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-   -   Mom's eavesdropping violates Privacy Act (http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?t=201684)

ShyShy 10th December 2004 07:47

Mom's eavesdropping violates Privacy Act
 
Quote:

Mom's eavesdropping violates Privacy Act

06:06 PM PST on Thursday, December 9, 2004

Associated Press

SEATTLE - In a victory for rebellious teenagers everywhere, the state Supreme Court ruled Thursday that a mother violated Washington's privacy act by eavesdropping on her daughter's phone conversation.

Privacy advocates hailed the ruling.

The mother, however, was unrepentant.

"It's ridiculous! Kids have more rights than parents these days," said mom Carmen Dixon, 47, of Friday Harbor. "My daughter was out of control, and that was the only way I could get information and keep track of her. I did it all the time."

The Supreme Court ruled that Dixon's testimony against a friend of her daughter should not have been admitted in court because it was based on the intercepted conversation. The justices unanimously ordered a new trial for Oliver Christensen, who had been convicted of second-degree robbery in part due to Dixon's testimony.

The case started with a purse-snatching that shocked the island town of Friday Harbor, population 2,000. On Oct. 24, 2000, two young men knocked down an elderly woman, breaking her glasses, and stole her purse. Christensen, then 17, was a suspect.

San Juan County Sheriff Bill Cumming asked Dixon, whose daughter was friends with Christensen, to be alert for any possible evidence. When Christensen called the Dixon house later, Lacey Dixon, then 14, took the cordless phone into her bedroom and shut the door. Carmen Dixon hit the "speakerphone" button on the phone base and took notes on the conversation - in which Christensen said he knew where the purloined purse was.

The ruling will likely not result in parents being prosecuted for snooping, Cumming said. But it forbids courts and law enforcement from using the fruits of such snooping.

Federal wiretap law has been interpreted to allow parents to record their child's conversations. But Washington privacy law is stricter. Washington is one of 11 states that requires consent from all parties involved before a conversation may be intercepted or recorded.

"The Washington statute... tips the balance in favor of individual privacy at the expense of law enforcement's ability to gather evidence without a warrant," Justice Tom Chambers wrote in the unanimous opinion.

That right to individual privacy holds fast even when the individuals are teenagers, the court ruled.

"I don't think the state should be in the position of encouraging parents to act surreptitiously and eavesdrop on their children," agreed attorney Douglas Klunder, who filed a brief supporting Christensen on behalf of the American Civil Liberties Union.

He noted that parents can find other ways to control their teenagers: "They can restrict the use of the telephone, for example."

In an unrelated case, Carmen Dixon recently pleaded guilty to misappropriating $129,000 from the Postal Service when she was postmaster of Friday Harbor. She admitted in U.S. District Court that she issued money orders to herself and her family from bulk mailing fees and took money from stamp sales. The money was diverted between January 2002 and last May.

Dixon faces a maximum 10 years in prison and a $250,000 fine when she is sentenced April 1.

Lacey Dixon, now 18, graduated from high school and is attending a massage therapy school, her mother proudly reported.

Christensen's whereabouts are unknown, although Sheriff Cumming thought he might be in Alaska.

Dixon has a 15-year-old son still at home, whose phone conversations she sometimes secretly monitors. She said she'll have to stop that now.

"If it's illegal, I won't do it," she sighed.

The case is State of Washington v. Oliver Christensen, No. 74839-0.
http://www.king5.com/index.html
First of all, the daughter probably acted out to a point that the mom did feel it necessary to monitor phone calls. It's not uncommon.

But, then again, the lady has her own legal troubles to be worrying about.

*sighs* Only in America.

MegaRock 10th December 2004 09:17

Chalk up another law created by morons. I'm with the parent on this one - unruly kids have more power than their parents now.

zootm 10th December 2004 09:26

I'm gonna have to take the side of the privacy activists on this one.

electricmime 10th December 2004 09:34

is the law really saying its illegal to monitor your kids phone calls? or is it simply saying that things you pick up from those phone calls can not be used in court?

Mattress 10th December 2004 13:52

Electricmime, I gathered from the article that you wouldn't be able to use the info in court.

I'm against that decision. It was the mother's telephone line, she paid for the service, therefore she has a right to listen to all communications that travel over it.

zootm 10th December 2004 14:26

Yes, but should evidence found while deliberately spying on one's child be admissable in court?

Mattress 10th December 2004 14:46

if it's your phone line, then technically all communications transferred over it belong to you, so why shouldn't you be able to?

zootm 10th December 2004 15:45

Because, technically, the communications transferred over it do not belong to you. The line does. The communications are only of concern to you as a matter of it costing you money, for which your only recompense should be to restrict access to it.

Mattress 10th December 2004 16:52

eh, you could institute a terms of use policy for your phone line and then have your kids bound to it, since they aren't 18 yet you could sign it for them :P

zootm 10th December 2004 17:55

Sneaky, but legal :D

electricmime 10th December 2004 21:45

Quote:

Originally posted by Mattress
Electricmime, I gathered from the article that you wouldn't be able to use the info in court.

I'm against that decision. It was the mother's telephone line, she paid for the service, therefore she has a right to listen to all communications that travel over it.

but i thought she was using it against the person her child was talking to, not against her own child

if a company hears a conversation without either parties knowledge(especially the person who is not part of the company) are they allowed to use that in court?(im seriously asking, because im not sure.. but what is that little warning 'your call may be monitored or recorded' at the beginning whenever you call a company)

ShyShy 10th December 2004 22:58

It's different state by state, as noted in the Article, Washington has very strict guidlines about telephone privacy. Each party on that line must know that the phone call is being heard/recorded.

PrintScrn 11th December 2004 00:09

Quote:

Originally posted by zootm
I'm gonna have to take the side of the privacy activists on this one.
that's cause your an idiot.

;)

zootm 11th December 2004 00:14

Quote:

Originally posted by PrintScrn
that's cause your an idiot.

;)

Or, as we english-speakers write: "That's because you're an idiot."

Any parent who thinks that it is acceptable to listen on on their child's telephone calls and then bring what they hear up as testimony to court is more than deserving of the spite and distrust from their offspring that probably led to their being involved in the incidents being discussed.

PrintScrn 11th December 2004 00:35

Quote:

Originally posted by zootm
Or, as we english-speakers write: "That's because you're an idiot."

Any parent who thinks that it is acceptable to listen on on their child's telephone calls and then bring what they hear up as testimony to court is more than deserving of the spite and distrust from their offspring that probably led to their being involved in the incidents being discussed.

a) the ;) was added for a reason
b) it's the parents phone, service, house, etc. The kid can get over it. As long as your under 18, you don't have any rights.

bgesley 11th December 2004 01:21

Quote:

Originally posted by Mattress
Electricmime, I gathered from the article that you wouldn't be able to use the info in court.

I'm against that decision. It was the mother's telephone line, she paid for the service, therefore she has a right to listen to all communications that travel over it.

I'm not sure if thats a law anywhere, but if it is wouldn't that mean she has the right to read their email? Web-based and POP3, all IM conversations? And if its legal to read their email could it also be legal under that "law" for them to read their snail mail (postal mail) as well?

electricmime 11th December 2004 03:18

Quote:

Originally posted by bgesley
I'm not sure if thats a law anywhere, but if it is wouldn't that mean she has the right to read their email? Web-based and POP3, all IM conversations? And if its legal to read their email could it also be legal under that "law" for them to read their snail mail (postal mail) as well?
im not sure about this, because i dont use aol, but isnt that stupid commercial, where the women(who seems to care about the safety of her child, and yet hands the baby to a complete stranger to give her speech) stands on the table in the boardroom and yells that she wants access to their email, and 'internet report cards' and logs of their chat conversations basically saying that those are new features to aol?

if those are new features, then i would say its currently legal for parents to read through their childrens email/im conversations

zootm 11th December 2004 11:02

Quote:

Originally posted by PrintScrn
a) the ;) was added for a reason
Yeah, I caught that. If I'd thought it was serious, I'd probably have just ignored it. :)

Quote:

Originally posted by PrintScrn
b) it's the parents phone, service, house, etc. The kid can get over it. As long as your under 18, you don't have any rights.
Is that right? And can't you justify hitting your kid using that logic? Or refusing to feed them?

whiteflip 11th December 2004 20:40

The law/ruling doesn't make it illegal to ease drop on your children's phone conversations, just makes the evidence unadmissable in court. Listen away.

zootm 11th December 2004 22:12

I've kinda been trying to emphasise that, but not doing a very good job of it.

Omega X 12th December 2004 01:52

Why are people here so bent over this? whiteflip explained it perfectly.

AND personally If I had a child as unruly as she says she is, the rules in the house would remain strict until she cooperated. I.E. NO DAMN PHONE USE PERIOD...don't like it, tough.


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