Quote:
Originally Posted by rockouthippie
You have no frame of reference to make a similar appeal to an atheist. That's because being an atheist requires nothing of you. When you make yourself God, there are no rules..
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I would have to disagree, because I believe that not all people need the external motivation from a deity but could still get it from effective communities and their own understanding of what is good or bad for society. At the risk of getting attacked for saying this, it works for many types of animals. If you're looking for a reference when it comes to acting right, and you want to use a reference that atheists will accept, use any code of ethics. Such references tend to actually work well for both religious and non-religious.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockouthippie
"No one should be protected from the effects of his own stupidity."
That isn't exactly liberal is it?
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Correct in that it's not generally a liberal standpoint.
But, people who believe this as an all-the-time hard and fast rule are not looking at the big picture. You're not necessarily just protecting the stupid from their own stupidity; you're also protecting the non-stupid from the damage and side-effects caused by the stupid. When you analyze the effects of protection vs. non-protection using the scientific method or other acceptable data-gathering means (while making honest efforts to avoid bias), you will find that sometimes protection helps the overall group enough to make it worth it, and of course other times it's more of a waste. That's how I look at it, but that's more of a moderate leaning liberal standpoint.