farmer
Southern Accents
Cooking Light
The Parent Group
Parenting
Baby Talk
Baby on the Way
This Old House
Sunset
Sunset Garden Guide
The Health Publishing Group
Health
Hippocrates
Coastal Living
Weight Watchers
Real Simple
Asiaweek (Asian news weekly)
President (Japanese business monthly)
Dancyu (Japanese cooking)
Wallpaper (U.K.)
Field & Stream
Freeze
Golf Magazine
Outdoor Life
Popular Science
Salt Water Sportsman
Ski
Skiing Magazine
Skiing Trade News
SNAP
Snowboard Life
Ride BMX
Today's Homeowner
TransWorld Skateboarding
TransWorld Snowboarding
Verge
Yachting Magazine
Warp
American Express Publishing Corporation (partial ownership/management)
Travel & Leisure
Food & Wine
Your Company
Departures
SkyGuide

Magazines listed under Warner Brothers label
DC Comics
Vertigo
Paradox
Milestone
Mad Magazine
Online Services
CompuServe Interactive Services
AOL Instant Messenger
AOL.com portal
Digital City
AOL Europe
ICQ
The Knot, Inc. - wedding content (8 % with QVC 36% and Hummer
WinbladFunds18%)
MapQuest.com - pending regulatory approval
Spinner.com
Winamp
DrKoop.com (10%)
Legend (49% - Internet service in China)
Time Warner - Online/Other Publishing
Road Runner

Warner Publisher Services
Time Distribution Services
American Family Publishers (50%)
Pathfinder
Africana.com
Time Warner - Merchandise/Retail
Warner Bros. Consumer Products

Theme Parks
Warner Brothers Recreation Enterprises (owns/operates international theme parks)
Time Warner Inc. - Turner Entertainment

Entertainment Networks
TBS Superstation
Turner Network Television (TNT)
Turner South
Cartoon Network
Turner Classic Movies
Cartoon Network in Europe
Cartoon Network in Latin America
TNT & Cartoon Network in Asia/Pacific
Film Production
New Line Cinema
Fine Line Features

Turner Original Productions
Sports
Atlanta Braves

Other Operations
Turner Learning
CNN Newsroom (daily news program for classrooms)
Turner Adventure Learning (electronic field trips for schools)
Turner Home Satellite
Turner Network Sales

Other
Netscape Communications
Netscape Netcenter portal
AOL MovieFone
iAmaze
Amazon.com (partial)
Quack.com
Streetmail (partial)
Switchboard (6%)


http://www.cjr.org/tools/owners/timewarner.asp

[Schmeet]

How can Winamp be catergorized as a magazine? :confused:

[JRSellers]

Originally posted by PrintScrn
Well then your also anti:

....

So, just because I don't like one branch in the Time Warner tree, I have to cut down the whole tree.

I suppose I have to stop watching Smallville now. SHYAH, right.


Whut's a book? :D

[mark]

i use aol as an isp. they do what it says on the box.

[JRSellers]

Originally posted by nobbert
i use aol as an isp. they do what it says on the box.

Seeing as I'm SOL for DSL, I don't wish to pay 23 bucks a month when all I really need is a connection. I take care of everything else myself.

[Mattress]

how can anyone be anti-cartoon network. I now love AOL forever.

[JRSellers]

Originally posted by Mattress
how can anyone be anti-cartoon network. I now love AOL forever.

How is being anti-AOL make you anti-Cartoon Network?

[Mattress]

ask printscreen

[PrintScrn]

It follows the same principle as not using winamp because of it. Ask the threadstarter

[JRSellers]

Just because I don't like AOL doesn't mean I'll stop like Winamp. That kind of thinking is really immature.

[Jansemanden]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
foobar2000 is set to be purchased by Ahead Software, and Ahead Software already runs the reference forum hosting the fb2k forums: HydrogenAudio.org.

Why are you lying about something you know nothing about?
Foobar is not being bought by ahead.
Ahead is not hosting foobar forums nor HA forums.

I don't understand why you would so clearly lie.
Oh wait. The nature of trolls/trolling.

[DrO]

as posted here (http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?postid=1515337#post1515337) things on that matter have been clarified. i also read about it elsewhere from here but as now Nullsoft has been closed (despite 3 people still part of it) you can see how the internet rumour mill works.

and to be honest, without AOL we wouldn't be on these forums (who do you think provides the servers/bandwidth needed for it??)

-daz

[Germ]

foobar is something that would never be bought out because of the type of users it targets.

[Wolfgang]

who is that?

[inthegray]

Originally posted by Germ
foobar is something that would never be bought out because of the type of users it targets.

what are you trying to say?

(edited to make you wonder what used to be here before i edited this. doesn't it make you sad that you will never know?)

[Germ]

Elitists perhaps.
But really, it's targeted for advanced power users. Not the average everyday joe.

[inthegray]

Hmm.. Just noticed on here and other places that people are are accusing DrO and Scor for "trolling" against foobar. That's pretty funny considering they're both pretty sympathetic towards the player--Scor using foobar over winamp, and DrO considering of doing some plug-in work for the app as well.

[DrO]

i am a troll :)

hell, if that's so then why did i post this on betanews (i've highlighted the respective part of the comment) ...

Does it matter what player you use as long as it suits what you need? Fb2k is a decent program (i used it for a while myself) but it's not suited for everyone and trying to force feed it down people is not the way to go. Use what you want to use not what people make you use!-daz

[ShyShy]

This thread just shouts for a bit of chirpiness :D

[DrO]

damn women, you've found my baby photos :)

-daz

[JRSellers]

Good comment, DrO. :)I agree, and what suits my needs is Winamp and Crystal Player.

[ScorLibran]

Originally posted by Jansemanden
Why are you lying about something you know nothing about?
Foobar is not being bought by ahead.
Ahead is not hosting foobar forums nor HA forums.

I don't understand why you would so clearly lie.
Oh wait. The nature of trolls/trolling.
I only lie about things I *DO* know about! :blah:

But seriously, Ahead has vested financial interest in hydrogenaudio.org. Evidenced by the words of the founder and lead admin, themselves, discussing funds transactions from Ahead Software. I have no evidence that contradicts theirs, so I can only believe from legitimate sources that Ahead indeed does have a business involvement in HA.org.

Hydrogenaudio is a corporate holding. A single payment or expense reimbursement is all it takes to meet that definition. Being paid for by a corporation is nothing to take offense to or be insecure about, however. I work for a corporation, too, and am quite content. Whether reimbursed with money, cars or trips to Las Vegas, it all represents vested corporate interest in the entity reimbursed.

Since HA.org hosts foobar's forums, it would be more accurate to say that Ahead Software is invested in foobar2000's "parent organization".


(I do apologize for the trolling, however. I'm so new here, and generally mean and offensive the few times I do post. I should be nicer. And more frequent in my visits.)
:D

[JRSellers]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
I only lie about things I *DO* know about! :D

Seems logical. :p One cannot lie about a subject if one does not have knowledge of that subject.

[ScorLibran]

That's what I was thinking too. :)

[gaekwad2]

But if your statement falsely implies that you do have knowledge of it it could be classified as lying too. ;)

[picmixer]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
I only lie about things I *DO* know about! :blah:

But seriously, Ahead has vested financial interest in hydrogenaudio.org. Evidenced by the words of the founder and lead admin, themselves, discussing funds transactions from Ahead Software. I have no evidence that contradicts theirs, so I can only believe from legitimate sources that Ahead indeed does have a business involvement in HA.org.

Hydrogenaudio is a corporate holding. A single payment or expense reimbursement is all it takes to meet that definition. Being paid for by a corporation is nothing to take offense to or be insecure about, however. I work for a corporation, too, and am quite content. Whether reimbursed with money, cars or trips to Las Vegas, it all represents vested corporate interest in the entity reimbursed.

Since HA.org hosts foobar's forums, it would be more accurate to say that Ahead Software is invested in foobar2000's "parent organization".


Now I really wonder where you take your so called "evidence" from. As I have mentioned before, Ahead has indeed recruited a few competent people from HydrogenAudio to work for them. But hey, get used to it. Believe it or not, people that are active on internet forums, do have real life jobs. After all they have to pay the rent somehow and make a living

What is not true is that Ahead gives financial support to HydrogenAudio itself, nor does it get involved in it's affairs. And it certainly never has expressed any interest to get involved in the first place.

All of HydrogenAudio's hosting costs, etc. are covered by voluntary donations from it's users and by Dibrom (founder of HA) and this will continue to be so. Furthermore there is enough staff there that is entirely inependent from Ahead and would go into great upheaval if any desicions where taken in favour of Ahead software. Ahead receives the same treatment there that any other company, free software developer and so forth would receive.

After all I am pretty sure your employer also does not get involved in your Winamp forum activity.

I can assure you that both HydrogenAudio and FB2K are sure to stay independant from Ahead software as a whole. End of story.

Now maybe could you please stop spreading misinformation about these matters that apparently you know less about than you think you do.

Regards, picmixer (FB2K moderator)

[ScorLibran]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
Evidenced by the words of the founder and lead admin, themselves, discussing funds transactions from Ahead Software.

...

Whether reimbursed with money, cars or trips to Las Vegas, it all represents vested corporate interest in the entity reimbursed.

...

Since HA.org hosts foobar's forums, it would be more accurate to say that Ahead Software is invested in foobar2000's "parent organization".
These are all known items. How is it "news" if it's been admitted and then discussed into the ground for over a year?

And relax. There's no reason to be so afraid or insecure about being associated with corporate investment, no matter how associated you are. Take the money and build up yourself and/or your stuff. Darin and Juha do. We all do.

Welcome to the Big World™, amigo! ;)

[picmixer]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
These are all known items. How is it "news" if it's been admitted and then discussed into the ground for over a year?

These are not all known items and they certainly have not been discussed into the ground over the last year.
Originally posted by ScorLibran
And relax. There's no reason to be so afraid or insecure about being associated with corporate investment, no matter how associated you are. Take the money and build up yourself and/or your stuff. Darin and Juha do. We all do.

No there is indeed no reason to be afraid of corporate investment in this case, because there is none. I have no idea how you come up with the fact that Darin (Dibrom) is working for Ahead and getting money from them, because he is not. So maybe you could stop spreading such entire misinformation.
Originally posted by ScorLibran
Welcome to the Big World™, amigo! ;)
I am not entirely sure what you are trying to imply by this bold statement of yours.

Regards, picmixer (FB2K moderator)

[ScorLibran]

Old news: Darin's posted repeatedly about trade shows representing HA.org and Ahead Software, where his and Juha's (and Garf's, and others) expenses were paid for by the Nero Digital cost center of Ahead Software. Use a keyword search on hydrogenaudio.org forums.

Old news: Juha has posted repeatedly about visiting Las Vegas on Ahead's dime specifically for his involvement with hydrogenaudio.org. Use a keyword search on hydrogenaudio.org forums.

Other discussions (in confidence) have been off the forums, but equally (and often more) evident of the Ahead/HA.org/foobar2000 connection.

Corporate interest is like water...it spreads and touches everything in contact with it's target.

So Relax! Smile! Don't worry so much! You and your product don't have a reputation of corporate independence. You have a reputation of working with a top-shelf media player and a leading audio enthusiast community. Don't let it pain you so when it should be giving you joy.

Gaining corporate interest is a mark of success, like it or not. Nullsoft drew one of the largest corporations in the world in Time Warner - AOL. Hydrogenaudio.org and foobar2000 have drawn the interest of Ahead Software AG. Kudos...You made it! :)

[Germ]

Foobar people are too uptight

[Russ]

One of the central points in HydrogenAudio's philosophy is that it is independent. You have annoyed a lot of people by insinuating otherwise.

HA is funded entirely by user donations. If it was funded by Ahead, there wouldn't be any google ads for a start. Yes, HA moderators have other jobs, but they all believe that HA should remain independent and unbiased. You should know that.

Similarly foobar is still developed independently by Peter, and he has no plans to sell it.

Now I would appreciate it if you would stop spreading these incorrect rumours.

[Dibrom]

Originally posted by ScorLibran
foobar2000 is set to be purchased by Ahead Software, and Ahead Software already runs the reference forum hosting the fb2k forums: HydrogenAudio.org.

I only lie about things I *DO* know about!

But seriously, Ahead has vested financial interest in hydrogenaudio.org. Evidenced by the words of the founder and lead admin, themselves, discussing funds transactions from Ahead Software. I have no evidence that contradicts theirs, so I can only believe from legitimate sources that Ahead indeed does have a business involvement in HA.org.

Hydrogenaudio is a corporate holding. A single payment or expense reimbursement is all it takes to meet that definition.

Old news: Darin's posted repeatedly about trade shows representing HA.org and Ahead Software, where his and Juha's (and Garf's, and others) expenses were paid for by the Nero Digital cost center of Ahead Software. Use a keyword search on hydrogenaudio.org forums.

Old news: Juha has posted repeatedly about visiting Las Vegas on Ahead's dime specifically for his involvement with hydrogenaudio.org. Use a keyword search on hydrogenaudio.org forums.

Excuse me, but what the fuck are you talking about? So much bullshit and lies, I don't even know where to start.

First of all, HA is NOT owned by Ahead. If I were to have sold HA to someone else, quite simply I wouldn't be managing it anymore. For as much as I like HA, there are other more interesting things I'd be doing with my time if I didn't have that responsibility. And no, I wouldn't run a site for pay because I could make better money elsewhere. So that doesn't fly.

Second, you say that I've said that there have been financial transactions between Ahead and HA? Where? I challenge you to dig these up. Quite simply, you can't, because they don't exist. I've never taken a single cent from Ahead, and I've never said that I have anywhere either. Period. Yes, they paid for me to go to a trade show once. A single trade show that is, so me "posting repeatedly about trade shows" is more bullshit. Secondly, aside from a plane ticket and hotel costs (they bought these by the way -- they didn't send me the money to buy them, so even here I never got a cent from them), I paid for everything else on that trip out of my own pocket (food, transportation, etc.) and never asked for or received reimbursement (and that cost me a few hundred out of my own pocket). So the "corporate holding" bit doesn't fly either.

JohnV is another story, but guess what? He doesn't own HA. He doesn't pay for the hosting, and he doesn't manage the server either. He's also not the founder, and anymore, he's not even the lead admin. What he does is his own business, and although he's a valuable part of the HA team, and I respect him immensely as someone who has helped HA grow, him having a job with Ahead changes nothing.

So basically, this is all a bunch of FUD. No evidence (no quotes from me obviously because they don't exist), along with some flat out, blatant lies. If you want to try and discredit HA, that's fine, there are plenty of legitimate points one could criticize us on. But if that's your goal, you could at least be honest about it.. heh.

It sickens me to have to deal with this kind of nonsense on top of all of my HA concerns especially when I'm so busy with school right now that I barely have time for anything resembling a life (and that would include anything such as "working for Ahead... heh").

And about hosting costs, all of our costs are paid primarily by myself (as I look at the few thousand dollar bill for this year on our current host, and the fact that ads/donations this month probably won't even cover costs..) or by the few paltry donations we occassionally get, or by the google ads. For years, I've paid all of the costs out of my own pocket, and the only thing that has changed recently is that ads now help with that. Ahead has never paid for any of our costs, although they have offered to put an ad on our site in the past in exchange for money. I refused specifically because of the fact that I want HA to remain independent. So, for people who are wondering why I might be so upset, it is because of the fact that I specifically have tried (and succeeded so far) in keeping HA from turning into the kind of thing that ScorLibran is trolling about.

I hope this can put an end to the BS, but I suspect it probably won't.

Edit: And by the way, I apologize to the mods ahead of time. I just thought that people should hear something directly from me on the matter.

[Bilbo Baggins]

Go away and talk about this at HA.

[DrO]

i'd just say we lock this and call it a day on the matter. if the final word has come from Dibrom then i say that's things clarified.

if people are unhappy about the lockage then please pm me about it but after all the mis-information regarding this and also with regards to Winamp in the last week (which even i've been taken in by for the whole foobar thing and yes i've eaten humble pie on it) i think enough has now been said.

-daz