OpenAVS (You have a better name?)

moltarx · 13th June 2003, 22:47

Ok, so i have been coding for a few days now on a language system similar to the one used in avs, and so far, i have one that accepts variable declerations, and does math n'such. I am going to hopefully add in the ability to write custom functions, and possibly look up pre-written functions this weekend. If anyone has any ideas on a name for this project, it would be greately appreciated, as I was thinking of posting my code on sourceforge.net soon (all you coders best get in gear, and help me

). I have some ideas of my own on how i would like to do the designing of presets etc.. in the new version, but am very open to suggestions. In the spirit of open source, i am also very happy to share around what i have written. Right now I am coding for the xmms system, but am writing it in a way that seperates core plugin code and pretty visualizer code in two seperate modules, that way we can hopefully have an easy time porting it to winders (yet another reason that i need some other developers on board with me). For the actual visualizer code, I was thinking that SDL would do a very nice job of rendering, and being free/portable. If anyone is interested, working in some OpenGL stuff would be a heck of a lot of fun too

Let me know if you are interested, cuz im gunna need help with this one

Wiser87 · 14th June 2003, 00:46

err... wrong forum (or sub-forum, or whatever...). This should go on the main AVS forum...

mikm · 14th June 2003, 01:30

i don't think you can use AVS in the name- copyright issues, plus it sounds cheap

UnConeD · 14th June 2003, 01:55

Did you write your own parser or use a generator? Is the code interpreted or compiled? Please post more details

.

moltarx · 14th June 2003, 07:59

Well, ive been coding a pascal compiler from scratch for a side project, and to take up less time, i used flex/bison to do quicker generaton of the language rules, and lexical analysis. Worked out pretty well

I hear there are ports for the winders, so if all goes well, this should be a damn portable project

I was thinking of compiling to an intermediate code format - still to be devised of course - but that would run a heck of a lot quicker than interpreting every time it loads any ideas UCD?

Currently it is very very interpreted... doesnt even translate into any sort of icode... so its way un-optimised, and needs some work... but i dont think that its going to be anything too major to get goin well.

Yathosho · 14th June 2003, 13:28

i thought of the names openvis or openviz, but actually both names were used for different projects already. coincidently openviz is an application from avs.com.

well there's been a lot of talk about this before and it never resulted in anything. so i'm hoping your doing better, although i can't judge if pascal is optimal for this task. other programming languages might ease cross-development, and i'd love to see osx, linux and windows supported, maybe even (Open)BeOS. many other operating systems might have better multimedia-capabilities than windows. iirc, jheriko was also interested in working on something like this. my suggestion is -since you sounded like you want to make it an open project- that you team up and register the project at sourceforge. this might attract other people as well to work on it. but then it really needs a name. of course it would be nice if this new visualization plugin would be in a way compatible to avs. i don't know about the legal situation here, but then again nullsoft built in that svp loader, which plays sonique visualizations, sonique is a product from lycos.

so, back to the name issue. remember that this can be anything (i.e. 'dog', 'house' etc.), it doesnt need to have this close association to the name of avs. if you still prefer this, think of OpenVS, OpenAV or IVS (independent vs)... whatever.

Zevensoft · 14th June 2003, 13:48

OpenVL - Open Visualization Language

Phaze1987 · 14th June 2003, 20:50

OpenVL sounds waaaaaaaaay to much like OpenGL.FreeVIS sounds nice to me.
http://www.google.com/search?q=freev...TF-8&hl=ro&lr=

moltarx · 14th June 2003, 21:49

Yeah, i like the sound of freevis a lot

The pascal thingie was just a pascal compiler that i was working o as practice in writing lexers/parsers/compilers in c/c++. This one has a lot more avs syntax like syntax, and is still written in c/c++, but hasn't taken nearly as long as i wrote it with flex and bison. Well, if no one has any objections, should we go with FreeVIS?

edit:
damn, i didnt click the link before i wrote that... does that mean that FreeVIS is out?

Phaze1987 · 14th June 2003, 23:11

NO way ! Its an eye clinic.We are eye doctors ! Plus,i dont think they have copyright on FreeVIS.

moltarx · 15th June 2003, 01:52

Maybe we should taunt them and have a big eye as our logo?

Well, i've run into a block. I can add in set functions like abs() etc... but im having a lot of trouble thinking of a way to store user functions. Any one have any ideas?

Zevensoft · 15th June 2003, 02:29

Use a call(functionname,param0,param1,...) method.

And store functions like:

code:


function fName, pVar0, pVar1, ...



end function

And you might want to have init,perframe,onbeat, and perpoint as functions too.

moltarx · 15th June 2003, 03:31

yeah, i was wondering what the data structure would look like though. do you think that a linked list would work? i'm expecting that some sort of frame work for developing functions in c/c++ will be done too...

Deamon · 15th June 2003, 12:04

How easy would everything be if Nullsoft would just give the source for AVS to us, and make it all open source...

Yathosho · 15th June 2003, 12:14

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaze1987
i dont think they have copyright on FreeVIS.

copyright and intellectual property are two pairs of shoes.

mquadrat · 15th June 2003, 12:52

FreeVis is a registered Trademark in Germany and is owned by LASIK Zentren GmbH, Mannheim. In the US there's a trademark FreeVision owned by CCCNetwork Systems Group Limited.

Hope that helps..

Yathosho · 15th June 2003, 12:57

mannheim, my birthplace

mquadrat · 15th June 2003, 13:02

Well I'm there from time to time. A Friend of mine lives there. But mhhh I think we're going off topic

[Ishan] · 15th June 2003, 14:40

How 'bout "FUTURE VIS" or "GRAND VIS"??

Phaze1987 · 15th June 2003, 16:04

Grand VIS sounds like porn.FutureVIS sounds pretty nice.
Suggestion : EyeDlite . Sounds like crap...

NemoOrange · 15th June 2003, 19:40

How about something like "Dilate"

v. intr.
To become wider or larger; expand.
To speak or write at great length on a subject; expatiate

stuff like "OpenViz" or "FreeFL" sounds boring.

Phaze1987 · 15th June 2003, 20:09

Dilate? o_O Sounds spooky,it might attract people.

moltarx · 15th June 2003, 20:31

yeah, i like the sound of dilate

as long as someone makes some sort of awesome preset involving an eye when its done...

[Ishan] · 16th June 2003, 05:36

Dilate sounds nice to me too.

shreyas_potnis · 16th June 2003, 07:29

OpenVL!

mquadrat · 16th June 2003, 07:54

Dilate sounds nice, but where's the connection to visualization?

And for the preset: If Dilate will be at least as powerful as AVS then an awesome preset with an eye, shouldn't be the problem

Yathosho · 16th June 2003, 07:58

i like it, sounds less boring than any abbreviation

Quote:

Originally posted by mquadrat
Dilate sounds nice, but where's the connection to visualization?

same for geiss, tripex...

it's about what we make out of it

mquadrat · 16th June 2003, 08:09

Mhh you're right.. Then I'm voting YES for Dilate.

Tuggummi · 16th June 2003, 08:33

Dilate gives an classy impression, i vote for that

And i agree that all those "openvis" "futurevis" "grandvis" "supervis" etc. those sound boring and rather childish...

[Ishan] · 16th June 2003, 09:00

Allright so its decided is it? DILATE!

Yathosho · 16th June 2003, 09:24

moltarx: you should get this registered at sourceforge then

Shock Value · 16th June 2003, 13:41

Dilate sounds good to me.

[Ishan] · 16th June 2003, 14:36

So approximately how much time would it take till we get to see "Dilate"??

moltarx · 16th June 2003, 15:26

Who knows, ill register it tonight, and hopefully get somewhere with coding support for user functions in the language part of it... but we still have the whole visualization part of it to go

Its just me right now (that i know of) and any help would definitly speed up development

Ill post the url of the sf.net project once i get it registered, so anyone that wants to can pull down the code, and start work

UnConeD · 16th June 2003, 17:23

I'm already building a vis though

. It'll just won't get worked on any further until I finish exams.

Might as well build one big, decent compiler rather. I can make it output assembly (and thus be as fast as any regular code) rather than be interpreted. Think about how it is layed out:
- Is it typed or untyped?
- Support for objects?
- Extensible?
- Event-driven or linear?

moltarx · 16th June 2003, 20:25

Are you going to have it generate assembly only for the routines that do math type functions? or just have it spit out a shared object or the like?

Also, what were you going to use for rendering your vis? I was going to try and go for a cross platform type thing, and use sdl to render, as that has been built for linux, winders etc. I thought that if we did it that way, we might be able to bring some new people into the community that were forced to oogle at presets made until then

UnConeD · 16th June 2003, 21:36

Currently using OpenGL in Windows, but I'm thinking of switching to SDL. I'll see, first I have to get a prototype working

;
I intend to make it compile completely to assembly.

moltarx · 16th June 2003, 21:53

well, if you are interested in someone to help you code on it, im happy to scrap what i have, and help with yours, otherwise, ill probably just work on this one

moltarx · 2nd August 2003, 08:51

Ok, I finally got my lazy ass around to registering the project on sourceforge. It's currently in review, and I should hear from them sometime on Monday about whether or not it was accepted.

moltarx · 4th August 2003, 15:52

There we have it

https://sourceforge.net/projects/dilate/

Im going to commit the code for the assembler (for the virtual machine) that I have already, although, I'm going to stop work on that for now, and design the virtual machine. If anyone is interested in helping out, get setup on sf.net, and send me an email

13th June 2003, 22:47	#1
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	OpenAVS (You have a better name?) Ok, so i have been coding for a few days now on a language system similar to the one used in avs, and so far, i have one that accepts variable declerations, and does math n'such. I am going to hopefully add in the ability to write custom functions, and possibly look up pre-written functions this weekend. If anyone has any ideas on a name for this project, it would be greately appreciated, as I was thinking of posting my code on sourceforge.net soon (all you coders best get in gear, and help me ). I have some ideas of my own on how i would like to do the designing of presets etc.. in the new version, but am very open to suggestions. In the spirit of open source, i am also very happy to share around what i have written. Right now I am coding for the xmms system, but am writing it in a way that seperates core plugin code and pretty visualizer code in two seperate modules, that way we can hopefully have an easy time porting it to winders (yet another reason that i need some other developers on board with me). For the actual visualizer code, I was thinking that SDL would do a very nice job of rendering, and being free/portable. If anyone is interested, working in some OpenGL stuff would be a heck of a lot of fun too Let me know if you are interested, cuz im gunna need help with this one

14th June 2003, 01:30	#3
mikm Major Dude Join Date: May 2001 Location: somewhere else Posts: 1,286	i don't think you can use AVS in the name- copyright issues, plus it sounds cheap powered by C₈H₁₀N₄O₂

14th June 2003, 13:28	#6
Yathosho Forum King Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AT-DE Posts: 3,366	i thought of the names openvis or openviz, but actually both names were used for different projects already. coincidently openviz is an application from avs.com. well there's been a lot of talk about this before and it never resulted in anything. so i'm hoping your doing better, although i can't judge if pascal is optimal for this task. other programming languages might ease cross-development, and i'd love to see osx, linux and windows supported, maybe even (Open)BeOS. many other operating systems might have better multimedia-capabilities than windows. iirc, jheriko was also interested in working on something like this. my suggestion is -since you sounded like you want to make it an open project- that you team up and register the project at sourceforge. this might attract other people as well to work on it. but then it really needs a name. of course it would be nice if this new visualization plugin would be in a way compatible to avs. i don't know about the legal situation here, but then again nullsoft built in that svp loader, which plays sonique visualizations, sonique is a product from lycos. so, back to the name issue. remember that this can be anything (i.e. 'dog', 'house' etc.), it doesnt need to have this close association to the name of avs. if you still prefer this, think of OpenVS, OpenAV or IVS (independent vs)... whatever. NSIS IDE for Atom \| NSIS for Visual Studio Code \| NSIS for Sublime Text \| NSIS.docset

14th June 2003, 13:48	#7
Zevensoft Major Dude Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Ballarat, Australia Posts: 529	OpenVL - Open Visualization Language 1 \| 2 \| 3 \| 4 \| 3W \| 4W W

14th June 2003, 20:50	#8
Phaze1987 Major Dude Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Lula The Sexy Empire Posts: 916	OpenVL sounds waaaaaaaaay to much like OpenGL.FreeVIS sounds nice to me. http://www.google.com/search?q=freev...TF-8&hl=ro&lr= \| -Mail me- \| -Visit my DA page- \| -Talk to me on IRC-(nick Phaze1NE)- \|

14th June 2003, 00:46	#2
Wiser87 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: California, USA Posts: 124	err... wrong forum (or sub-forum, or whatever...). This should go on the main AVS forum...

14th June 2003, 01:55	#4
UnConeD Whacked Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Posts: 2,104	Did you write your own parser or use a generator? Is the code interpreted or compiled? Please post more details .

14th June 2003, 07:59	#5
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	Well, ive been coding a pascal compiler from scratch for a side project, and to take up less time, i used flex/bison to do quicker generaton of the language rules, and lexical analysis. Worked out pretty well I hear there are ports for the winders, so if all goes well, this should be a damn portable project I was thinking of compiling to an intermediate code format - still to be devised of course - but that would run a heck of a lot quicker than interpreting every time it loads any ideas UCD? Currently it is very very interpreted... doesnt even translate into any sort of icode... so its way un-optimised, and needs some work... but i dont think that its going to be anything too major to get goin well.

14th June 2003, 21:49	#9
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	Yeah, i like the sound of freevis a lot The pascal thingie was just a pascal compiler that i was working o as practice in writing lexers/parsers/compilers in c/c++. This one has a lot more avs syntax like syntax, and is still written in c/c++, but hasn't taken nearly as long as i wrote it with flex and bison. Well, if no one has any objections, should we go with FreeVIS? edit: damn, i didnt click the link before i wrote that... does that mean that FreeVIS is out?

14th June 2003, 23:11	#10
Phaze1987 Major Dude Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Lula The Sexy Empire Posts: 916	NO way ! Its an eye clinic.We are eye doctors ! Plus,i dont think they have copyright on FreeVIS. \| -Mail me- \| -Visit my DA page- \| -Talk to me on IRC-(nick Phaze1NE)- \|

15th June 2003, 01:52	#11
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	Maybe we should taunt them and have a big eye as our logo? Well, i've run into a block. I can add in set functions like abs() etc... but im having a lot of trouble thinking of a way to store user functions. Any one have any ideas?

15th June 2003, 02:29	#12
Zevensoft Major Dude Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Ballarat, Australia Posts: 529	Use a call(functionname,param0,param1,...) method. And store functions like: code: function fName, pVar0, pVar1, ... end function And you might want to have init,perframe,onbeat, and perpoint as functions too. 1 \| 2 \| 3 \| 4 \| 3W \| 4W W

15th June 2003, 03:31	#13
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	yeah, i was wondering what the data structure would look like though. do you think that a linked list would work? i'm expecting that some sort of frame work for developing functions in c/c++ will be done too...

15th June 2003, 12:04	#14
Deamon Major Dude Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Arnhem, the Netherlands Posts: 927	How easy would everything be if Nullsoft would just give the source for AVS to us, and make it all open source... .:HyperNation @ winamp:. .:DeviantArt:. Thermal is now available for download at DeviantArt.

15th June 2003, 12:52	#16
mquadrat Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Old Europe Posts: 37	FreeVis is a registered Trademark in Germany and is owned by LASIK Zentren GmbH, Mannheim. In the US there's a trademark FreeVision owned by CCCNetwork Systems Group Limited. Hope that helps..

15th June 2003, 12:57	#17
Yathosho Forum King Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AT-DE Posts: 3,366	mannheim, my birthplace NSIS IDE for Atom \| NSIS for Visual Studio Code \| NSIS for Sublime Text \| NSIS.docset

15th June 2003, 13:02	#18
mquadrat Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Old Europe Posts: 37	Well I'm there from time to time. A Friend of mine lives there. But mhhh I think we're going off topic

15th June 2003, 14:40	#19
[Ishan] Major Dude Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: India Posts: 1,156	How 'bout "FUTURE VIS" or "GRAND VIS"?? Amateur AVS'er. All over again. Last AVS Pack : Resurgence

15th June 2003, 16:04	#20
Phaze1987 Major Dude Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Lula The Sexy Empire Posts: 916	Grand VIS sounds like porn.FutureVIS sounds pretty nice. Suggestion : EyeDlite . Sounds like crap... \| -Mail me- \| -Visit my DA page- \| -Talk to me on IRC-(nick Phaze1NE)- \|

15th June 2003, 19:40	#21
NemoOrange Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Philadelphia, USA Posts: 135	How about something like "Dilate" v. intr. To become wider or larger; expand. To speak or write at great length on a subject; expatiate stuff like "OpenViz" or "FreeFL" sounds boring.

15th June 2003, 20:09	#22
Phaze1987 Major Dude Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Lula The Sexy Empire Posts: 916	Dilate? o_O Sounds spooky,it might attract people. \| -Mail me- \| -Visit my DA page- \| -Talk to me on IRC-(nick Phaze1NE)- \|

15th June 2003, 20:31	#23
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	yeah, i like the sound of dilate as long as someone makes some sort of awesome preset involving an eye when its done...

16th June 2003, 05:36	#24
[Ishan] Major Dude Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: India Posts: 1,156	Dilate sounds nice to me too. Amateur AVS'er. All over again. Last AVS Pack : Resurgence

16th June 2003, 07:29	#25
shreyas_potnis Major Dude Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Mumbai, India Posts: 787	OpenVL! http://home.iitb.ac*****~shreyaspotnis

16th June 2003, 07:54	#26
mquadrat Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Old Europe Posts: 37	Dilate sounds nice, but where's the connection to visualization? And for the preset: If Dilate will be at least as powerful as AVS then an awesome preset with an eye, shouldn't be the problem

16th June 2003, 08:09	#28
mquadrat Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Old Europe Posts: 37	Mhh you're right.. Then I'm voting YES for Dilate.

16th June 2003, 08:33	#29
Tuggummi Bin King Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Finland Posts: 2,179	Dilate gives an classy impression, i vote for that And i agree that all those "openvis" "futurevis" "grandvis" "supervis" etc. those sound boring and rather childish... Texer Resources Im retarded... err i mean retired! Probably both...

16th June 2003, 09:00	#30
[Ishan] Major Dude Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: India Posts: 1,156	Allright so its decided is it? DILATE! Amateur AVS'er. All over again. Last AVS Pack : Resurgence

16th June 2003, 09:24	#31
Yathosho Forum King Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AT-DE Posts: 3,366	moltarx: you should get this registered at sourceforge then NSIS IDE for Atom \| NSIS for Visual Studio Code \| NSIS for Sublime Text \| NSIS.docset

16th June 2003, 13:41	#32
Shock Value Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: USA Posts: 158	Dilate sounds good to me.

16th June 2003, 14:36	#33
[Ishan] Major Dude Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: India Posts: 1,156	So approximately how much time would it take till we get to see "Dilate"?? Amateur AVS'er. All over again. Last AVS Pack : Resurgence

16th June 2003, 15:26	#34
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	Who knows, ill register it tonight, and hopefully get somewhere with coding support for user functions in the language part of it... but we still have the whole visualization part of it to go Its just me right now (that i know of) and any help would definitly speed up development Ill post the url of the sf.net project once i get it registered, so anyone that wants to can pull down the code, and start work

16th June 2003, 17:23	#35
UnConeD Whacked Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Posts: 2,104	I'm already building a vis though . It'll just won't get worked on any further until I finish exams. Might as well build one big, decent compiler rather. I can make it output assembly (and thus be as fast as any regular code) rather than be interpreted. Think about how it is layed out: - Is it typed or untyped? - Support for objects? - Extensible? - Event-driven or linear?

16th June 2003, 20:25	#36
moltarx Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 83	Are you going to have it generate assembly only for the routines that do math type functions? or just have it spit out a shared object or the like? Also, what were you going to use for rendering your vis? I was going to try and go for a cross platform type thing, and use sdl to render, as that has been built for linux, winders etc. I thought that if we did it that way, we might be able to bring some new people into the community that were forced to oogle at presets made until then

16th June 2003, 21:36	#37
UnConeD Whacked Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Posts: 2,104	Currently using OpenGL in Windows, but I'm thinking of switching to SDL. I'll see, first I have to get a prototype working ; I intend to make it compile completely to assembly.