Old 20th July 2015, 20:06   #1001
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i like GorillaCat's comment above as irrespective of what is or isn't going on, for a lot of people it was just an excuse to ditch Winamp as they were probably already going to do anyway (based on many of the uninstall comments that I had seen).

for others, it doesn't seem to make any difference if there's ever a new version when I see all too often "i'm still using 2.9x" or whatever old version or when you inform of a patched version, people still won't use it and then (ironically) have the audacity to complain about a lack of updates.

as an ex-dev (and as was seen early on I was providing some updates but people generally couldn't care about such things - they wanted instant gratification and that was never going to happen), repeated comments about using old versions and never wanting to update never made it much of an incentive to keep working on things when people just aren't going to use them. which is another reason why I've effectively given up plug-in development as well as putting in countless hours on something basically no one is going to use is just a waste and is why the skin / plug-in communities have also basically died as people want $$$ for the time and effort and no one wants to pay for that (as is beautifully reinforced by how many people do not pay for things via the Android / Apple app stores - another reason why a Winamp app store that someone keeps banging on about will never work and would just encourage now playing spammer plug-ins that are pointless).


so to answer batray17's question, imho it is the users who are the ones who primarily drove things to (but not solely responsible for) the state as they either didn't want to use newer versions (if people don't use it then what's the point in paying a dev team on a free product to keep working on things) or just moved on to other things (and the argument that Winamp should be on all platforms is all nice and good but that would cost even more and as no one wants to pay for things - the piracy of Winamp Pro was ridiculous and is why there was the crap like OpenCandy and ads on the online pages). yes AOL and other factors (the general shift from desktop to mobile) also did a lot to affect things, but it is ultimately down to lack of interest from users and their changing habits that have led to the waning of things.


and before someone bangs on about open sourcing Winamp and all that, just look at Nightingale which is the remains of the SongBird player which basically did the same and what's happened with that despite being OSS already - not very much and so do forgive me if i'm cynical about an OSS Winamp - it would just be ripped to bits, slagged off for the quality of the code and that'd be it (along with a load of failed forks that never go anywhere).


whether Winamp survives or not is a completely different matter that I cannot and will not answer (I don't know what the passing of time will do to it) but if people want to see Winamp stay alive, it needs to be used, and irrespective of what may / may not happen, keep trying to make skins / plug-ins (yes I know my giving up is ironic with such a comment but I think I've done more than my times worth and supposedly there's 1000s of people who want to make things for / with Winamp still that can take up that mantle...).

and if people are that in need of something that loads Winamp skins and whatever else it is that makes things 'Winamp' for them, then why not make a Winamp-clone... oh wait, that happened in the late 1990's, early 2000's and every few years including the HTML5/JavaScript thing from last year. so do forgive my cynicism but the same things crop up every few years, people complain, someone does something and then they loose interest and the cycle begins again.
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Old 20th July 2015, 20:23   #1002
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For as long as my V5.666 Build 3512 (x86) - Nov 26, 2013 version continues to work for me in Windows 7 and 8.1, I will keep right on truckin'. I only ask these questions to inquire about Winamp because Windows 10 is coming out at the end of July.
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Old 20th July 2015, 20:25   #1003
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you're a prime example of having been informed of a patched version and then refuse to install it (which was the specific reason I recently decided to give up plug-in development with your earlier posts about being fine with that specific version and being pestered by someone to provide Winamp 1.x compatible versions of my plug-ins - which never existed).
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Old 20th July 2015, 21:49   #1004
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which is another reason why I've effectively given up plug-in development as well as putting in countless hours on something basically no one is going to use is just a waste and is why the skin / plug-in communities have also basically died as people want $$$ for the time and effort and no one wants to pay for that (as is beautifully reinforced by how many people do pay for things via the Android / Apple app stores - another reason why a Winamp app store that someone keeps banging on about will never work and would just encourage now playing spammer plug-ins that are pointless).
seeing as how that person is me, i simply want to understand your comment, b/c my reading of it seems to me to contradict itself.

you cite the success of android / apple stores, and then say winamp can't do the same. while of course there are differences, (an OS vs an app), i don't see the connection you are drawing, which seems to be that their success means your presumed failure?

i'm not looking to enrage you, i simply want to understand your point/meaning.

on a completely different note:

i recall you saying that the work you were doing on winamp, post sale, was the most fun coding you'd had in years. i was really looking forward to the next version, a post AOL ver, a radionomy ver. as someone who always upgraded in a timely fashion, i think it will be a shame for that work to never see the light of day.

what i still can't bring myself to believe, is that radionomy is so shortsighted, and so stupid, as to not release, at the minimum, a radionomy branded ver! even if it were the final ver, it would be released as the LAST ver, with their name and links and apps and so on in it, why would they not do that? its just beyond stupid to me.

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Old 20th July 2015, 22:04   #1005
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i suggest you review the edit i'd made as there was a missing 'not' in my reply re: app stores.

if most apps are never paid for from the potential 100s of millions of device users, how is an old time desktop app (or even WAFA) going to make any impact by providing it's own store. Winamp's own free vs pro numbers from what I remember were dismal even at Winamp's peak.

so i'm basing my assumptions on prior data and the reality that if you get even a few % conversion, it's not going to be much and plug-ins are even more of a niche and with the amount of crap that gets churned out into app stores in an attempt to make some sort of money, I can just see the same happening for a Winamp version and tbh that was what was already happening when there was seen as being money in Winamp plug-ins.

so that's why it's basically a no go imho and would never work - too little, too late and people don't want that sort of thing, they want everything free or even better, all native as why should they have to go around installing extra things when x, y and z do it natively and all those other arguments that are made (along with having it super light and all that which is why there is a persist issue people have with Winamp and there's no way to resolve that).
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Old 20th July 2015, 23:20   #1006
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so sounds like that's it then.
The last version of Winamp is prob the last version we'll ever see as there is no way out and no way forward.

:-)

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Old 21st July 2015, 00:41   #1007
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what happened to the Winamp copycat MediaMonkey ?
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Old 21st July 2015, 08:39   #1008
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Curiously I have seen this exact same debate on other products I continue to use - will there be a new version? is Development dead? Why is there no news forthcoming?

Unfortunately I cant find an answer to any of the above, not a real direct response anyway, from the company who is developing Winamp.

Here are my thoughts.. Winamp since its inception has been the best music player ever developed for the windows desktop.

Hands down it has outlived and outlasted many other players and continues to provide an awesome experience for anyone who loved Winamp from the beginning.

I will continue to use it until it stop working on Windows 10. Why ? because it has always had all the features I would want to see in a windows desktop music player.

That being said if you have a product that has a fan base, has/had a community engagement for many years why would you promise to come out with a new version/improvements and not deliver on that at all?

If that is really the case then its ok to come out and say no new version will ever be released and not leave users in the dark to moan and complain as to when a new version is out.

If it is indeed the last version then perhaps if they just maintain the code so it never breaks that would be the least we could ask for, anything above that who knows... :P

anyway I think this was just some kind of rant I had to get out.

I greatly appreciate the guys who continue to do a lot for Winamp such as DrO and all others who assist here.

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Old 21st July 2015, 10:45   #1009
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If Winamp is working on Windows 10 then there isn't really a reason it shouldn't continue to do so.

I've tested several programs that i regularly use on windows 10 and Winamp did surprisingly well. Windows 10 is a better OS than Vista/Windows 8 was.

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Old 21st July 2015, 12:48   #1010
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"imho it is the users who are the ones who primarily drove things to (but not solely responsible for) the state as they either didn't want to use newer versions (if people don't use it then what's the point in paying a dev team on a free product to keep working on things) or just moved on to other things"

So, the demise of Winamp is the fault of its users?
Is that really what you believe?
If so, why don't you just shut winamp.com down for once and for all?
After all, Winamp's demise isn't your fault.
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Old 21st July 2015, 15:05   #1011
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...
If so, why don't you just shut winamp.com down for once and for all?
...
This site is not just for the Winamp desktop app. It has mostly provided a way for users of the Winamp desktop app and other related products to help other users with their questions on how to do certain things and if certain things are possible. It also has sections where people can discuss just about anything they want to, Winamp related or not.

Official technical support is supposed to be provided for the current version of things. However some of those officially associated with Winamp have provided support for older versions on occasion.

As long as the current versions of the Winamp desktop app and other related products continue to function, this website serves a useful technical and social function, imo. But it takes money (i.e. cost + profit) to provide anything and everything. When the direct and indirect revenue associated with Winamp (i.e. SHOUTcast at this point in time) falls below a sustainable level, this site will be shut down unless someone with 'deep pockets' takes it on as a charity case.

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Old 21st July 2015, 20:27   #1012
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the hype for the next version of winamp is real when ever it actual happens
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Old 21st July 2015, 20:44   #1013
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the hype for the next version of winamp is real when ever it actual happens
if there's any hype left ^_^

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Old 22nd July 2015, 01:48   #1014
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Still hope for Winamp yet!


Thanks to Stephen for letting us share this.

There still may be hope people!!!!!



I also just sent an email and can confirm I had this reply 10 mins later...

"Hello,

Thank you for reaching out. It is definitely still being worked on, the Radionomy Group has been growing a lot this year and we have been delayed a little bit with the new Winamp, new version will arrive in 2016.

Best regards,

The Radionomy Team"

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Old 22nd July 2015, 02:10   #1015
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I hope The Radionomy Team who are working on the new Winamp didn't try to start this project from scratch. Maintaining a large complex software project such as Winamp and keeping it backwards compatible with the third party plugins is a big challenge. Hopefully The Radionomy Team was utilizing the talents of the original Software Developers who created this beast!
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Old 22nd July 2015, 02:23   #1016
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First 2014, then 2015, now 2016 -_-

not going to lie, but i'm disappointed...


btw djpete, good job on getting an update from Radionomy

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Old 22nd July 2015, 02:41   #1017
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Thanks Steve & Pete!

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Old 22nd July 2015, 17:58   #1018
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there's this old Linux joke.. 2016 - The year of the new Winamp
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Old 22nd July 2015, 18:03   #1019
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there's this old Linux joke.. 2016 - The year of the new Winamp
well...

https://twitter.com/winamp/status/515817530343325697


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Old 22nd July 2015, 21:18   #1020
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Isn't my current version [V5.666 Build 3512 (x86) - Nov 26, 2013] the latest version?
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Old 22nd July 2015, 21:25   #1021
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no (as i've already posted twice). 3512 is not 3516.
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Old 22nd July 2015, 21:43   #1022
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that is so true DrO! lol
how important is it to get the 3516?
got a link to it?
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Old 22nd July 2015, 21:51   #1023
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got a link to it?
....

Quote:
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Check out DrO's signature, or just go to the pinned topic that has the current version
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?t=373755

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Old 22nd July 2015, 23:33   #1024
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Thank you DrO.

What does this mean? "skinned window setting not remembered"

Update Patches - for Winamp 5.666 build 3516 only
JTFE v1.33 build 1216 (16 Dec 2013)
gen_jumpex.dll - fixes skinned window setting not being remembered
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Old 22nd July 2015, 23:41   #1025
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I'm running Window 8.1 on a Surface Pro 3 and Winamp 5.666 Build 3516 (5.6.6.3516) - 12 Dec 2013 also was running 3512.
I have the General Purpose plugin named "MP3+G Plug-In v1.4 (gen_cdg.dll) installed.
When I open a karaoke CDG file, this plug-in opens a separate window to display the lyrics.
If I right-click in the lyrics window, I can select "always on top" and this works fine in Window 7 on my laptop but it doesn't stay on top in Windows 8.1.
Does anyone know how to fix this problem?
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Old 22nd July 2015, 23:46   #1026
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What does this mean? "skinned window setting not remembered"
it means exactly as it's said, that plug-in option wasn't being remembered and the update fixes it.

Quote:
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If I right-click in the lyrics window, I can select "always on top" and this works fine in Window 7 on my laptop but it doesn't stay on top in Windows 8.1.
Does anyone know how to fix this problem?
have you looked for an update and / or tried to contact the plug-in author? as it's a 3rd party plug-in, if it's not working right on Win8.x then that's generally something that needs to be fixed in the plug-in (assuming the plug-in developer still is around / has the source code / can be bothered).
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Old 23rd July 2015, 00:16   #1027
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I got some excellent support in past 8 months for Win 8.1 for my 3rd party plugin named "DSP/Effect PaceMaker tempo/pitch controller v2.7 (dsp_pacemaker.dll).

My General Purpose plugin named "MP3+G Plug-In v1.4 (gen_cdg.dll) has always worked perfectly for over 10 years in Win XP, 7 & 8.1. With the exception of Win 8.1 "always on top" problem.
I will try to contact Yannick at PHY Systeme at support@physysteme.com.
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Old 23rd July 2015, 15:46   #1028
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Old 23rd July 2015, 15:51   #1029
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FYI...anyone looking for older versions of Winamp can get them at: http://www.oldversion.com/windows/winamp/
Why would people want to use older versions of Winamp?

They could be full of security holes.... Always best to have the latest(ish) version

I stopped using 2.91 because I was warned of potential risks.

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Old 23rd July 2015, 15:55   #1030
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Why would people want to use older versions of Winamp?
because that one plugin that doesnt work on the newest winamp. For me it's ml_ipod So im stuck on 5.63

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Old 23rd July 2015, 16:09   #1031
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Gave up using plugins in winamp a while back. I found a lot the older winamp plugins were notorious for crashing the player.

I have my install stripped down to bare basics.

Now I just use it to listen to my stream don't need fancy plugins for that. We also got rid of our iPod a while back so I'd have no use for ml_ipod either.

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Old 23rd July 2015, 16:29   #1032
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Now I just use it to listen to my stream don't need fancy plugins for that. We also got rid of our iPod a while back so I'd have no use for ml_ipod either.
well, since i refuse to ever install itunes on my computer, and my 7 year old 120GB ipod is still kicking, then ml_ipod makes things work perfectly for syncing libraries. Once that craps out, then yeah i'll upgrade because I will never buy another ipod since they killed the classic line (plus my car takes usb drives now)

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Old 24th July 2015, 09:21   #1033
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There still may be hope people!!!!!
i've said all along i that i can't believe they'd buy it only to kill it without releasing at least one post AOL ver, but even that reply is weird...

why take DrO off the winamp project, and make him shoutcast only? what dev do they have who knows winamp better?

if they still plan to release it come 2016, why not give some kind of update on a website in a more visible way? keep the users involved, give em hope.

what could possibly take so long? even if the new ver is radically different, amazing, worth the wait, whatever, why not put out an interim release that addresses the problems DrO already did? again, it keeps the user base from shrinking, or at least, stems it a bit. this is the Chinese Democracy approach, and that went over like a Lead Zeppelin.

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Old 24th July 2015, 10:01   #1034
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Spot on Mr Sinatra. Which ever way you look at it it's REALLY BAD marketing

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Old 24th July 2015, 12:50   #1035
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maybe I didn't want to be involved with Winamp anymore.... simple enough as that and based on a lot of feedback (not seen on this bubble of un-rea!ity) is what people were wanting. so if putting my needs first is wrong / selfish then so be it but everyone got more than a decade of Winamp re!ated things out of me and maybe that was my limit.

Winamp's dev team has changed multiple times over the years (with most never being known off) and sometimes it's better to have fresh blood than a dinosaur like me... which happened with the last major change with Winamp's dev team and that was generally a good change (unless you're a 2.x forever zealot).

and historically you've never heard about new versions until there is something viable to use / release so if anything the same approach pre-sale is being applied irrespective of that being liked or not (as hyping something that's not ready is far worse marketing imho).
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Old 24th July 2015, 13:28   #1036
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If historical practice alone was an excuse to continue doing something the same way, we'd still be washing clothes in the river and cooking over an open fire.
Sometimes, a new way of doing something is an improvement.

The point is this: it feels as if Radionomy has ignored the current Winamp users in general, and this forum in particular.
It wouldn't take much time or effort for some regular (monthly? quarterly?) communication, in an official form, to placate the masses.

Nobody needs to be told the intricate details of what is going on behind the scenes.
But without a simple "we're still working, please be patient, thanks for waiting" type of message, Radionomy appears uncaring and impolite.

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Old 24th July 2015, 13:49   #1037
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i'm not saying the approach being taking is right or wrong, just that at most you've got consistency in the level of communication made pre-sale and post-sale. whatever is or isn't done, people will complain but that's a whole bigger issue and as I'm not involved, there's no point in my trying to push matters.

the reality is that Winamp in whatever guise it will be, will be a niche player - it had it's time in the spot light and it's now realistically in it's twilight years. sure it works well for those who want it still and good for them, but changing habits mean it's somewhat held back (e.g. skinned ui that don't fit in with the OS - which I still want to see a native UI but most don't even though it's the simplest way to provide something 'different' that people kept calling for whilst allowing for better OS integration that the skinned UI cannot achieve.).

marketing on any level will not get back 10s of millions of users (which based on some things I've seen, were never true figures anyway when you're looking at streaming usage based on what at least one large player did a few months back to 'correct' things - user-agent strings are too easily faked is the moral of that).

as most of the feedback around the sale indicated that people thought Winamp was already dead anyway or that it'd just stop working and so they ditched it anyway. that is what I mean that part of the blame can be put on the users as if people don't want to use it, then that's the fate it will achieve irrespective of there being active development. timely updates and all that jazz.
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Old 24th July 2015, 14:54   #1038
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Originally Posted by DrO View Post
... the reality is that Winamp in whatever guise it will be, will be a niche player ...
I assume you have stats (that you trust) that support that statement. If true, it's sad that Winamp has become the least used digital media player. If most of the former users lost interest, it's not all their fault. I think the people in charge never learned how to compete, once others joined the marketplace.

Anyway, I'll kept using Winamp as long as possible (warts and all).

DrO, I refuse to believe that the negative comments directed at you reflect the opinions of the majority of Winamp users (now and in the past). However, I will respect whatever life choices you make going forward. Your past contributions have been above and beyond the 'call of duty'.

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Old 24th July 2015, 15:15   #1039
StreetWalker
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According to my google search, Winamp is over 15 years old and was considered the best music player until a couple years ago. You can find reviews that suit your point of view on this but here is one opinion from an old Winamp supporter http://lifehacker.com/5804911/the-be...on-for-windows

Technology never seizes to change and there is no shortage of companies who are willing to take music players to the next level. Winamp is still my primary music player and is very important to me!
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Old 24th July 2015, 17:29   #1040
Aminifu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StreetWalker View Post
... here is one opinion from an old Winamp supporter http://lifehacker.com/5804911/the-be...on-for-windows
I've been using Winamp from it's beginning. I have tried MusicBee, MediaMonkey, AIMP3, and quite a few others. In fact, some are still installed on my computer. I keep them updated and checkout each new version. But to me, the way my music sounds is what's most important. It's taken me a long time to find the 'right' mix of plug-ins to add to Winamp's native features that let me tweak things so that my music sounds just the way I like it with my sound card and 5.1 speaker system.

So until I'm forced to try to get other apps to sound the same, I'm sticking with Winamp. I'm also comfortable with the way Winamp manages files and I'm not looking forward to learning another management system. The few things Winamp no longer does (i.e. tagging, searching for albumart, etc.) are better done by 3rd party apps dedicated to those things, imo.

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