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Old 18th February 2010, 21:21   #1
Koopa
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Winamp Backup Tool (v3.5.2 available, released on 08-05-2017)



Website | Download | Changelog | Screenshots

Features

- Allows you to backup/restore all of your Winamp settings, media library database, plugin settings, skins, visualization presets, tray control icon packs, file type icon libraries and even your Winamp Pro reg data!
- Allows you to create several zip compressed backup archives!
- Allows you to transfer all your settings to another PC
Very nice interface with a step by step wizard
- The tool is very fast
- The tool is aware about all of the dependencies of the many Winamp settings
- The tool remembers your settings for next backup/restoration
- The tool can create powerful HTML5 log files for backup and restoration mode
- Choose between standard Zip and 7-Zip compression for your backup files
- Tool is available in several languages!

Localization

If you want to translate the tool into your language, download and translate the English template file from my website:

Download English Example Language File

Please read careful the infos in the language file. You can upload your translation directly in the thread.

Test builds will be available on Xlat* (for all who have access), or I can send them directly via mail:

http://koopa.meggamusic.co.uk/contact.php

*There will be one recompile each day, which includes latest language file(s) I got them.
So feel free to provide as many updates for your language file, as you want.
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Old 18th February 2010, 22:03   #2
MrSinatra
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hey, that looks great. some ideas:

isn't zip supported by windows? (maybe only extraction, not compression, idk, but thought i'd mention it)

will your plugin operate automatically and silently in the background? will the devs be able to include it as a "core" plugin if convinced its worthy? what all will be included as "configuration files?"

looking forward to trying it out.

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 18th February 2010, 22:57   #3
Koopa
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I write a standalone program, no plugin - similar to MozBackup, if you know that. The aim is it to save all configurations files (Winamp.ini, library settings, ratings, playlists, bookmarks etc)

I want all saved backup files in 1 compressed file only, so users can save it on a usb stick or whatever.

The problem is zipping it up, decompression is no big thing. Not sure, if the Windows zip function supports command line actions.
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Old 18th February 2010, 23:52   #4
MrSinatra
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i see. well, very worthwhile of course, but since its a separate and manual operation i fear it won't stem the angry posts. i find backups need to be automatic and silent for most lazy users. but i'll certainly enjoy using it esp for reproducing my install on other machines.

will it have some kind of version check, to see if the zip backup corresponds to the ver of winamp its attempting to be restored to?

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 19th February 2010, 00:04   #5
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Well, sorry, but all I can do is a separate program, if you need a plugin, you have to find someone else, who makes it.

Winamp Version check would be easily possible.

Implementing command line support should be possible too, so you could add it to a Windows task, which will be automatically proceeded every x days.

But I better don't promise too much now, since I'm involved in too many other Winamp projects.

My goal is it to provide a solid backup tool similar to MozBackup, and I'm sure a lot of people would be happy to see something like this.

[Edit]Updated screenshots, which should show, what concept I'll use.
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Old 19th February 2010, 06:15   #6
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i think its more the winamp devs/forums that need the auto feature via plugin, to save themselves grief, but what you're doing looks great and will be useful to many people, including me.

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 19th February 2010, 07:35   #7
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this has been talked about a few times with the whole backup as a plug-in thing and it can't work as Winamp needs to be completely shutdown for all settings to be copied without the risk of loosing those settings due to files still being in use. some aspects can be backed up at the time but the media library i think is the one aspect (which most people gripe about) which wouldn't be able to be done reliably whilst Winamp is running.

and what Koopa is trying to do is pretty much what has been discussed to implement by a few of us behind the scenes as it's the safest means of doing a backup and provides the best flexibility which a plug-in will not provide in this situation without modifications to the core.

Quote:
you could also automate some other things, like onefornunz plugin listings and so on.
automate in what manner?

Quote:
if i were a dev, avoiding angry users would be #1 on my priority list
and if everything was as simple to do as comments like that then anything and everything would be able to be implemented. as you know it's not like that however and there are so many other factors affecting what is or isn't done with the available developer resources that what you (or anyone else thinks is important) isn't necessarily deemed so by people higher up the chain.

Quote:
The problem is zipping it up
koopa: there's a zip plug-in for nsis which will handle all of that (though i've not used it, heh it should be reasonably well documented to use on the nsis wiki. and i'm glad you're doing this tool

-daz
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Old 19th February 2010, 08:53   #8
MrSinatra
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i don't think anything i've said should be taken as anything other than constructive. i fully understand your points but if outlook can do it, and it does do it, i would hope winamp could also do it. a plugin could initiate a totally and wholly separate (non-plugin) process that would wait to detect for winamp to be totally closed when it senses winamp has been been initiated to close. i believe thats how the outlook add-in works to backup pst files that otherwise would be in use.

this isn't big on my wishlist, tho it would be very nice to have. its just that in my observation, the angriest posts could be avoided by this, and so i would think the devs would be into it. if i'm wrong, fine, no skin off my nose.

as for onefornunz, the hope is the plugin could automate the txt file listing of all installed plugins. that way if someone had install failures the txt file would have the most recent plugins listed to help troubleshoot.

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 19th February 2010, 11:59   #9
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i'm just throwing out an alternative view (from something i briefly tried to implement myself a few years back) which is why koopa is going with the approach he is at the moment but there's nothing stopping a further level of communication like you say to have the process scheduled/initiated from within Winamp to the external handler.

as for onefornunz, we've already implemented an automatic generation for the external version but the plug-in version suffers from a few design/client limitations which means i'd need to do some hackery to get an automatic report generated on start-up but i'll keep it in mind for the next full release of the plug-in (as it has been talked about before hence the start of making the report generate with a ctrl+click on the plug-in's config action).

-daz
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Old 19th February 2010, 15:41   #10
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Thanks, Dro.

Hopefully the zip plugin is Unicode friendly. Talked with Egg last night and I guess, we save the files in a fixed dir for first public release. But implementing the zip thing, will definitly make it in the 1.0 release.

Switched to MUI2, because I need more space, especially for the sections. These small installers are good for single Winamp plugins, but for more complex stuff, you quickly run out of space.
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Old 19th February 2010, 19:10   #11
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I guess it's the 'automatic' part that people really want, so they don't need to remember, and are always current.

You can make a restore point(not quite the same thing) of Winamp settings and zip it up any time you like nowadays, in the same way as you would with Firefox or Thunderbird.

Perhaps it would be a good first step to implement Koopa's prog from the uninstaller by adding a backup option to the keep settings option coming in 5.58.

UJ
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Old 20th February 2010, 00:24   #12
MrSinatra
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maybe i'm reading this wrong but i think its confusing to use the term "automatic" to mean "what files to pick for backup" as opposed to "make backups automatically" which is more about when then what.

perhaps the term "Default" would be better to use when indicating the backup tool chooses what to backup?

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 20th February 2010, 00:28   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrSinatra
"what files to pick for backup"
Is for Custom mode only.

Automatic means automatic and will let the user just choose between backup or restore - nothing else.

You should take a look at this: http://meggamusic.co.uk/shup/1266610221/eu.png
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Old 20th February 2010, 00:33   #14
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you misunderstand what i am saying.

i know picking custom means the user can pick what files to back up.

but what i am saying is that it is confusing to use the term "automatic" when that means the user wants the app to pick the files to backup. i think "default" is a better term for that, b/c "automatic" to me and i think many users would connote a meaning that the function of backing up will now happen at regular intervals, even though that is not the case.

jmho.

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Old 20th February 2010, 00:38   #15
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You lost me. If the user has no ability to set any component, what else is it?

In that mode the installer automatically decides, which files will be backed up/restored.

The text doesn't say anything about automatically, periodly created backups, so I fail to see your point.
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Old 20th February 2010, 00:57   #16
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allow me to rewrite this post and maybe you will see what i meant. now, you may still disagree, and thats fine, but like i said its just my opinion that a better term could be used:

Quote:
Originally posted by MrSinatra
maybe i'm reading this wrong but i think its confusing to use the term "automatic" to mean "what files to pick for backup" as opposed to "make backups automatically" which is more about when then what.

perhaps the term "Default" would be better to use when indicating the backup tool chooses what to backup?
rewrite:

i think its confusing to use the term "automatic" to mean the user is choosing to allow the app to decide "what files to pick for backup" as opposed to meaning "make backups automatically" (as in timing wise).

perhaps the term "Default" would be better to use when indicating the backup tool chooses what to backup?

/rewrite

now again, if you disagree, thats fine, this is clearly your baby and you're more than entitled. i simply offer that as a suggeston from a future user, and i would also add that in the future, if a small winamp plugin is ever designed to spawn your standalone app automatically it would help eliminate possible crossover confusion or conflation then as well if it had timing options. again, jmho.

just for clarity's sake, i'd write the option as:

"
Default Mode

The app will backup/restore the default winamp files as determined by the backup tool.
"

the reason i'd write it that way (or similar) is b/c you don't want to be "liable" for saying what is or isn't important, meaning what you define as "important" may not be what the user had in mind, and so don't expose yourself.

these comments are only meant to be constructive, and you're under no obligation to listen to any of them. i look forward to using the app.

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Old 20th February 2010, 22:18   #17
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ah..good one..except why not make it automatically do this, say when you close Winamp?

Cheers, Pete

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Old 20th February 2010, 22:33   #18
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Or periodically as my WinAmp can stay open for weeks.
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Old 20th February 2010, 22:42   #19
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yep

Cheers, Pete

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Old 21st February 2010, 01:31   #20
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Please discus the Backup Tool in the related thread only.

Calling the backup tool from an internal Winamp plugin should be possible, if we're able to implement a good working command line mode.

For now that's utopia only. But it's a worthwhile goal, if you find someone, who's working on such Winamp plugin in future.
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Old 21st February 2010, 21:00   #21
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Just a small status update, for people, who are interested in it.

Pawel made the buttons work and has done a great job with preliminary work on the script.

I've mostly done the backup code, but it isn't complete yet and needs more love & tweaks.

We're already using an English language file, which will be made public later, so other users can translate the tool in their native language if they want.
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Old 21st February 2010, 21:19   #22
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amazing, quick development. not to beat a dead horse, but notice how in other posts people use the term "automatic" to mean 'when' as opposed to 'what.'

a plugin to automate tasks when winamp closes is a neat idea... besides a backup tool, it could conceivably do other things as well, such as apply RG tags to files without them. maybe generate html exports that get ftp'd of your ML. i know, i'm dreaming, but its nice to...

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Old 21st February 2010, 21:26   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrSinatra
a plugin to automate tasks when winamp closes is a neat idea... besides a backup tool, it could conceivably do other things as well, such as apply RG tags to files without them. maybe generate html exports that get ftp'd of your ML. i know, i'm dreaming, but its nice to...
If we bring it to a command line friendly state later, a plugin could be written, which closes Winamp and runs the backup tool every x days in background.

That would come close to the 'auto' feature, which was requested by a lot people.

But I'm sure, even our 1.0 release, which backups files to a fixed folder will be very popular, though.

I've a lot of ideas for the tool, so no worries.

But applying RG or creating html playlists, is definitive not on our ToDo list.
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Old 22nd February 2010, 06:41   #24
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i wrote that poorly... what i meant to say is that i know your app is a standalone backup tool and not a plugin.

however, i can see a plugin whose function is really not to do anything, except trigger other separate standalone processes when sensing winamp has been closed. so, a very small lightweight plugin that, for instance, everytime winamp is closed by the user, then 'automatically' initiates your backup tool. or RG tagging, or ftp a html export of your ML. basically, whatever a dev/user wants done once winamp proper is closed. (transcoding flacs comes to mind, as does ghosting backups, full or changes only, over a network)

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Old 22nd February 2010, 21:35   #25
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if ur asking me, i think the dir should be fixed, and be outside the winamp dirs. i would suggest a "winamp backup" dir be created in my docs. that way there's no chance of mistakenly deleting the backups when uninstalling winamp, and its immediately obvious and top of mind to the user as to where it is. (also helps to support backups for machines with multiple users)

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Old 22nd February 2010, 22:02   #26
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My code is already working like this, it creates a 'Winamp_Backup' folder in user's appdata folder.

Will stay fixed for 1.0 and after 1.0 we may allow the user to set the path of the compressed zip file.
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Old 24th February 2010, 18:12   #27
Kn0tte
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Nice tool! I know a lot of people (including me) have been waiting for something like this and here it is in WIP..

Koopa: Not all people know about %AppData% you know..
How about saving it in /My Documents/Winamp_Backup/ instead?
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Old 24th February 2010, 18:58   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kn0tte
Koopa: Not all people know about %AppData% you know..
This is the reason, why I save it in %Appdata%.

So not all newbies are able to delete the folder mistakenly.

But no worries, once we implemented zip support, users can decide, where they want to save it.
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Old 24th February 2010, 21:20   #29
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i'd rather have it in my docs, as its a pain in vista and7 at times to deal with permissions and so on, and frankly easier to nav to.

perhaps the best thing would be to put it in both spots. let it backup to appdata first, then do the same thing to mydocs. that way all bases are covered. (in the future, let the mydocs default be user selectable, but not the appdata location)

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Old 24th February 2010, 22:08   #30
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There shouldn't be any issue related to missing admin rights, if we save in AppData dir.

I got a couple of mails, from Essentials Pack using people, who mistakenly deleted the Playlist Sidecar backup files and wondered, why uninstallation didn't worked.

So I added a lot of more fall back code to EP and made that the backup folder is saved in AppData. (Note that only the Essentials Pack installer has the ability to completely remove the Sidecar without breaking Modern Skin )

So I learned my lesson, it will stay in %AppData% for 1.0 and can be set by user in future versions.

And that's the bottom line, because Koopa said so. :P
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Old 24th February 2010, 22:36   #31
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thats fine, but its not what i meant. what i meant is that in vista and win7, it can be a pain to simply nav to some places on HD, esp system areas, and then manipuate files in those areas; all this due to permissions issues, "fake" recoursive file structure, and the like.

in a future ver, i hope consideration of allowing dual simultaneous backups, one in appdata, one in a user defined location, will be contemplated.

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Old 24th February 2010, 22:42   #32
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Well my last reply to this, really.

1. You don't ever really need to manually access the backed up files

2. After v1.0, 'Automatic' will save in AppData, while under 'Custom' users can select, where backed up files should be saved.

3. If I save to 2 backup places, how does the installer know, which backup resource should be used for restoring?
But if you got working code for that, I'd be glad to take a look at it.


So to make it clear, how 1.0 will work:

Windows 2000/XP:

C:\Documents & Settings\YourName\Local Settings\Appdata\Winamp_Backup

Windows Vista/Windows 7

C:\Users\YourName\Appdata\Roaming\Winamp_Backup
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Old 24th February 2010, 23:10   #33
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i don't know why this is a defensive or combative sounding convo. everything is meant only contructively. all choices are yours obviously. but as a dev i would think u'd be interested in user input and ideas.

in reply:

1. this is a faulty assumption. devs often put theory above practice, and that is never how it works out.

2. i thought automatic was what files to backup? now its also where to backup? i have to do custom just to be able to pick where to backup as opposed to what to backup?

i don't think location should have anything to do with those choices. its a separate pref/option/setting.

3. several ways to do this. it could simply look in the user defined location first, and use that first, and if not present, then go to appdata. it could also alternatively prompt the user to pick which to use.

thats actually important because such a feature essentially allows you to create "profiles" of your winamp install. ie. you can have different winamp configs/setups switched on the fly. also, it allows you to pick a different backup in case your primary one is corrupted.

besides, if you want to xfer the backup to another machine, again, appdata is not the best place to have it (only).

this is meant only as constructive feedback, nothing more. thx again for your efforts.

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Old 24th February 2010, 23:39   #34
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If I wouldn't be interested in user feedback, I never would create a thread.
So dunno, what you got wrong, I just answered your questions.

I just constructively explained, why I made which decision. And that's a main thing in software development, decisions must be made.

Quote:
1. this is a faulty assumption. devs often put theory above practice, and that is never how it works out.
The main aim of the tool, is it to provide a noob-friendly backup tool, for users, who mistakenly loose or destroy their settings.

We all know, where to find the folder and how to copy it.

Less advanced users, always do mistakenly bad things. I've explained in my previous reply, why I save it in Appdata.

Also, then you probably want, that Winamp doesn't use AppData too for the settings, or?

Quote:
2. i thought automatic was what files to backup? now its also where to backup? i have to do custom just to be able to pick where to backup as opposed to what to backup?
We have 2 kind of users, non-advanced (see above) and advanced users.

Non-advanced users simply want an automatic tool, which doesn't require much user feedback. Something you asked for too, if I can remember.

My father probably would save the backed up zip file somewhere and never would find it again.

While advanced users should have the ability to decide, what and where should be backed up/restored.

Also note, that we talk about a future version, even version 1.0 isn't ready yet.

Quote:
3. several ways to do this. it could simply look in the user defined location first, and use that first, and if not present, then go to appdata. it could also alternatively prompt the user to pick which to use.
This would require an additional bunch of code, with several integrity checks and it's obsolete. You can choose in future, where the file will be saved, so I fail to see the point of having two locations, if the user can set, where the file will be saved.

Quote:
also, it allows you to pick a different backup in case your primary one is corrupted.
Backup Tool will work across profiles in future too. If you can choose, where the file should be saved, you can use the the tool to 'Restore' the settings to a different profile too.

Currently we are at the begin. A lot of things are possible and we trying our best to provide a tool, which will satisfy the users.

But don't forget, that all code requires a lot of time.

Even a simple backup files to Winamp_Backup folder thing is probably a lot more work, than people would expect.

My main goal is it to provide an approved, simple backup tool as soon as real life allows it.
Then we have a stable base, which can be worked on in future.

Just take it easy, I guarantee you that I'll listen to user feedback, just lemme work on the base first.
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Old 25th February 2010, 00:23   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Koopa
This would require an additional bunch of code, with several integrity checks and it's obsolete. You can choose in future, where the file will be saved, so I fail to see the point of having two locations, if the user can set, where the file will be saved.
i was trying to accommodate your valid concern, that i concur with, that dopey users need to be saved from themselves. so thats the point... while i think even advanced users would appreciate the redundancy, dopey users could be saved from themselves IF they somehow messed up the user defined location backup.

Quote:
Originally posted by Koopa
Backup Tool will work across profiles in future too. If you can choose, where the file should be saved, you can use the the tool to 'Restore' the settings to a different profile too.
unfortunately we seem to misunderstand each other quite a bit, (prob my fault).

what i was talking about with this bit was a winamp profile, NOT a windows profile.

think of EAC. you can have many "profiles" of that app, the way its config'd, that have nothing to do with what windows profile ur logged in under.

i know thats not how i used the word "profile" earlier in the thread, but this is a wholly different context from that.

the context here is imagine being in any given windows profile, and while logged in under that same windows profile, you could use the backup tool to create as many "winamp profiles" as you wanted. hopefully you know EAC and so understand what i mean.

this use would necessitate the ability to have multiple backup zips that you could name. (mp3 config, flac config, easy listening smartviews, rock smartviews, etc...)

i know its not the main intent of the backup tool, but its not a far stretch either.

Quote:
Originally posted by Koopa
Currently we are at the begin. A lot of things are possible and we trying our best to provide a tool, which will satisfy the users.
<snip>
Just take it easy, I guarantee you that I'll listen to user feedback, just lemme work on the base first.
i understand, i'm in no rush. its just that i think its important to consider these things from the start so you don't have to double back later. i'd hate to see anyone have to do twice the work to enable something just b/c it wasn't considered at the start. (esp since that makes it more unlikely to happen at all)

one other unrelated thing b4 i forget, but when choosing to restore a backup, along w/the version check, it would be good if the backup was dated, so it could report to you when you actually made it.

PENN STATE Radio or http://www.LION-Radio.org/
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Old 25th February 2010, 00:47   #36
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Quote:
this use would necessitate the ability to have multiple backup zips that you could name. (mp3 config, flac config, easy listening smartviews, rock smartviews, etc...)
Just lemme reply to this, before I go to bed.

If we later allow the user to specify the path of the backed up files, something like this should be possible with the advanced mode:



Just save a backup called e.g. 'Media Library settings' as one zip. And restore that zip only later.

As for specific stuff, like backing up flac config or similar, this will be definitively a no go.

in_flac settings are part of Winamp.ini. I'm not interested in parsing specific parts of Winamp.ini and write them back later to Winamp.ini in Restore mode.

The amount of code would be gigantic, sorry.
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Old 25th February 2010, 01:08   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Koopa
As for specific stuff, like backing up flac config or similar, this will be definitively a no go.

in_flac settings are part of Winamp.ini. I'm not interested in parsing specific parts of Winamp.ini and write them back later to Winamp.ini in Restore mode.

The amount of code would be gigantic, sorry.
once again, i have failed to explain my meaning. i am not asking you to do anything like what you seem to think via that response. no parsing, etc...

what i am suggesting is that you could take a virgin install, and make a backup called virgin.zip (no parsing)

then, you could alter some prefs, make some smartviews, and create a backup called mp3-config.zip (again, nothing parsed)

then you could once again go back, alter some more things, and create a backup called flac-config.zip (once again, a full backup, no parsing)

and so on and so on...

this would allow the user to use the backup tool to enable loading differing winamp profiles under one windows profile.

no parsing needed or required.

have you ever used EAC? if not just try it and check out the EAC profiles feature. it simply allows for different configs, so that one profile can be mp3 oriented while another is flac oriented, just as an example. it could have differing file locations or whatever too. its just a way to enable different setups of the apps config/options.

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Old 2nd April 2010, 00:51   #38
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Backup code was written, and it is a monster. Much more work, than I had expected. We're fightning with some minior GUI glitches now, also need to cleanup the script a bit and prepare the example language file.

You can expect a public beta release within the next few days.
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Old 2nd April 2010, 23:18   #40
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first of all, very cool, it looks nice, acts fast, and i love the "saves the llama's ass line" very funny.

here are my immediate first impressions:

i picked custom backup and it gave an odd dialog saying thats what i had done before proceeding. seems totally superfluous to me to do that, just one more unnecessary click, (i just clicked custom, i know thats what i picked).

there is an extra "s" in the dialog descrip line for choosing "automatic"

i don't think i saw it ask where it was going to save anything, and so i don't know where it saved whatever it made. kind of a pain if i want to restore the profile to a different machine.

i don't see in my start menu (vista ult 32bit sp2) how to start/run the tool again, its not a shortcut anywhere that i can see, (i looked in "winamp" first btw, where i think it should be).

but it obviously covers a lot of bases and ground and i think is well beyond "beta" in its development. looking forward to seeing development continue! great work!

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