Old 27th February 2008, 21:09   #41
DuncanBates
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I agree that the rating should be part of the file. The obvious reason is your are rating the file. Whatever player you use it will be rated the same.
It's a matter of simple design. To store it elsewhere is just strange unless it is not possible.

I built a new computer and was severely annoyed to lose my ratings for hundreds of songs
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Old 28th February 2008, 05:16   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by kyleraine
I think a 1-5 rating is pretty limited, 1-10 makes more sense to me.
I was thinking the same. I would be happy with a +/-5 scale (1-5 positive, 1-5 negative, and 0 would just be unrated). But a 1-10 scale would be just as good. Perhaps you could have 1-10 but be able to choose how that is displayed (pos/neg or just 1-10)?

Something I don't like is that WinAmp currently has rating system adjustable with a single click in the media library with no option to disable one click setting method. The way it is right now is mostly fine if you use a mouse, but if you are carrying around a laptop and using a cat (or touchpad, whatever you want to call it), then there is a much higher risk of inadvertently changing a rating as you move the curser across the screen. Bad.

I do think there should be an option to store the information in the files. Yes, you could backup the database, but why not as an option have the files themselves be, at least in part, backup for the database (more figuratively, if you know what I mean). And, as it has been pointed out many times, you can move your files without losing your ratings (it sucks as it is that you lose you play counts, is there a way to manually set the play counts so we can have at least a partial solution to that particular problem?).
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Old 28th February 2008, 05:25   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by AKJ
for storing:
a) store ration to file
b) store rating to media base
c) store to both
option "a" is not really practical. if you go to sort your view in the media library based on ratings (or even view the Top Rated view) WinAmp would be required to read every single file in its system before it could give you an answer. Simply put, regardless of whether a rating is stored in a file or not, the database will have to have the rating as well.

The options would be more likely:
a) store ratings to file and media base
b) store ratings to media base only
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Old 28th February 2008, 23:21   #44
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I really love Winamp (I always did), but until now it was only a media player for me. Now, that I have my IPod I started to use the Media Library (after using iTunes for a little while) and I love Winamp even more. I love the rating, intelligent playlist etc. But when I think of how often my computer has crashed in the past I am worried about all the time I spent to rate my music. I’d really love to see the ID3 Tag Rating implemented in Winamp.

Another possibility for me would be: Install Winamp on my extern hard drive (where all my music is), so that the database is on the hard drive with my music. If the hard drive crashes, then all the music is lost anyway. But ML and config files are stored in C:\Documents and Settings\YOUR_NAME\Application Data\Winamp
If there is a possibility to map the application data to the Winamp install folder (like portable), I could live with that. In fact it would be great, because I could take my music anywhere and use my Winamp and ML too.

Then the only problem would be the drive letter. I still would have to change the drive letter of my hard drive on every other computer. If ML would work with relative paths it would be perfect.
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Old 29th February 2008, 03:29   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by FlyingHitman
Another possibility for me would be: Install Winamp on my extern hard drive (where all my music is), so that the database is on the hard drive with my music. If the hard drive crashes, then all the music is lost anyway. But ML and config files are stored in C:\Documents and Settings\YOUR_NAME\Application Data\Winamp
If there is a possibility to map the application data to the Winamp install folder (like portable), I could live with that. In fact it would be great, because I could take my music anywhere and use my Winamp and ML too.
You don't have to "wish" for the above. You can do the above. Just read through this thread for the procedure.

Don't email or PM me concerning Winamp. Instead, either start a NEW TOPIC or post a REPLY in the appropriate thread in these forums. This will also benefit others who may have a similar question or problem. But before posting, please first Search the forums and read all FAQs and all Sticky threads.

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Old 1st March 2008, 01:16   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nunzio390
You don't have to "wish" for the above. You can do the above. Just read through this thread for the procedure.
Thanks you very much. Worked really fine for me. That is a big relief for me. But I'm still looking forward to the ID3 Rating and moving files within the ML without losing statistics.
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Old 1st March 2008, 19:03   #47
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I also would love to have the option to save ratings to a the file. I have a music collection on my PC at home, which I put onto my MP3player, and onto my computer at work. Currently, any ratings I do on any of the music locations has no way to ever be transferred to the others...

e.g. I have music on my laptop, once a week I take it to work and do a folder comparison and transfer any new stuff from my laptop to my PC. But any ratings that were on my laptop don't get carried over to my PC so I now have to re-rate the files.
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Old 5th March 2008, 09:22   #48
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If you are not going to store counters and ratings in tags, learn us how to save database even if I'll save my directories structure.
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Old 24th April 2008, 14:21   #49
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Work around for this problem

I agree it's a real pain in the ass not being to import/export ratings to/from mp3 tags.

I've found this work around.

1 Rate your tracks
2 View everything in your library
3 Sort by rating
4 Select everything with 5 stars
6 Right click and choose 'edit selected items', select the comment field and type '*****' or '5'
6 Click on update.

Your rating is now stored in the comment field. Do the same with all tracks that have, 4 stars, 3 stars etc.

Of course if you add new items to your library and/or change some of your ratings then you would need to periodically follow the steps above, but it only takes 2 minutes.

It works in the reverse way too should you need to restore your ratings from the mp3 tags.

1 View everything in your media library
2 Sort by comment
3 Select all those with a '*****' or '5' in the comment field
4 Right click, choose 'rate items' and select '*****'.

Do the same for all those tracks with 4 stars then 3 stars etc. You've now restored all your old winamp ratings.

Personally I use the track# field instead of the comment field because I use the comment field for record label info, but you can use whatever tag field works best for you.

Ideally winamp should be able to do this dynamically but I think this is a pretty good work around.
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Old 24th April 2008, 16:45   #50
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Re: Work around for this problem

Quote:
Originally posted by monstermunch
Personally I use the track# field instead of the comment field because I use the comment field for record label info, but you can use whatever tag field works best for you.
The "Publisher" field is for Record Label.

Ideally, you should store the rating in the Comment field.
Storing it in Track# (or even Disc#) will just throw the sorting order out in the Media Library.

As of 5.5x, you can now even use the BPM field to store the rating,
since the BPM data doesn't really effect anything else/isn't used
(DJ's are about the only ones who'll use it, and that's if the BPM data even exists).
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Old 24th April 2008, 21:31   #51
monstermunch
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Re: Re: Work around for this problem

Quote:
Originally posted by DJ Egg
The "Publisher" field is for Record Label.

Ideally, you should store the rating in the Comment field.
Storing it in Track# (or even Disc#) will just throw the sorting order out in the Media Library.

As of 5.5x, you can now even use the BPM field to store the rating,
since the BPM data doesn't really effect anything else/isn't used
(DJ's are about the only ones who'll use it, and that's if the BPM data even exists).
True. I only use the comment field for record label info because I also use Serato Scratch LiveSerato Scratch Live and the you can't display the publisher field in the SSL library.

If SSL can display the bpm field I might start using that instead of track#.
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Old 13th May 2008, 10:54   #52
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Speaking as someone who just moved his music files to a different disk and has lost all his ratings, please make Winamp save the rating to the file somehow!
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Old 4th June 2008, 13:38   #53
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I personally use rating for 2 things, first : make clean playlists free of songs I don't like (my creative zen is "only" 4Go) and I can't have my hand continuously in my pocket skipping tracks.
second: it's my main way of doing playlists on my pc, genre, artist and stuff are useless since they are not grouped efficiently ("Artist" and "artist" are different persons for winamp...) same thing with genres and album names.
In the end, rating is the only fast way to "tag" efficiently.

When I lost my ratings on more than 4000 songs last week (It took a single crash of winamp)...I was unhappy. But I did not even considerer yelling, it's free and it's great, but I hope winamp devs have good sense and logic (I'm sure it's the case), at least enough to give the choice between ID3 or db rating.

(I also use ratings to keep my song collection clean, everything below 3 is deleted after some time, it depend of the music but it's generally useless to keep an entire album when you only listen to 1 or 2 songs.)

And shuffle based on ratings would be great but that's something else. ^^

small edit: I was also one of those who thought that rating is useless, but when well used it's damn great and nearly indispensable.
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Old 4th June 2008, 17:07   #54
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Thanks for the support everybody!
I couldn't agree more with you.
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Old 7th June 2008, 09:13   #55
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I'd like this feature too, and i've seen a lot of people posting links to ways to do this but the links is replased by "URL submitted by user." How do i get the links?

Pleas someone write a plugin
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Old 7th June 2008, 15:39   #56
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Quote or reply buttons.

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Old 8th June 2008, 07:34   #57
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thank you, that will help
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Old 2nd December 2008, 23:13   #58
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The ability to store ratings (and playcounts) in the ID3 tag is more than useful just for a backup. In a way, I already have a backup because they are on my iPod.

But I recently purchased a PS3 and have been using it with the Media Server, TVersity. So the problem now is that all my ratings are stuck in WinAmp.

I thought maybe WinAmp Remote might be a better Media Server if it uses the WinAmp Media Library, but it doesn't (the only link between WinAmp and WinAmp Remote is the branding).

I'm surprised nobody has written a plugin to automatically (or even manually) transfer ratings to the ID3 tags.

I like the idea of writing the ratings into the comments field. I'm not sure if it's possible, but for my purpose I was going to do much the same thing except save the each rating group as a static playlist. I'm then hoping I can bring the 5 play lists into TVersity and rate them there. I might also be able to use those playlist with tagging software to correctly set the ID3 rating value.
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Old 3rd December 2008, 13:53   #59
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I'd also like Winamp to have the option to store ratings and playcounts in the files, but only as an option. i really like the way the ML works now, since I can have different info in the ML and in the files, which is helpful to keep downloaded files intact for further sharing

I'd just make use of the rating/playcounts export function when renaming folders or reorganizing music files. that's why I think it'd be better implemented as a plugin (shame I have no idea how to make Winamp plugins myself)

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Old 5th December 2008, 02:36   #60
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i just also want to say that i'd like winamp to support already established mp3 tags for ratings, compatible with say WMP.

persistence of ratings is a worthwhile goal.

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Old 16th January 2009, 01:06   #61
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Showing my support for this feature.
Ratings in files support is a Good Idea (TM).
If you don't like it or have some religious opposition to it, don't use it. The rest of us will be very happy

I use WMP with ActiveSync to sync my Windows Mobile phones because it's convenient (four PC's, different uses) and is the best solution for managing content on these devices.
You can easily rate music on the phone while playing, which is great for reviewing new music. Also for controlling what syncs to the music using AutoPlaylists based on ratings eg always sync 3+ star, load up remaining space with unrated.

Winamp is better for desktop playlists, but WMP is better for syncing. I've used winamp since bout 1996 and have a special place in my heart for it (I also purchased it in 2000).
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Old 7th February 2009, 21:03   #62
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Rating Embedded in Tag vs. Database

Eizo_DK: "I dissaprove WINAMP versions of only storing information about the song ratings through a local database, and not the files them selves.
The downfall is, that if your system crashes, you loose all your rating information."

The problem with WinAmp's approach is that you're chained to WinAmp as your music application for the rating metadata. If that rating data can be embedded in the tag, then any mp3 player application can access and utilize this information.

DrO from WinAmp: Any chance you all will rethink this decision?
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Old 10th February 2009, 13:06   #63
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as i've mentioned in this post and the ones above it from me, there needs to be more information provided from people as to what/where the rating is meant to be saved into/where other players are currently doing it before i (off my own back to keep people from moaning more) do have a look into implementing it.

as something i don't use and don't have a need to use, it's only fair that if i'm going to do the implementation work that people who want it so badly give something back in return (since i'm not even meant to be doing such things on the client...).

-daz
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Old 10th February 2009, 20:11   #64
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DrO,

i'm happy to do this... what do you need? the TXXX code that WMP uses?

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Old 10th February 2009, 20:30   #65
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yeah, or even some pre-rated sample files to work against (ideally mp3 and wma with the case of WMP) just to make it easier to test against things. thanks!

-daz
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Old 10th February 2009, 21:43   #66
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hi DrO,

still working on this, but for mp3s it seems its not a "TXXX" code, but rather "POPM" (WMP and media monkey)

http://mp3tag.de/en/help/main_tags.html

not sure about wma or flac, but that should be good for mp3s.

it also mentions using an asterix for a full star, and a - for a half star.

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Old 11th February 2009, 01:33   #67
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@MrSinatra: that's just the info i was needing since i'd gathered POPM was going to be it for idv2.x tags but couldn't find much (in the quick look in a lunch break) as to how it's all meant to be formatted and that's got the fields for wma formats as well

from a look, i think for flac (or whatever uses a vorbis comments tag) it'd just be 'Rating' but there's no clear info i can find from a 5minute search.

either way that's something for me to actually start working with (though no eta as i've a few other things to prioritise first...)

-daz
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Old 11th February 2009, 02:47   #68
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some more:

http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.ph...rSupportedTags

http://musicbrainz.org/doc/PicardTagMapping

vorbis seems to use " RATING " APE probably does too, but i haven't found good reference yet... not sure how vorbis / APE work at all...

i don't have any files of any type with ratings, i'd be afraid that if i made some they'd be "bad" examples somehow.

i'm happy to get you anything else you need, i'm just not sure what that might be?

also, and don't throw a book at me, but might i ask you to also support " TCMP "? basically, i just want the ability to edit the field value [1, 0, or nothing/blank] via winamp. it also exists as:

TXXX ITUNESCOMPILATION

&

TXXX COMPILATION

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Old 11th February 2009, 06:13   #69
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DrO,

here is a thread i think is helpful:

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=59929

fyi, erland is a brilliant programmer imo.

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--
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Old 11th February 2009, 13:34   #70
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yep, looks like using 'RATING' for vorbis(flac)/ape tags is going to be way (most likely safest to do it as a 0-5 or number of *'s as WMP/MM also allow).

i've had a quick skim through the slimdevices thread (on lunchbreak so can't fully check/read it) but that seems to re-enforce what you've found and what i've been able to find (and see from a quick test with the rating stuff in vista and Mp3Tag).

just now need to clear some time to work on coding things in to test how it'll work and thanks again for doing the research

-daz
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Old 11th February 2009, 20:24   #71
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I am sorry to enter this thread because I dont use ratings and I dont really know what I am talking about. I read the previous links and my appologies if this has been mentioned before.
But the great thing about Winamp is that is stays with "standards" and doesnt try to implement things their own way. I did a quick search on ID3.org and for the ID3 standard for the POPM frame. (it will make more sense to you than it does for me)
I dont know if this will help, but I hope it does.

4.17. Popularimeter

The purpose of this frame is to specify how good an audio file is.
Many interesting applications could be found to this frame such as a
playlist that features better audio files more often than others or
it could be used to profile a person's taste and find other 'good'
files by comparing people's profiles. The frame contains the email
address to the user, one rating byte and a four byte play counter,
intended to be increased with one for every time the file is played.
The email is a terminated string. The rating is 1-255 where 1 is
worst and 255 is best. 0 is unknown. If no personal counter is wanted
it may be omitted. When the counter reaches all one's, one byte is
inserted in front of the counter thus making the counter eight bits
bigger in the same away as the play counter ("PCNT"). There may be
more than one "POPM" frame in each tag, but only one with the same
email address.

<Header for 'Popularimeter', ID: "POPM">
Email to user <text string> $00
Rating $xx
Counter $xx xx xx xx (xx ...)

http://www.id3.org/id3v2.4.0-frames?...ght=%28POPM%29
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Old 11th February 2009, 22:50   #72
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@Juanus:

the spec is only a guideline, and Winamp cares more about the de facto, or marketplace standard, than the actual spec. thus why all big apps hijacked TPE2 to mean album artist, instead of band, as an example.

what winamp would be doing here, is emulating however WMP does it, b/c thats what it NEEDS to do. its not a spec thing so much as a existing de facto thing.

i think 4.18 is more relevant:

http://www.id3.org/id3v2.3.0#head-24...e129ff67970852

@DrO:

np, i am anxious to help. i'd love to see ratings in the tag, (and TCMP too!

i think that Slim Devices thread might be useful to you though, b/c it covers a lot of the ground you'll end up needing to cover, and might even have some code you could use.

i'm still confused, what value range does WMP actually use? none/0-5? 0-10? 0-100? 0-255? i guess the answer could be found in a file rated by WMP?

one thing to caution you: however you end up implementing it, it would be good if the solution jived with SqueezeCenters understanding, or else Winamp will lose appeal to those users. SC seems to think a none/0-100 scale is expected, but better details are in that thread.

thx!

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Old 11th February 2009, 23:29   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrSinatra
@Juanus:

the spec is only a guideline, and Winamp cares more about the de facto, or marketplace standard, than the actual spec. thus why all big apps hijacked TPE2 to mean album artist, instead of band, as an example.

what winamp would be doing here, is emulating however WMP does it, b/c thats what it NEEDS to do. its not a spec thing so much as a existing de facto thing.

i think 4.18 is more relevant:

http://www.id3.org/id3v2.3.0#head-24...e129ff67970852
Actually, I am not sure if you read it or not. The 4.17 that I sent and the 4.18 that you sent are exactly the same. I used the 2.4 spec and you used the 2.3 spec. But the text is exactly the same just numbered differently.

And the TPE2 frame is being used as intended. Album Artist and Band are the same. And both Fit the standard set by TPE2. I am not sure where you got this "guideline vs Marketplace standard" information from, but I wouldnt say that is entirely correct. Or else everyone would be doing things the way iTunes does them. And we all know how accurate that is.
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Old 11th February 2009, 23:54   #74
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Juanas,

i am sorry but you are dead wrong. "Band" and "Album Artist" are NOT exactly the same. they are different terms and have different meanings. some people actually use the band tag as intended by the spec.

show me in the spec anywhere that "Album Artist" is even mentioned? it isn't. it simply isn't in the spec.

the Band tag, aka TPE2 was "hijacked" by the major apps to mean "Album Artist" including winamp, WMP, and itunes. thats a de facto standard.

but its NOT in the spec. and 2.3 is better to use than 2.4, as 2.4 isn't really official, its a mess actually, altho i'm not saying the text is different between your 4.17 and my 4.18 but the other issue i had was your link seemed odd in how it presented 4.17, and now doesn't seem to even do that.

in any case, TPE2 wasn't the point, the point is that winamp goes by de facto standards. just look at their RG implementation.

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Old 12th February 2009, 00:09   #75
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Band vs. Album Artist
"That which we call a rose. By any other name..."

As I said before, they both both Fit the standard set by TPE2.
I am sure that I am dead wrong about the text that you sent and the text that I pasted being the same? Please read through the pages before correcting.
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Old 12th February 2009, 00:17   #76
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that simply is not true. here is what 2.3 says:

[#TPE2 Band/orchestra/accompaniment]

thats different from what you set for an "album artist" value. the apps hijacked the field to mean it, but thats not by spec.

also, look at vorbis or ape, they DO NOT use "Band" and "Album Artist" interchangably.

you have your head in the sand, just b/c both terms use TPE2 (altho not simultaneously, it depends on how the app defines it) doesn't mean its by spec. by spec, TPE2 = BAND, thats it.

as to your last 2 sentences, i think you need to reread what i wrote, i didn't say that.

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Old 12th February 2009, 00:35   #77
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You edited your post after you initially posted it and after I started typing. However, I will end my participation here.
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Old 12th February 2009, 01:52   #78
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good idea, since i didn't do that and since you're wrong. if BAND and ALBUM ARTIST were the same thing, they wouldn't exist separately in other tagging standards.

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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BUG #1 = Winamp skips short tracks
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Old 19th February 2009, 06:45   #79
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DrO,

there is even more really good and useful info in the slim devices thread, as erland, a brilliant programmer, has broken it all down and done some real world tests on how some differing apps set values for the frame.

its full of other useful info too, please give it a thorough read when you have the time, i think it will be worth it:

http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=59929

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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BUG #1 = Winamp skips short tracks
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Old 22nd February 2009, 22:25   #80
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Hello All,

I support this feature. If anything since people are requesting it the ID3 Tag Rating feature should be implemented as an opt-in setting in ML preferences. Therefore the people that don't want it won't even have to concern themselves with it and those that do want it just have to check off an additional setting. Good compromise I believe. Any counter-points?

Thanks,
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