Old 11th November 2020, 05:00   #41
swingdjted
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Regardless of a population of a state, I think one vote should count the same as any other one vote. What's the point of voting Republican in California or Democrat in Alabama? Those people are silenced. Worse yet, because of the winner-take-all system, their vote goes to the opposite candidate, and that's infuriating for those people. It leads to resentment and therefore contributes to the political polarization of wing nuts. Why should a Wyoming resident count more than a California resident? Is he/she more important? I get that the state wants representation, but it really ought to be up to the people as a whole if you want a true democracy. If my preferred candidate wins or loses, I would prefer it to be by popular vote, even if it didn't go "my way". Every one voter should get one meaningful vote that counts. In the age of telecommunications, we can access whatever information we need on our own. We don't need electors, and almost all voters don't even know who the elector is that are doing the voting anyway.


As for this election, it was close enough that I feel that Biden should consider the fact that he only accumulated around 3.4% more votes than his opponent and keep his actions centerist enough not to completely alienate them. We really need to find a way to get people working together again instead of following cable news channels that bash the opposing party around the clock, and I hope people someday look at issues individually before making decisions based on what their party tells them to say. I think Biden's win at the primary election was a result of people wanting to move more toward centerism. Otherwise the more leftist candidates would have beaten him. I believe that Trump was more divisive and too far away from center to be a leader that could represent a whole country. He seemed to want to double down more than compromise and saw too many stands on issues as totally right or wrong. It would be nice if we could all just calm down, sit down, and talk to each other and figure out what could work, at least to a tolerable amount, for all of us.

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Old 11th November 2020, 23:25   #42
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I mostly agree with most of your points, Ted.

While I don't think a WY person is more important than a CA person, I do think that WY as a state is more than 1/68th as important as CA state, which is what a simple popular vote would mean (39.5M / 0.58M population). I prefer a constitutional republic over true democracy.

I agree we don't need EC voters, i.e. the actual human people; a state's proportional value should be down to a simple mathematical formula. E.g. where CA's EC vote share is 10.22%, there would be a bulletproof, publicly visible formula by which that percentage is reached; the same formula would also reach the ~0.56% figure for WY. The EC voters could then be done away with.

Conservatives I know find it amusing, bemusing or even galling, that after four straight years of demonisation from the left, Biden now claims to be a champion of unity.

As for the election process, this brief video of Ted Cruz talking to Sean Hannity sums up my view: let the process run its course and the chips fall where they may.

http://video.parler.com/6v/xe/6vxemZpBqgHV.mp4

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Old 12th November 2020, 02:49   #43
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The bourdon of proof is the problem for Ted Cruz. The cases didn't really go anywhere yet due to a lack of evidence. I agree that only legal ballots should be counted, but it's doubtful that illegal ballots will be found in even remotely significant numbers, if any are found at all. It was pretty predictable considering how the numbers played out. those that showed up in person in swing states tended to vote more often for Trump while those that were mail-in were more often Biden. Pennsylvania, among others weren't allowed to count any mail-ins until election day, and that process proved to be slow.


Biden isn't as much as a "unity" candidate as I would like, regardless of what he said in his speech, but between the two, I felt like he was the one closer to to it. I think Kasich was as close or closer to center on the Republican side, and I would have maybe voted for him over someone as far left as Sanders. My problem with Sanders is that he wasn't real transparent or even in some cases honest with the price tags of his proposals.


With the electoral college, I guess I see the nation more than I see states, which I guess would label me a lot more left than those that see it the other way. I've lived in several states for multiple years each (PA, OH, SD, IA, and now WV), but I don't really feel like I should be subject to a different set of standards as a consequence of each move, although I can see some pros and cons of each state's differences. It does hurt to see that in the Senate, Rhode Island equals Texas and Wyoming equals California despite enormous population differences. I guess someone could move if they really wanted more representation though. Honestly that doesn't bother me as much as people's votes going for the other guy in the EC system. Even if the winner-take-all by state system disappeared, it's still not a true vote count per person, and some people's votes will go for the opponent, and I don't like that.

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Old 12th November 2020, 03:41   #44
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I'm happy with the burden of proof being on Trump. I just want the process to be allowed to run its course. The media promoting derision of conservatives as deniers – refusing to toe the line, accept the "result" and refer to Biden as "President-elect" – is really poor form.

If the tables were turned – if Biden was appearing to have narrowly lost – do you think the push to declare the apparent Trump victory would be as fervent as is the current push to declare this apparent Biden victory? I very much think not. I feel that says a lot about the modern media, especially since 2016.

At any rate, none of this scuttlebutt, hand-wringing or pearl-clutching actually matters one bit. Once the EC convenes and votes in mid-December, Biden or Trump will actually be the President-elect, that'll be that, and the world will continue to turn.

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Old 12th November 2020, 10:27   #45
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Hello? Trump already proclaimed victory several times, not to mention the actions of his armed followers, but I guess trying to stop the count by force doesn't count as a push.
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Conservatives I know find it amusing, bemusing or even galling, that after four straight years of demonisation from the left, Biden now claims to be a champion of unity.
Says the guy who has no problem demonising whole countries.
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Old 12th November 2020, 22:58   #46
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Hello? Trump already proclaimed victory several times, not to mention the actions of his armed followers, but I guess trying to stop the count by force doesn't count as a push.
Trump will always overstate his achievements; as I said, all this scuttlebutt/bluster amounts to nothing. My posts specifically refer to the push from the media, most of whom are already referring to Biden as President-elect and labelling as crazy anybody who won't immediately toe that line.

As for stopping the count, I denounce anybody who attempts to prevent election processes – counts, recounts and lawsuits – from running their full course. Do you?

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Conservatives I know find it amusing, bemusing or even galling, that after four straight years of demonisation from the left, Biden now claims to be a champion of unity.
Quote:
Says the guy who has no problem demonising whole countries.
I believe the Chinese government failed to take sufficient action to mitigate against the virus getting out. Call that demonising if you want. Does my opinion on China change what the left has done for the past four years?

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Old 13th November 2020, 00:03   #47
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If the tables were turned – if Biden was appearing to have narrowly lost – do you think the push to declare the apparent Trump victory would be as fervent as is the current push to declare this apparent Biden victory? I very much think not. I feel that says a lot about the modern media, especially since 2016.
Yes, I do.

We can what-if ourselves to death, but it'd be easier to look back four years. The media as a whole had no love for Trump then either (aside from the page views they'd get for covering him) and, prior to November 8th, often treated Clinton was though her victory was inevitable. Yet on November 9th, the New York Times declared Trump the winner on its front page.

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Old 13th November 2020, 01:01   #48
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Yes, I do.

We can what-if ourselves to death, but it'd be easier to look back four years. The media as a whole had no love for Trump then either (aside from the page views they'd get for covering him) and, prior to November 8th, often treated Clinton was though her victory was inevitable. Yet on November 9th, the New York Times declared Trump the winner on its front page.
Trump over Clinton was a more clear-cut victory. A more appropriate comparison would be Bush-Gore.

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Old 13th November 2020, 01:16   #49
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This is today's offering from Australia's biggest free online news source.

Forgive me if I'm sceptical regarding the media's supposed impartiality.
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Old 13th November 2020, 01:36   #50
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Trump over Clinton was a more clear-cut victory.
Was it? In 2016, Trump won PA by 0.7%, MI by 0.2%, and WI by 0.8%. As of now, Biden is ahead of Trump in those same states by 0.8%, 2.7%, and 0.7% respectively (with 99% of the vote reporting, per NPR).

Given the numbers, I don't think it's unreasonable for the media to declare Biden the winner at this point.

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Old 13th November 2020, 03:19   #51
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Was it? In 2016, Trump won PA by 0.7%, MI by 0.2%, and WI by 0.8%. As of now, Biden is ahead of Trump in those same states by 0.8%, 2.7%, and 0.7% respectively (with 99% of the vote reporting, per NPR).

Given the numbers, I don't think it's unreasonable for the media to declare Biden the winner at this point.
Yes, the numbers are similar, even more conclusive in MI now than in 2016. My point was that 2016 was clear-cut insofar as mail-in ballot fraud was not a significant possible issue in 2016, and the indicative predictions, as early as the Wednesday morning after, could be more safely relied upon, than they could this year. We've already seen in the past few days that some tallies have been reversed and some states have gone from "called" to "too close to call".

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Old 13th November 2020, 04:48   #52
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I remember the Bush-Gore election. It seemed to never end and was quite a mess, especially in the media. Different media outlets were calling different "projected winners", and worse yet, some media outlets gave both candidates a "projected winner" label depending on what time it was.


In this election, while I support due process, I doubt there's enough out there to swing the claimed results. I actually don't mind Trump's refusal to concede at this point since there's no rule that says he needs to do so, but I would want him to do so respectfully if it turns out that he loses officially after all the recounting, lawsuits if there's evidence enough to hear [a] trial[s], and elector voting. I'll say the same even if it turns out that Biden would need to concede. "Ain't over 'till it's over" is ok to say especially in a close contest. While I have a preferred candidate in mind, I still want an honest outcome to prevail. I also don't mind Biden preparing for the presidency. No rule against that either. We all have times in our lives that we prepare for something that might or might not happen.



I think I agree to a significant extent that our media outlets are much more biased than their codes of ethics would suggest. It seems like all they do is bash their opponents while producing a severe imbalance of fact vs. opinion instead of trying to show an unbiased report of what's happening. They're more interested in telling the reader/viewer/listener what to think instead of what to know. I'd rather push people to think and draw opinions for themselves based on evidence based and ethics based reporting. This problem is going on with both sides. I think maybe C-SPAN is the only news outlet I fully trust these days, because it simply shows you direct unfiltered footage of what's really happening. I still will see news other places, but I look at it more with a speculatory eye.


Many will claim that the mainstream media hates Trump. I couldn't disagree more. They love him. He gives them ratings and he makes them rich. If they hated him, they'd be tactical enough to make him a "nothing" by ignoring him, which would be the most effective way to combat his type, known in operant conditioning as "extinction". In show business, any attention is good attention, or in reality, profitable attention, both financially and in terms of power and influence. Consequently, bad attention actually helps people rise to wealth and power. The easiest way to create attention is to create controversy. So, the media that "hates" Trump is actually one of the most influential components of his rise to power. When he debated on the road to the 2016 election, the media would split-screen with the opponent speaker and Trump just to show his reaction, something they rarely did with others that didn't have a turn at the time, creating "buzz" and controversy over him, to the point where nobody could stop saying his name. His use of shock-value statements only added to this, and the media ate it up, knowing the controversy would continue to rack up their ratings. Consumers of this media frenzy began to polarize their opinions on the issues to a degree that created strong hatred for the "other side", and that's where my disappointment comes in. We should be smarter than that. We should stop giving those media outlets ratings if that's the way they're going to be, although I guess that means we're stuck trying to stay awake for C-SPAN coverage. I guess nobody wants to read/see/hear: "BREAKING NEWS! THIS JUST IN!!!! A CALM AND MATURE DISCUSSION HAPPENED TODAY TO ADDRESS A POLITICAL ISSUE!!!!11!!!1

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Old 13th November 2020, 08:12   #53
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Trump will always overstate his achievements; as I said, all this scuttlebutt/bluster amounts to nothing. My posts specifically refer to the push from the media, most of whom are already referring to Biden as President-elect and labelling as crazy anybody who won't immediately toe that line.

As for stopping the count, I denounce anybody who attempts to prevent election processes – counts, recounts and lawsuits – from running their full course. Do you?
Ah both-sides-ism, how I missed thee!

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I believe the Chinese government failed to take sufficient action to mitigate against the virus getting out. Call that demonising if you want. Does my opinion on China change what the left has done for the past four years?
The way you state your opinion greatly affects your ability to criticize other people's choice of language.
Also did China cut the US's pandemic warning program or was it your boy Donny?
Did China proclaim the virus would miraculously disappear?
Did China propagate hydroxychloroquine as a wondercure?

If Trump's treatment of the pandemic wasn't an abject failure of criminal proportions then let's hear the things he did right rather than incessant whining about how badly ThE lEfT and ThE MaInStReAm MeDiA treat him.
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Old 16th November 2020, 09:30   #54
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Also did China cut the US's pandemic warning program or was it your boy Donny?
I don't know, but I don't think insufficient warning was the US's primary problem. He's not my boy; he's the significantly lesser of two evils.
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Did China proclaim the virus would miraculously disappear?
I don't know. You're aluding to Trump's rhetoric. Trump could have handled the outbreak better, but I feel that suggesting the Democrats necessarily would have handled it better is speculative at best, particularly given episodes like Pelosi's Chinatown work.
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Did China propagate hydroxychloroquine as a wondercure?
Doubtful. Trump's enthusiasm for that medicine may have been misplaced. I don't see the big bad consequence that you imply.
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If Trump's treatment of the pandemic wasn't an abject failure of criminal proportions then let's hear the things he did right rather than incessant whining about how badly ThE lEfT and ThE MaInStReAm MeDiA treat him.
The burden isn't on the accused to prove his innocence.

Keep in mind that I am fully aware that Trump is a flawed human. Given the option between him and Clinton or Biden, I choose Trump.

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Old 16th November 2020, 09:58   #55
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Every news outlet that I know of, including PBS and our equivalent ABC, projects a bias one way or the other. It's difficult for me to watch much of it anymore.

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Many will claim that the mainstream media hates Trump. I couldn't disagree more. They love him. He gives them ratings and he makes them rich. If they hated him, they'd be tactical enough to make him a "nothing" by ignoring him, which would be the most effective way to combat his type, known in operant conditioning as "extinction". In show business, any attention is good attention, or in reality, profitable attention, both financially and in terms of power and influence. Consequently, bad attention actually helps people rise to wealth and power. The easiest way to create attention is to create controversy. So, the media that "hates" Trump is actually one of the most influential components of his rise to power. When he debated on the road to the 2016 election, the media would split-screen with the opponent speaker and Trump just to show his reaction, something they rarely did with others that didn't have a turn at the time, creating "buzz" and controversy over him, to the point where nobody could stop saying his name. His use of shock-value statements only added to this, and the media ate it up, knowing the controversy would continue to rack up their ratings. Consumers of this media frenzy began to polarize their opinions on the issues to a degree that created strong hatred for the "other side", and that's where my disappointment comes in. We should be smarter than that. We should stop giving those media outlets ratings if that's the way they're going to be, although I guess that means we're stuck trying to stay awake for C-SPAN coverage. I guess nobody wants to read/see/hear: "BREAKING NEWS! THIS JUST IN!!!! A CALM AND MATURE DISCUSSION HAPPENED TODAY TO ADDRESS A POLITICAL ISSUE!!!!11!!!1
I think the media in 2016 were happy to give him the spotlight as a performing monkey primarily because they thought there was no chance in hell that he would become the President. If they had thought he could possibly win, while I'm sure they would have given him the attention he craved, I suspect that attention would have been more ardently oppositional, as it quickly became after the 2016 election.

Rather than love him, I suggest they love to hate him and they did everything they could to both (a) sell newspapers, and (b) ensure he lost in 2020.

With the oft-cited, previously unheard of, percentages of negative Trump-related news items since November 2016, I feel it's pretty hard to argue that these figures don't indicate overwhelming bias, consistently in one direction, over a sustained period of time. Refs: NPR; Harvard; Pew.

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Old 16th November 2020, 10:02   #56
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I don't know, but I don't think insufficient warning was the US's primary problem. He's not my boy; he's the significantly lesser of two evils.

I don't know. You're aluding to Trump's rhetoric. Trump could have handled the outbreak better, but I feel that suggesting the Democrats necessarily would have handled it better is speculative at best, particularly given episodes like Pelosi's Chinatown work.

Doubtful. Trump's enthusiasm for that medicine may have been misplaced. I don't see the big bad consequence that you imply.

The burden isn't on the accused to prove his innocence.
Does that include your accusations against China, the left, the media, Pelosi, Clinton, Biden,...
Or are you perhaps just unable to back up any of your claims?

After all there seem to be a lot of things you don't know, but as they say, ignorance begets greater confidence than knowledge.
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Old 16th November 2020, 10:49   #57
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Keep in mind that I am fully aware that Trump is a flawed human. Given the option between him and Clinton or Biden, I choose Trump.
Trump's schtick isn't pretending to be flawless, instead he's going for the second oldest con: "yes, I am a crook but so is everybody else" and pretending to let people in on his tricks while pulling the wool over their eyes. Every stage magician knows that one.

And he duped quite a few prominent figures too, who felt incredibly empowered even though he just used them and threw them away when they were no longer useful (as any sociopath would), which led to a number of angry books and awkward conversions to "the resistance".
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Old 17th November 2020, 00:40   #58
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Does that include your accusations against China, the left, the media, Pelosi, Clinton, Biden,...
Or are you perhaps just unable to back up any of your claims?

After all there seem to be a lot of things you don't know, but as they say, ignorance begets greater confidence than knowledge.
You're asking the rhetorical questions; it's not up to me to have answers ready for your every conceivable utterance.

Specify a claim and I'll happily back it up, or retract it if it's wrong, or deny having stated it if I didn't.

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Old 17th November 2020, 00:41   #59
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Trump's schtick isn't pretending to be flawless, instead he's going for the second oldest con: "yes, I am a crook but so is everybody else" and pretending to let people in on his tricks while pulling the wool over their eyes. Every stage magician knows that one.

And he duped quite a few prominent figures too, who felt incredibly empowered even though he just used them and threw them away when they were no longer useful (as any sociopath would), which led to a number of angry books and awkward conversions to "the resistance".
*shrug* So?

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Old 17th November 2020, 13:02   #60
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You're asking the rhetorical questions;
Correction: One rhetorical question, based on you evading everything so far.

So excuse my skepticism about you "happily" backing up anything, and unwillingness to do your homework for you.
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Old 17th November 2020, 13:25   #61
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Oh but i had to

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With the oft-cited, previously unheard of, percentages of negative Trump-related news items since November 2016, I feel it's pretty hard to argue that these figures don't indicate overwhelming bias, consistently in one direction, over a sustained period of time. Refs: NPR; Harvard; Pew.
Negative coverage doesn't mean shit regarding bias unless you can prove it's undeserved.
Else you'd be arguing that everybody deserves the same ratio of positive vs negative coverage and you can't have gone that soft in the head (at least I hope so).
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Old 25th November 2020, 01:37   #62
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https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R44648.pdf

The person who refuses to support a fallacy – while also referring to the still-sitting President as "President" rather than "Political Candidate" – is in the wrong. Somehow.
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Old 27th November 2020, 04:21   #63
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I have to admit, saying the media "loves to hate Trump" is likely more fitting than saying, "the media loves Trump," so I stand corrected there. I still think the overall points stand as far as loving to add as much coverage as possible because of how profitable it has been though, and it will be interesting to see where they all focus their attention once Trump's time is up, regardless of when that would be. I guess it will be likely similar to the way the other side treated Hillary Clinton after the 2016 election, but maybe more mentions considering how many networks would be involved.


I highly doubt a significant number of electors will vote differently from what the popular vote did in each state. Like the last election, there may be a few, but not enough to overturn the results, especially considering new laws put into place because of that in various states. It's too early for me to use the term "President-Elect" Biden, but if I were one that places bets, I would put a lot of money on him to become officially President-Elect when the electors' votes are cast. Trump's attempts to turn the tables in is favor all seem to be failing without exception as far as I've seen.

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Old 27th November 2020, 07:39   #64
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I have no problem with folks using "President-elect" if they want to, as early as election night. My problem is the denigration of folks who opt no to, especially since they're technically not wrong; or, dare I say, "correct"?

There simply aren't enough votes in the "voter irregularity" bucket to make enough of a difference, even if they all do flip from blue to red. I also highly doubt there will be more than a handful of faithless electors; certainly not enough to matter. Unless there was significant voter fraud – as Powell sensationally claims – then Biden will be the next President. There's a reason the bookies had Trump at 25:1, when last I checked.

I saw a comment recently, along the lines of suggesting the Dems should want Trump to exhaust all legal options, to avoid any lingering question marks dogging his tenure, as the Russiagate silliness dogged Trump's.

I heard another comment recently; to paraphrase, "Of course the media are pushing the story that Trump will pull a Tony Montoya, holing up in the Oval Office with a mountain of cocaine and an AK47. Because if it turns out that their Orange Hitler presided over a term (pre-COVID) of great prosperity, seeing record low black unemployment, effective foreign policy that has seen the likes of China and Iran stimied, Middle East peace deals facilitated, zero declarations of war, massive troop drawdowns... then the media's reputation, even for Democrat citizens, should be in tatters."

Of course, people have memories like goldfish, so in the hearts and minds of most people, the media will get away with this. But not in the minds of Trump supporters. The likes of Alyssa Milano ridiculously tweeting that she's willing to bury the hatchet, after calling half of Americans racists and Nazis... No, sorry. The behaviour of her ilk over the past four years ios not how one fosters unity. Trump may have laid bare existing divisions, but the left did nothing to bring the left and right closer together. I recognise that the same criticism is made of the right; however, I feel that perception is more a matter of bluntness or lack of tact.

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Old 15th December 2020, 21:01   #65
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Congratulations to EC-vote-confirmed President-elect Biden.

Because a Democrat won, we call for unity now, right? Good times.

New thread idea: Is Joe Biden a family-corruption-encouraging 47-years-to-achieve-nothing hair-sniffing creepy old man with rapidly diminishing capacity?

Because that's how you respect the office and foster unity.

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Old 16th December 2020, 03:54   #66
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I have a feeling that he'll be limited by the outcome of the Senate. It's doubtful that his party will win the Senate, so he'll have to work extra hard to be bipartisan in his efforts. Whether or not it'll be effective is difficult for me to predict.

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Old 16th December 2020, 22:14   #67
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I have a feeling that he'll be limited by the outcome of the Senate. It's doubtful that his party will win the Senate, so he'll have to work extra hard to be bipartisan in his efforts. Whether or not it'll be effective is difficult for me to predict.
I hope the GOP will come to the party on matters on which both sides should be in agreement.

McConnell confirming/accepting/congratulating P-E Biden is a promising start.

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Old 6th January 2021, 21:22   #68
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given what has happened today , it starts to look like Trump fans are starting a civil war.
The last one was from 1861 to 1865 and it seems that one idiot in the white house is setting the USA back to that dark age.

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Old 7th January 2021, 17:21   #69
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Actually it's the period right before it they want to return to.

Shame Trump's just as bad at organizing coups as he is at anything else except impressing the feeble minded.

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Old 8th January 2021, 01:26   #70
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And he finally conceded.

I'm willing to bet that the only reason he did was the threat of getting 25th'd.

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Old 8th January 2021, 09:45   #71
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Sad.

If you want to be a fascist leader you should also be willing to end up hanging by your feet at a gas station.

(Though the most fitting punishment for Trump would be damnatio memoriae.)
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Old 8th January 2021, 23:54   #72
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Wow. Hate me for saying this, but I'm embarrassed that something like this is happening here in the country I call home.


I don't mind those that were there protesting peacefully and within the boundaries of the law regardless of whether or not I agree with them, as I myself have entered our state capitol building legally as part of an enormous rally for educator rights. The difference was, during that statewide event, which lasted weeks with dozens of thousands protesters, no arrests were made because we kept our heads on straight and never became violent and stayed within the boundaries of the law. And, it was plenty successful without needing violence and law breaking events. Peaceful protest should be protected regardless of whether or not people are in agreement.

That said, those that made public messages encouraging outlaw-ism and/or violence should face charges. Those that took part in same should also face serious consequences. I would even go as far as saying anyone that entered the building without following security protocol should face charges.


[EDIT] Just to be clear, I would add that I feel exactly the same way about the Black Lives Matter movement. Protect the peaceful protesters; enforce consequences on those that aren't peaceful. Martin Luther King, Jr. Day is coming soon. He supported peaceful protest and people on both sides need to learn from him. [/EDIT]

Although I believe Trump should become a "nothing" in his post-presidential life as I mentioned in an earlier post, I don't feel we should neglect to teach events of his presidency for fear that "those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."


After this, I would love to see Trump become a working poor person that struggles to pay the most basic of bills while living the life of many of his voters who he failed to help. He would have much to learn from such an experience of being subservient to some pimple-faced teen-aged bosses while having to do manual labor to make ends meet. Jail/prison only costs taxpayers more for his actions. Many of us, myself included, have already been there and have already learned these lessons, but he has not and I feel he should. I don't wish the dude "harm". I wish that he could get a taste of the reality that many of his constituents face.


I try so hard to stay unbiased, neutral, and logical through all this, but the other day really hit hard and it is difficult not to finally take a strong stance after his support of it all.


Those 5 people should not have died, regardless of what side they were on. We all need to take a lesson from us lowly West Virginia educators on how to peacefully (and successfully I might add) protest.

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Old 9th January 2021, 00:33   #73
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Oh, almost forgot...


I was pretty far incorrect in my prediction that Republicans would take the two Senate seats in Georgia. Democrats won both seats meaning they now have control of the Senate while already having the House of Representatives, all while having a Democrat for President. I falsely predicted that Republicans would have an easy win for both seats, therefore maintaining control of the Senate. I'm not saying I supported that, but I am surprised that they both went Democrat. The Supreme Court remains Republican controlled.


So, Democrats have all of the legislative branch (House and Senate), all of the executive branch (president, cabinet/advisors, etc.) and the Republicans have the Supreme Court and many lower courts since Trump was in office when many, many, many high court jobs were filled. Whether or not you call that balanced is up to you. I don't yet know how I feel about it until I see what they all do.

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Old 9th January 2021, 10:06   #74
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Old 13th January 2021, 22:46   #75
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given what has happened today , it starts to look like Trump fans are starting a civil war.
70+ million Americans voted for Trump in 2020. Let's be conservative and say that 10 million Trump voters are Trump fans (the other 60+ million voters being regular folks who chose the lesser of two evils).

Tarring those 10 million Trump fans with the same brush as is used to tar the however-many (let's say 1,000) Capitol Building rioters (criminals) is wrong and unnecessarily divisive.

Impeaching Trump now is silly, because there isn't time before the 20th for the process to begin, and a non-sitting (former) President can't be impeached. It's grandstanding silliness.

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Old 13th January 2021, 23:15   #76
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After this, I would love to see Trump become a working poor person that struggles to pay the most basic of bills while living the life of many of his voters who he failed to help. He would have much to learn from such an experience of being subservient to some pimple-faced teen-aged bosses while having to do manual labor to make ends meet. Jail/prison only costs taxpayers more for his actions. Many of us, myself included, have already been there and have already learned these lessons, but he has not and I feel he should. I don't wish the dude "harm". I wish that he could get a taste of the reality that many of his constituents face.
I'd expect that Trump's base would include working-class and/or rural white people. I understand he promised in 2016 to return industry to dead towns and failed to do that. I'm interested to learn how else you feel he failed low-income folks.

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I try so hard to stay unbiased, neutral, and logical through all this, but the other day really hit hard and it is difficult not to finally take a strong stance after his support of it all.
You posted this on the 9th; was that before or after Trump unequivocally condemned the Capitol Building criminal activity? It must have been after, surely. His speech before the event spoke of a "rally" that he said he would lead (he did not; he went to the White House) and I'm sure he never anticipated the violence that eventuated. Call him an idiot for that, fine. But not an inciter or supporter of insurrection.

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So, Democrats have all of the legislative branch (House and Senate), all of the executive branch (president, cabinet/advisors, etc.) and the Republicans have the Supreme Court and many lower courts since Trump was in office when many, many, many high court jobs were filled. Whether or not you call that balanced is up to you. I don't yet know how I feel about it until I see what they all do.
I'm not sure that the judicial Rs will get anywhere close to offsetting the legislative and executive Ds. We'll see.

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Old 14th January 2021, 00:12   #77
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Impeaching Trump now is silly, because there isn't time before the 20th for the process to begin, and a non-sitting (former) President can't be impeached. It's grandstanding silliness.
I think that's less clear-cut than you suggest. One of the sanctions the Senate can impose on an impeached official is barring them from holding future office. Removing Trump would obviously be pointless, but preventing him from running again in 2024 wouldn't be. Who knows? McConnell might see it as politically expedient to do so to prevent Trump from running as a third party and siphoning votes from the GOP candidate.

There is precedent for impeaching & trying a former official. William Belknap, the Secretary of War under Grant, was impeached and the Senate held a trial after he resigned.

Ultimately, I suspect the issue would need to be settled by SCOTUS.

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Old 15th January 2021, 17:29   #78
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Impeaching Trump now is silly, because there isn't time before the 20th for the process to begin, and a non-sitting (former) President can't be impeached. It's grandstanding silliness.
From my reading of it as a layman is that the main argument that a former President can't be impeached boils down to the wording of the Constitution which specifies that impeachment is for a President or Vice President only.
However is it not the case that any former Presicent (or Vice President) still keeps the title (hense why Biden is still refered to as Vice President). Ergo, he is still President Trump & can still be impeached under the costitution.
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Old 13th February 2021, 02:01   #79
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Trump - the gift that kept giving - even more hilarious than that nutjob Bush....Biden's a boring old fart that likes sniffing young girls eeewwwwww

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