Old 17th July 2006, 04:07   #1
nekoneko
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Possibly stolen skins.

Okay, so i realise i'm going to get banned on sight for making an account after my old one was banned all those years ago, however.
http://wifiradio.com
I see quite a few winamp 5 skins (including mmd3) on this site, with their names removed and others put in their place, normally you could attribute this to newbs or whatever, however these guys are trying to SELL custom media players with these skins, and i wanted to come here and let it be known incase the permission to use these skins was not aquired.

Now as for me being banned, i don't mind but coudl you please leave this post intact so that the owners of these skins may see and where possible confirm or denie if permission was obtained.

Thanks

-Neko
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Old 17th July 2006, 05:50   #2
billyvnilly
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I assume it'd be Sven that would take the legal action.
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Old 17th July 2006, 07:38   #3
dude883
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thanks for the heads up. will try to let rpc know about this.
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Old 17th July 2006, 12:06   #4
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Quote:
Okay, so i realise i'm going to get banned on sight for making an account after my old one was banned all those years ago, however.
hope they will let all those old stories finaly be and let you be here.
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Old 17th July 2006, 12:22   #5
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Unlikely.
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Old 17th July 2006, 13:39   #6
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Thanks for the heads-up. I have a pack of rabid mongooses I keep around just for situations like this...
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Old 17th July 2006, 14:27   #7
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OMG not just skins, RIP
is this a valid selling of Nullsoft Winamp code to Wifi Radio?
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Old 17th July 2006, 15:56   #8
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The website crashed my browser several times. You have to register to download the player or whatever this is.
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:19   #9
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There's a "Download Demo" button on the account page (http://wifiradio.com/cs/user/green.html). Yeah, they are selling Winamp in it's entirety, with a ripped skin modified to point web browser objects at thier services!

I'm sure AOL would be interested to learn about this...

Edit: Check out thier skin gallery:
http://wifiradio.com/cs/photos/wifir...s/default.aspx
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:28   #10
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Are they actually selling the winamp executable?
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:34   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones
Are they actually selling the winamp executable?
Sorry, that was the impression I got but it doesn't seem to be the case. No purchase necessary, they are just redistributing the Winamp executable with modified skins.
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:37   #12
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rpeterclark, thanks didn't saw the button.

It looks like Winamp 3 Build 499 , maybe I'm wrong, but WA3 is mostly opensource or?

The player isn't bundled with MMD3 (at least in the demo version, but I won't register to download the full thing), but like WA3 it supports Freeform skins.
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:41   #13
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If I didn't know better I'd say that was a re-distributed copy of wasabi.player, drill down in the skin additional/new folder and you'll find a wacs folder full of wasabi components.

Not sure where that sits, as most of wasabi player was open sourced, however I shall pass on a link to this thread to the powers that be, it's not the first thread on this as well, just spotted another one from a day or two back in winamp discussion.
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Old 17th July 2006, 16:56   #14
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Deppy says he will pass it onto the aol legal hounds to see what they want to do about it, or not as the case may be.


Sure he'll drop by and let y'all know when there is something to know, in the meantime if you want to follow up on your own skins being linked/sold/offered for download then I would if I was you, had something similar happen to me a long time back with some similar program, they backed away quite quickly, so it's always worth posing the question.
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Old 17th July 2006, 17:10   #15
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Cool, thanks Jones! I'll be sending them with a nasty-gram for sure.
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Old 17th July 2006, 19:47   #16
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did anybody contact petrol designs yet?
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Old 18th July 2006, 01:44   #17
TheElusiveMelon
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Out of interest could anyone post a list of all the skins involved?
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Old 18th July 2006, 03:10   #18
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[offtopic]
nekoneko:

If you signed up with a totally different name and didn't bring up the fact that you were banned before and just said, "Hey guys, looks like someone is stealing some Winamp skins. Here is the link..." I bet no one will be able to tell it was you. In turn saving your time typing more and the moderator's time by having to ban a new account.

Just something that crossed my mind.
[/offtopic]
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Old 18th July 2006, 06:19   #19
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hmm seems they asked people: http://wifiradio.com/cs/credits.html
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Old 18th July 2006, 06:28   #20
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Even though they did credit the skin developers, I doubt very much they even made an attempt to ask any of them.

They most certainly did not ask Nullsoft asbout the use of the Wasabi player, nor did they give any credit for that.
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Old 18th July 2006, 15:14   #21
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That credits page is definately new, and I see now they are adding small copyright credits below the skin images on the main page. The did not ask me in advance.
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Old 19th July 2006, 08:15   #22
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Quote:
Shoutouts to... NullSoft
The leaders of the free world: Your ideas and visions of a free world of publishing powered by the people is becoming a reality.
o_O
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Old 20th July 2006, 16:25   #23
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Well I got them to take down my skins. I had a really awkward conversation with their Technology Director named Moses Johnson who came across like a high-pressure used car salesman. He tried to tell me that their software gives people like us (skinners) the power to create "customized media players" rather than just a new interface for a software controlled by the tyranny of AOL. He bragged that his company has resources that I can't possibly imagine working on the development of this project.

I made it clear that I wasn't interested in contributing to their software. I called him out on their "software" which is nothing more than the Wasabi engine using re-branded Winamp skins (without permission it seems) which include browser windows pointing to a CommunityServer based website. Users can post externally hosted music using CS's built-in blogging functions and is then aggregated by CS's built-in blog roller function into channels that listeners can subscribe to. When I pointed out that his software was nothing more than a rehash of other people's work, he got quite irate.

He then switched from salesman mode to asshole mode, screaming and dropping swears and insults faster that Andrew Dice Clay. He said I was mean and selfish for not contributing to the music community and that he has many other artists including Sven and TSF that are already onboard (not true). The phone call ended shortly after and my skins seem to have been removed as of this morning.

Be careful if you installed their demo. I noticed it trying to download several .exe files and running update processes in the background. My only other advice is to stay away from these guys.
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Old 20th July 2006, 16:38   #24
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good call RPC, now perhaps if money for skins was an incentive? heheh
how on earth did they think they could get away with that sort of attitude/arrogance/disregard?
if it was released on April 1st then we could all understand but...
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Old 20th July 2006, 16:42   #25
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www.metrix.de should contact them, that the MMD3 skin will be removed too, so others, which don't know that this is a stolen Winamp3 skin have no more reason to download "their" Wifi player.

It's a shame that they advertise with the work of others.
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Old 21st July 2006, 20:10   #26
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AOL Legal is all over this one

I'm surprised that someone in the US would be so bold as to try to pull this off. Most of the time these things pop up in foreign countries where the copyright & IP laws are more lax. But in the US there are serious legal implications.


Of note, although much of Wasabi was open-sourced, key parts such as the XUI skinning engine and the audio/video decoding code (most of which is licensed from third parties!) were definitely not open-sourced. They're using the compiled WACs directly.
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Old 21st July 2006, 21:10   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Benski
AOL Legal is all over this one

I'm surprised that someone in the US would be so bold as to try to pull this off.
This IS America we are talking about. They would take your wallet directly from your hand in broad daylight, surrounded by 50 cops with S.W.A.T. gear and to snipers on every corner with K9 units sniffing their feet.
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Old 23rd July 2006, 05:51   #28
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Found at www1.1001skins.com messageboards:
Quote:
We need YOUR SKINS!

Posted by angie on Friday, July 21st, 2006 at 03:43 PM CEST
Hello! I will keep this short and sweet. My name is Angie and I work for a small software company. We are rolling out with a media player that is based on Wasabi, Winamp generation 3. We all know Wasabi was short lived and full of holes, but our company has fixed those holes and added features such as media search, broadcasting capabilities, and mobile compatibility.

Because this is Winamp 3 based, it wears Winamp Modern skins made before 2005. What I would like to know is if anyone would be willing to donate or license their original skins to the project.

This is a great opportunity to get in on a revolutionary venture! Our company has taken the short-lived Wasabi and made something fun. If you are interested, please contact me and I will tell you more about the project.
Her email: angie at advancetheory dot com

AdvanceTheory says they are the creators of PSPAdvance Media Player and PSPAdvance Wifi Radio.

While "Angie" is looking for "anyone (who) would be willing to donate or license their original skins to the project", I was wondering if their use of Wasabi was in the same vein as http://wifiradio.com

Because both sites are listed here on this technology products page:

http://www.centale.com/centale/technologyproducts.html

I'm guessing "Angie" is "Angela Sheridan - Lead Designer" listed on the WiFi Radio Credits page. Is this two different sites with same/similiar products, funded by the same investors?

[edit - it appears PSPAdvance WiFi Radio is just another name for the WiFi Radio...yes?]
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Old 23rd July 2006, 11:28   #29
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Yeah Razz, i just read that too. Its definately them.

I thought they would be more worried about the fact that the AOL Legal Hounds are going to tear them apart, rather than trying to get some skins off us at 1001skins.com.
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Old 26th July 2006, 08:06   #30
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They still dont get it
http://wifiradio.com/cs/credits.html

I really think this company is just doing this to get the main companies Stock price up. Pure Pumping this product and making it look like the investor has something to look forward too.
http://www.centale.com/centale/
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Old 26th July 2006, 08:45   #31
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i doubt the investor has much to look forward to when they're being threatened with legal action.... thers not much innovation there even if they continue as they are...
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Old 27th July 2006, 08:09   #32
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wow, i dont stop by here often, but this one just really made me laugh. im glad you guys are on this or whatever, as i just dont have the energy to yell at these people, but i find it infinitely amusing that according to their credits page, i just so happen to be among the four developers. ive never been more proud.

really, im more upset that they put my e-mail up on their page... i get enough junk mail as it is.
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Old 27th July 2006, 13:10   #33
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Hey Spoons! In case you do want to send them a message, you should contact one or both of these people:

Angela Sheridan
angela.sheridan@gmail.com

Phearith Chau
xstahsie@gmail.com

They took down my skins and also took down Sven's after he contacted them. They are using PAD in the demo download unfortunately.

Edit: Actually it appears that they are now distributing PAD, MMD3, Venus and Invicta in thier downloads (http://wifiradio.com/cs/downloads.html), which is even worse than before! Gah!

Last edited by rpeterclark; 27th July 2006 at 13:44.
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Old 27th July 2006, 17:33   #34
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This situation is becoming a joke. I hope AOL take them to the cleaners.
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Old 27th July 2006, 18:38   #35
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Thank you!

[This is an official statement from WiFiRadio.com]

Thank you for the heads up about the skin options on the World.Domination build of WiFi Radio, we will remove your skin from the build.

We have received several complaints recently regarding skins. These complaints were about various copyrights issues etc.

We do not support the use of copywritten materials without license or permission. The project managers for WifiRadio were "incorrectly" advised that the skins in the freeware beta were open source. We have since found that that is not the case and we are revamping the site and application to be in compliance with copyright law.

We have since created a substantial budget to purchase skins and interface designs at a rate of $600 - $10,000 each.

We believe that interface design is not easy and is worthy of considerable compensation for thier use, and we want to make that clear.

Designers interested in giving WifiRadio "Official" permission can simply contact us from our site to recieve a license payment.

Hope this helps,
Moses
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Old 27th July 2006, 19:12   #36
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10,000 USD, yeah right. I wonder how high the budget for their webdesign is...
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Old 27th July 2006, 19:21   #37
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I wonder if the project managers were "incorrectly" advised that they could use winamp3/wasabi binaries without permission. The skinning engine and the codecs were never open sourced!
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Old 27th July 2006, 19:43   #38
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Re: Thank you!

Quote:
Originally posted by hidden_shadow
We do not support the use of copywritten materials without license or permission.
Yet the downloads containing the copyrighted material remain available at the website? Very convincing.
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Old 27th July 2006, 20:24   #39
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Give the guy some slack, if he is going to pay for some old work it's nice. And if you don't want it, i'm sure he will get your skin of his site. Isn't this some extra advertising for your skins? Sure it is far from ideal but if it's true, it are some easy bucks!

(except that their centale site sure is a template site )
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Old 27th July 2006, 20:58   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by Naamloos
Give the guy some slack, if he is going to pay for some old work it's nice. And if you don't want it, i'm sure he will get your skin of his site. Isn't this some extra advertising for your skins? Sure it is far from ideal but if it's true, it are some easy bucks!

(except that their centale site sure is a template site )
They didn't offer to pay until they got caught even though they were well aware of the copyright issues in advance. My work has been up there long since I told them to remove it. As for advertising, I don't want my work promoted by a company with a crappy product and a pending legal suit with AOL.
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