ml_org: Media Library Organizer

[jheddings]

I am starting development on a plugin for the Media Library that will keep your files organized based on tags, and I would like some feedback.

Here's my thoughts on the extension:

First off, I want to make this an option on the "Library" button menu at the bottom left of the ML. I don't want this to be an automated task (like scanning watch folders) at first. Maybe later this could be an option, but there are problems that can happen from this (i.e. the renaming tries to rename a file that you are currently playing).

Of course, a flexible naming solution will be provided, including the ability to use folders. This will probably be similar to the existing ripping tag format (with some extra tags if needed).

Only files found in the watch folders will be organized. This is for the following reason: let's say that you add a file to your media library that is not in your watch folders. You also have a naming format like: <Artist>\<Album>\<Title>. Where does the renamed file go to? Do you start the <Artist> folder at the current file location? Anyway, it just seems too complicated. I think that an option to force renamed files would be okay, and allow the user to specify the directory. That would probably come later.

This module is not intended to alter tags based on filename, but to rename the file based on the tag.

Thoughts? Ideas? Concerns??

This is my first extension, so it may be a while in the making, but I would like your feedback as I am getting started.

[Nunzio390]

Ahhh. Normally I would have moved this to the Development forum but I see you were already there and that Nicolai Syvertsen (saivert) suggested that you post here first for input. LOL.

Okay. Maybe some Winamp users can offer you some feedback here, then you can head back over to Development to work on a plugin.

[jheddings]

Apologies for the wrong forum... I'll try to have my business done quickly and get outta your hair.

[Nunzio390]

No. No. This is fine, posting here. You misunderstood me. This will allow for user-feedback for your idea. I agree with Nicolai in that regard. That's why I'm leaving this thread open and intact here. Let others reply. See if it's worth your while developing the plugin. If enough people want it, and also post suggestions/requests, then go ahead with it by all means! And then continue development discussion in the other thread you started in the Development forum. But if nobody wants/needs it, then consider whether or not it's worth your trouble/effort.

[ken1to]

Hey first of all let me thank you in advance because i've been asking this plugin for long time, if there anything i could help, just let me know...

Originally posted by jheddings
This module is not intended to alter tags based on filename, but to rename the file based on the tag.

I totaly agree with you, basicly it just rearrange your mp3 directory... it would be nice you set some setting for the plugin:

MP3 Folders: this is the basic setting, where is you organized music folder, most of the people have a directory structure for full albums other for singles files and the incomming for new files, so i guess the bes way to know which directory the plugin should organize.

Order structure: most people organize the mp3 in various diferent ways, for example I have 2 diferent setting for organize my music, for full albums is "\- <genere> -\<artist> - <album>\[<track number leading by zero>] - <artist> - <title>.mp3" (this it how it looks \- Rock -\The Cure - Greatest Hits (Disc 1)\[02] - The Cure - A Forest.mp3) and for singles I just use a basic structure \- <genere> -\<artist>\<artist> - <title>.mp3 (this is how it looks \- Punk -\Blink 182\Blink 182 - Always.mp3). The key of the plugin is that will organize the music based on the user input structure... that would be awesome, beacuse everyone will have the music arranged the way they want it for futures implementations it would be great to setup diferent structures for diferent folders... that way some people (like me) will always have that particulary directory organized.

Organizing settings: this is for other things like playlists, disc fronts images, lyrics... some keep this kinds of files in the folders... so the behavior of the plugin should include what to do with this files.

I don't know... with those simple features will fit all my needs.


[btw... sorry about my english ]

[peaceofcake]

Well I definitely could use this, actually I've always wanted such a feature in winamp. Also, thanks for coming to this forum to ask us lowly end-users for our opinions.

Since I'm sure you've thought through all this already, I'll be brief. These are just a few features I think would be important:

-Transfer over the playcount, ratings, etc when renaming a file that's already in the database. Also it would be nice if the date modified listed in the ML isn't changed, but I don't if that's possible.
-Choice of whether to read the data from the tags or from the ML. Probably ML would be preferable, since the ML is always correct (unless the tags were edited in an external program and the ML wasn't rescanned, but that's rare) while sometimes the tags may not be correct (like if the user edited metadata and didn't check "update file tags" or if there aren't tags like in the case of .wav files). Also, just using the ML saves you the work of supporting multiple tagging formats.
-If there are files in the same folder as something that's about to get moved, ask the user what to do. Give them a listing of the files and allow them to select, for each one, whether to leave it there, move it along with the media files, or trash it.
-OPTION TO EXCLUDE CERTAIN FILES OR FOLDERS from individual functions of the plugin. For example, I collect bootlegs, and the filenames are important and need to stay the way they were when I got the files. Usually they're named in the following manner: phish2004-02-18D3T1_vbr.mp3, which means Phish on Feb 18th, 2004, and track 1 of the third disc. The filenames tell you the best way to split up the concert onto audio cds, although the entire concert usually has the same album tag. For these files I'd like to tell the plugin to do everything but rename the file.
-To identify whether a file should be counted as a single track or part of an album, you could do a ML querry on the album and artist and count the results.


Hopefully that's enough to keep you busy

Keith

[bemymonkey]

that sounds pretty damn good... PLEASE get to coding quickly, heheh. two thumbs up for the ideas

[peaceofcake]

If you need beer money let me know

[jheddings]

Thanks for the offer! Thanks for the suggestions, too... This started mostly as just something that I wanted, but I figured that I'd get other input to see if anyone else might want it.

Keep the discussion coming... No guarantees on getting everything in this list, but I'll see what I can do.

[peaceofcake]

I think the main thing to keep in mind when you make this is to preserve the ratings, playcounts, etc. Simple renaming can already be done by multitudes of programs, but there's nothing out there that can also update the ML with the new location.

Also, I think it would be best if you make it necessary to highlight the files first. This would provide an extra layer of protection against accidents as opposed to just clicking a button, and it also allows for the ignoring of certain files like I mentioned earlier. If you can't read which files are highlighted in the ML maybe you could work from the playlist instead by just enqueueing the selection.

Good luck and keep us updated.

[jheddings]

I agree about the play counts, etc... That's my #1 reason for wanting to do this plugin, in fact. Otherwise, I'd lose all those things if I just use some other prog to get this done.

I'm going to start mucking my way through the code now. I'll post here when I make any progress.

Thanks for all the input!!

[CornToeGoblin]

if you are going to develop this project your going to have to have it do everything on it's own. your also going to have to figure out a system for new files. because as everyone here probably everyone knows, not everybody has their music organized. your going to have to be able to delete folder and stuff for just in case the tag info was wrong and they move the song or change the tag. what i suggest you do is assume that the users tag information is correct and just have the plug-in organize in real-time so when the user organizes his music it automatically moves the song to the appropriate folder adding folders and deleting as necessary. your going to also make sure your program doesn't fuck up and destroys half a persons music because your going to get some angry e-mails from people complaining that they have to re-download their entire music library. you should also be able to move the music files to folders to have a real C:\my music\artist\album\## - title.mp3 set up

[jheddings]

Thanks for all the input. The plugin is now in beta and being tested. I'll post when it is complete.

From the looks of the last post, I guess I better take out the code that I intentionally put in there to remove all the files in everyone's library. Wouldn't that have been a great surprise, though?

Seriously, though, you should always have a backup of your library and all media. Just because something works on one computer, doesn't mean it will be flawless on another (just look at M$ apps). I will not respond to any email from users complaining about losing their libraries. You have been adequately warned.

The plugin comes with no warranty, expressed or implied, and I am in no way responsible for what happens to your library if you use it. If you are concerned about what will happen, make a backup. If you don't like that option, don't use the plugin. You should always assume that 3rd party software is going to mess up your data.

FOR THE BETA VERSION, CLICK HERE.

I will post the plugin on the Winamp site when it has been tested more thoroughly. If you are interested in contributing to the development of the plugin, visit the Development Thread.

[Nunzio390]

@ jheddings...

Nice. I'll give the Beta a try in a bit (test it on a Win95 box).

But let's address backing up...

Originally posted by jheddings
Seriously, though, you should always have a backup of your library and all media...

...If you are concerned about what will happen, make a backup. If you don't like that option, don't use the plugin.

I totally agree that people should always make a backup. But also keep in mind the fact that 99% of posters in these forums have absolutely NO idea that backing up is possible and never ever READ anything, let alone the backup procedures outlined here.

So, considering the above, I think it may do well to include a link to the backup procedure within the plugin as well.

[jheddings]

Originally posted by Nunzio390
So, considering the above, I think it may do well to include a link to the backup procedure within the plugin as well.

That is a good point. And probably a popup that a user can select "Don't Show This Again" reminding them to backup their library.

Has anyone made a plugin to backup Winamp files, and / or the ML (both the DB and the files)?

[billyvnilly]

nope. noone has.

is it possible to just create a batch file to copy paste everything elsewhere?

well unless people change their install folder.

[siebe83]

Already been done by our great DJ Egg:
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread....63#post1611363

[jheddings]

That looks like a good option to backup most settings and the ML DB. Just remember that it does NOT backup your music. You still need to do that on your own.

Perhaps a new plugin is needed, here, to backup and restore the Media Library as well as the data files? That wouldn't be too hard...

[jheddings]

PS: of course, being a 3rd party plugin, you would still have to decide if you trust it, too...

[siebe83]

I don't know how useful such a plugin would be. It really depends on the size of your music collection and the way it is stored on your hard disk. I'm not sure people are willing to allocate 10/20 or even more gigabytes of their hard disk space to create a backup because of some plugin. And how exactly would it create that backup? If your ML database consists of files stored all over the place, should it just throw everything together in one folder?

I dunno, but I think people are also responsible for what they do themselves. Creating a backup of your music collection isn't that hard, it's just a matter of copying your files to another hard disk or burning them to a cd. That would be a real backup, which isn't simply accomplished by a plugin since you'll need either a second hard drive or burning support within the plugin (of which the latter is a bit too much to ask, I think).

Although an advantage of a plugin would be the possibility to easily 'synchronize' (or whatever that's called) your backup based on what's in the ML.
Mmh, maybe it's an idea after all...

/end of rambling
[edit]above I was just thinking aloud, sorry if I annoyed anyone [/edit]

Anyway, I think a popup would suffice, if possible with a reference to the backup procedure. Give them a warning and if they ignore it, so be it. Also state clearly at every download occasion that it's a beta version (for now at least ).

[jheddings]

Good thoughts... I agree with your points on the difficulty of implementing such a plugin. It is more than simply copying files to a folder.

I'll stick with the popup and crank up my email filters...

[doublekai]

hey everyone, i was just surfing along and i found this plug-in, which seems to be really useful. i'd just like to know whether programming continues - is the plug-in still in active development?
jheddings: i followed the development of your programming through forums.winamp.com and would just like to say 'thank you'!

[jheddings]

You are welcome! Your's is the first feedback I've received from the plugin, so I have been reluctant to post a version to WA.com. I have been using ml_org for a while now and it works great for me. It is a little slow for very large collections, but otherwise, it runs great.

If I could speed it up a little, I'd be ready to post right away. If the feedback is that the speed isn't a problem, then I believe it is ready to post for rev 1.0.

[doublekai]

well basically... i'm scared of renaming (that's what it does,right?)/organising all my files =)) i know it sounds silly but the pc with all my backup mp3s is back in germany and here in the UK (where i am staying until the end of june) i only have all the files once, which would - as a worse-case-scenario mean that all the music i took months to organise would be messed up.

i don't know, but would it be an idea to write a short FAQ or README in order to show newbs how "It"'s done.

i believe that's what i need to feel a bit more comfortable about the plug-in.

[koleoptero]

Also a very nice idea is that the plugin should create a logfile with all the renaming/moving of files and thus have an option to undo the overall organizing if anyone finds the organizing messed up his music collection. It is rather simple if you think about it a moment and rather vital.
The option to move the entire library to a default folder I think is also proper.
And finally another good (imho) addition would be the lookup of information through freedb or gracenote or some other service for missing file information on mp3s that lack some of the required fields (i.e. if "year" is one folder or target track name).
I think that many people need this plugin. I don't though for now.
Does the plugin allow you to reorganize only some selected files?

[aijoovai]

This would be a VERY welcome plugin for Winamp! Could you post it here (/ someplace else & send a link here) for testing / try-out?

Thnx!

[jheddings]

Here is a link to the plugin as it stands currently. Please keep in mind that THIS IS BETA!! You should have a backup of your data if you are concerned about losing it.

http://winamp.heddway.com/ml_org/

Once configured, the plugin will rename your files based on tag information. If this information is incomplete, the plugin may rename files funny.

[ignitionnight]

Any updates since the beta?

[mstrswrd06]

This plugin worked great. But then new versions of Winamp were released, and the plugin stopped working. What happened to development? I need a plugin like this that works...

[gasyoun]

I'm using Wimanp since 2002. I mean I've reinstalled windows for 5 times, so I use this small little tool since year 2003. Worked fine for me. Do not know if there are any other outhere, have not searched for them since than.

PHP Code:

http://www.office-backup.com/plugins/backup-plugins/winamp.shtml 


[narfnarfsilly]

Originally posted by mstrswrd06
This plugin worked great. But then new versions of Winamp were released, and the plugin stopped working. What happened to development? I need a plugin like this that works...

Newer version here:

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread....=&pagenumber=2

[ujay]

Originally posted by narfnarfsilly
Newer version here:

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread....=&pagenumber=2

UJ