Old 11th May 2001, 14:26   #1
THEMike
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Ok,

I prommised Jayn this ages ago, but then I got busy with other projects and moving house, and a big project at the day job and never had the chance to do anything about it.

I'm going to shortly (10 days time) start coding on MikroAMP 2.2. I had decided that MikroAMP was finished, there were no more features I wanted to add, but I've changed my mind.

First there is the skin bugs to fix. I'd appreciate a good clear explanation of exactly what the problem is, and some sample skin that I can see the problem with clearly. If someone could post that info, and Jayn could send me a message about where it is (cos I find it hard to check forums at the momment due to where I am working for the next few months).

Ok other features to come:

* Skin Dev mode (1)
* Macro Menus (2)
* LucidAMP Support (3)
* No more on-line reporting mode (I know it has enough users to have been worth the effort now!)
* Non-Winamp Skin Mode (4)

I want to know what else users would like to see in the application. So if you know of any other bugs, or have any other feature suggestions let me know now!

I am also considering Open Source under the GPL, as I know there are a lot of Delphi plugin developers these days, but I do use some 3rd party components (for online reporting and the window shaping) that are not GPL so I'd have to re-code some stuff myself.

When I update the MikroAMP then the MikroAMP site (http://www.skinmaster.co.uk/MikroAMP) will get overhauled with some better docs on how to skin, and some skin packs and so on. Hopefully under the control of Jayn.

I'm seriously amazed how many people actually use MikroAMP, my online reporting page has had over 3,000 initial hits in the last month and a half. The current online reporting hits one url once, then at random intervals hits another location to say it's still being used. And the MiniBrowser site on Skinmaster is getting even MORE traffic than that!

I'm announcing here rather than plugins as my search accross the forums on MikroAMP showed this forum was the most active of the forums on the subject.

And I've seen some great skins :-)

Mike

1 - Skin Dev mode suggestion from Jayn: Allow a mode where each size mode is twice normal size for skin developers to get a quick look to make sure it all lines up.

2 - Macro Menus, user definable options on a sub menu to perform a sequence of winamp actions. e.g. move back to start of playlist and play. (not sure I'll do this, perhaps just add some specific submenus)

3 - LucidAMP (http://www.daishar.com/lucidamp) provides windows 2000 Alpha transparency for all winamp windows AND MikroAMP, it has an API, so I thought I'd allow easy access in MikroAMP.

4 - There are a lot of MikroAMP skins that don't have a daddy WinAMP skin, so rather than manually inserting I plan to provide a mode that allows the user to load other MikroAMP skins independant of the main skin on the app. Also change skin on start/new track/other events.

"Beer?"
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Old 11th May 2001, 14:39   #2
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Loving point four, at last a home for all those mikros of mine that are orphans

Glad to hear of the bug fix, especialy the pause state bug which buggers up most skins, however will this force us into re-making our mikros again, or are you planning on keeping the same skin template?, you know where the play and stop state areas of the bitmap are one size and the pause area is one pixel bigger , height wise, than the other two?

Would hate to have to go back thru them all again

On a personal note, I'm sure you will hate this , but the Mbinner skinning part, can we do away with the skinmaster default url re-direct?, I use the MB inner to send people to my own skin site, can be a pain in the arse to see skinmaster popping up always on first load. , I'm sure this flies against your shameless self publicity, and who can blame you , but it would be nice to get the mb to do what it's told first time around, rather than having to change skins,and change back again

Just my views anyhow


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Old 11th May 2001, 20:58   #3
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Uh-oh Mike, you better hide somewhere or Jayn is gonna *hug* you to death

Now is the time for all good Americans to come to the aid of their Country
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Old 11th May 2001, 21:03   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xerxes
Uh-oh Mike, you better hide somewhere or Jayn is gonna *hug* you to death
I could think of worse ways to go, like maybe bunging every hole in your body up with epoxy resin and waiting to explode, that would hurt, well I guess it would....
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Old 11th May 2001, 21:07   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones
... like maybe bunging every hole in your body up with epoxy resin and waiting to explode ...
You been hacking into my hate mail?!
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Old 11th May 2001, 21:09   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Duk
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones
... like maybe bunging every hole in your body up with epoxy resin and waiting to explode ...
You been hacking into my hate mail?!
Hacking noooo, writing yes
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Old 12th May 2001, 19:18   #7
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Im bumping this, cos it deserves more attention and more feedback, come on folks this is your chance to have your say about this great app, man if it wasn't for MikroAMP I'd have to use all those ugly winamp skins I make, so come on, more feedback here ....






"There are of course many problems connected with life, of which some of the most popular are `Why are people born?' `Why do they die?' `Why do they spend so much of the intervening time wearing digital watches?'"
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Old 12th May 2001, 19:28   #8
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Of course it's a great little plugin. Cute skins and handy on the desktop. (I only wish I could master that damn transparency! ) I totally look forward to an update ... especially a bug fix in the pause state for us in the skinning dept.

I also like the idea of being able to change Mikro Skins on the fly without changing Winamp Skins. That'll finally let me use that Darth Maul I've been wanting to use sooo badly.

Let us know when it's revvved up and smokin'.
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Old 13th May 2001, 09:41   #9
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I use mikroamp quite a bit and it always annoys when I come across a good skin which doesn't have the mikroamp skinned,so terrific idea to let the skins for it change independent of what the skin on winamp is.Also,will the tray icon be staying,fingers crossed it will,just wish skinners would remember to skin it.
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Old 14th May 2001, 04:42   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xerxes
Uh-oh Mike, you better hide somewhere or Jayn is gonna *hug* you to death
hehe...smarty....I already did, back when Mike first told me....luckily he survived it

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Old 14th May 2001, 08:25   #11
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Skin bug WILL be fixed. Damn thing. I need good examples tho!

Also I have Kylix, which is Delphi for Linux so there MAY be a port to XMMS.

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Old 14th May 2001, 09:13   #12
THEMike
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Longer Update

Tray Mode
Isn't going ANYWHERE! I use MikroAMP in tray only mode. I can't even remember what WinAMP looks like! Only other window I ever have open is the Playlist window when I'm debugging queue logic in shoutcASP!

Shameless Self Promotion
Voices heard, thought process complete. I will make it an option to disable shameless self promotion mode. (i.e. the auto re-direct to skinmaster).

The Playlist
A thought I had all on my own is to add a cascading menu that lists all the tracks on the playlist with a jump to action on the click state. Obviously some nonces use HUGE playlists so I need some limitation, and probably a turn it off mode.

Development
On line reporting is gone already. The config dialog is being adjusted to allow room for the new options.

I need a really good explanation, with examples and coordinates of exactly what is wrong with the skinning engine.

Thanks,

Mike


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Old 14th May 2001, 11:30   #13
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Another bright idea...

Since I'm tapping LucidAMP, I thought it would be neat to support lucid.txt in the winamp skin, including the ability for the skinner to set the Alphablending of all winamp windows. Just a thought.

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Old 15th May 2001, 08:19   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by THEMike
Obviously some nonces use HUGE playlists
What's a nonce?

Quote:
I need a really good explanation, with examples and coordinates of exactly what is wrong with the skinning engine.
I'll hafta start digging in my files....I made 2 really cool striped versions of MikroAMP, made it really easy to see what was going on with each line.


Could all of you guys who were so sweet to give me all of your cool MikroAMP skins please take a second and visit this and let me know if I've got 'em all posted. I think I've missed some. Please check e-mail addresses too and make sure they are the correct ones. Thanks

Amp...did you say I could post up V-Max?
Assja and DigitalDragon...I need your e-mail addresses

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Old 15th May 2001, 08:30   #15
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Jayn, I have a whooooooole bunch of Mikros I need to send you, I shall get right on it today, you know as I have nothing better to do , you shall have them before sun rises over your part of the world

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Old 15th May 2001, 08:51   #16
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Yeah yeah I know I should have edited that last post, but was hoping to catch your eye if your still around Jayn,

The mikro package is in the post, just sent it now, look out for it, and if it dosn't show let me know, it's not sent from my usual mailbox, for some reason it won't let me in this morning, but you will know it's me


Laterzzzzzz

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Old 15th May 2001, 08:52   #17
THEMike
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Well a very nice man emailed me the thing he emailed me last time it was broken (i had fixed it he said, but the fix went away in one version)

So I think the skin bug is fixed, and if it is then at lunch time my time I will be releasing to you all MikroAMP 2.1a

Featuring:
Skin Development Mode
Shameless Self Promotion De-activation feature

Just so you can start adjusting skins ready for 2.2 (which may be a bigger version increment with the number of new features on my list Cursor support anyone?

Oh and a Nonce is not a good thing to be

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Old 15th May 2001, 09:02   #18
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Thanks MJ...I'll be lookin' for them

Cursor support?! Yay!!

Mike...are you going to tell about packs yet? If not...edit this, and I'll keep my big mouth shut

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Old 15th May 2001, 09:07   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by THEMike

Just so you can start adjusting skins ready for 2.2
Oh hell noooooooo, please tell me you haven't altered the skin template so much that all the old stuff is redundant now, I had enuff grief last time around fixing all my mikros to get rid of the dreaded "white edge on white background" cock up that affected all my small mode bitmaps

Back to the day job

[edit] oh and cursor support, hmmm yeah good idea, use one of the defaults from winamp or something new?, can you make the cursor stick when using the MB as well , ohhhh I bet you love a challenge [/edit]
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Old 15th May 2001, 09:11   #20
THEMike
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Jayn,

You know I'd never want to cast anyone in a bad light? But you can read right (joke!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THEMike in the first message in the thread
When I update the MikroAMP then the MikroAMP site (http://www.skinmaster.co.uk/MikroAMP) will get overhauled with some better docs on how to skin, and some skin packs and so on. Hopefully under the control of Jayn.
so assuming you didn't just take offence, if you would still be interested in taking your un-official MikroAMP cheerleader role to the next official level and help with the MikroAMP pages, skin packs etc then that would most totally rock.

I'm gonna ship your Skinmaster skin in with the MikroAMP install, if that's ok. And I think I remembered to ask you for your favourite of your complete skins to build a MikroAMP that has that as the default skin and installs the rest of the skin and...

Oh one cursor question, what are the file names of the titlebar and main cursor in winamp to save me the effort of looking that up

"Beer?"
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Old 15th May 2001, 09:14   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by THEMike

Oh one cursor question, what are the file names of the titlebar and main cursor in winamp to save me the effort of looking that up
titlebar.cur
normal.cur


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Old 15th May 2001, 09:15   #22
THEMike
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones

Oh hell noooooooo, please tell me you haven't altered the skin template so much that all the old stuff is redundant now, I had enuff grief last time around fixing all my mikros to get rid of the dreaded "white edge on white background" cock up that affected all my small mode bitmaps
nononono, all I am doing is fixing the skin bugs. Fixing the pause issue, and if someone can explain this tray icon bug to me???

Quote:

[edit] oh and cursor support, hmmm yeah good idea, use one of the defaults from winamp or something new?, can you make the cursor stick when using the MB as well , ohhhh I bet you love a challenge [/edit]
Dang that wasn't there when I read the damn thread, people are posting faster than I can reply!!!

I was gonna use the titlebar and main cursors that winamp uses, not extras. File size get down and stay down!

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This space soon to be occupied by Vogon Poetry in Tribute to one of the funniest men ever.
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Old 15th May 2001, 09:20   #23
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tray bug, tray bug....

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, not sure about this one, as I don't have winamp on this desktop, but I think that the paused state on the tray mode jumps a pixel to the right when used.

I'm assuming that the tray icons run from right to left as a 16x16 block for each icon. The last Mikro I put together used a 16x16 template in each block, into which each icon was placed, supposedly an exact duplicate of the next, each with a drawn border around it, when in stop mode or play mode they work fine, when putting into pause it jumps, or was it when putting into play mode it jumps...., mmmmmmmm, it's one of those i'm sure

try this skin here and see what the tray icon does when using it....

[edit] nope nope it's play mode it jumps in, jumps one pixel left, just downloaded winamp+mikro to try it[/edit]
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Old 15th May 2001, 09:27   #24
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Hehe...oops...didn't see that....MikroPacks!!! Yes!!

The dreaded 'Tray Icon bug'....the tray icons are each 16x16 pixels....but the stop (I think it's the stop) button is over one pixel too far to the left, and runs into the play icon.

I just checked...the play is actually 15x16...if you make it 16x16 the stop and pause are both over 1 pixel too far to the left.

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Old 15th May 2001, 09:28   #25
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Great thanks I'll check it out.

------------------------------
The word bulldozer wandered through his mind for a moment in search of something to connect with.

The bulldozer outside the kitchen window was quite a big one.

He stared at it.

``Yellow,'' he thought and stomped off back to his bedroom to get dressed.
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Old 15th May 2001, 12:48   #26
THEMike
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OK,

2.1a posted:
URL

* Preview the future config dialog, nearly all controls in there
* Skin dev mode (I think it may have a one pixel distortion in height and width, please check this for me.)
* Shameless Minibrowser promotion can be disabled.

Haven't fixed the icons yet.

I now dislike the base skin a lot. Looking for submissions for a new base skin more like winamp's base skin.

"Beer?"
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Old 15th May 2001, 13:01   #27
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Bitchin , downloading now , new base skin huh, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, might just turn my attention to that this afternoon, like winamp default you say, hmmmmmmmmmm, leave it with me I'll see what I can do

[edit] now then, the pause mode now drops the image down a row of pixels, is this a problem caused by working to the original bitmap template?, the original template always had an extra row of pixels in it, or in other words it was one pixel taller than play or stop modes, if this is the case then anyone who worked from the original template will have to tweak there bitmap images up a pixel row. hmmmmm, bummmmmmer, tray mode is fixed, grooooovy , shameless self promo, where the off option?, it may very well be staring me in the face but I'm not seeing it[/edit]

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Old 15th May 2001, 13:54   #28
THEMike
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The zip file contains the base skin.

The reason there had been a bug in MikroAMP was that the pause graphic I created was one pixel too big, and so I read the coordinates out from the file one too big. So I was copying an area 32x33 pixels over an area 32x32, and the copyrect routine was auto-resizing the image to that size losing the line.

The new version reads from the correct top left coordinate 32 pixels down and 32 pixels to the right, thus cutting the correct 32 pixel square image out of the source image.

If I am wrong, please tell me the exact source coordinates I should be reading for the pause body.

I didn't think I had fixed the tray mode, weird, perhaps I made that fix and never released it!

As for the turning off of shameless self promotion, the first page of the config dialog has a "Minibrowser" check box. This has a more useful comment next to it as well (Shameless Self Promotion didn't fit as a label, or make sense!) Uncheck it and MikroAMP will no longer send the minibrowser to my site on load.

Known Issues:

* New url for Skinmaster shameless promotion page is a 404 error. This is cos I haven't uploaded the new page to the new url.
* The title bar is still top 10/5 pixels depending on mode, despite the fact it's twice the size (for moving the window) I'll fix this when I add cursor support
* On skin change the title bar source image is painted the wrong size. Wait a few seconds and it snaps back. Weird. Need to look into that.

"Beer?"
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Old 15th May 2001, 14:06   #29
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Jayn, you missed my Meddling Mikro!
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Old 15th May 2001, 14:18   #30
THEMike
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FlatMatt, your Meddling Kids (and Meddling Mikro!) Skin rocks totally.

Love it.

Shame your other skins don't look as good in the preview, but the Meddling kids one really looks the business.
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Old 15th May 2001, 14:19   #31
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Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, well the explanation fits for the pause jump bug, would it be possiable to set the cut point a row of pixels lower?, this would then capture anyone who used the original template?

For example on the new template your pause state starts at cordinates 0,79 from top left of the bitmap, this representing the top right of the pause state, on the original bitmap, or certainly the one I learnt to skin with, that same "pixel" is located at cordinates 0,80.

Wouldnt it be possiable to tell Mikro to start at 0,80 and cut a section 32x22?, this would then keep the pause state in line .

Just a suggestion as this would then keep the original template intact.

More thoughts to follow.....

[edit] oh and if you didn't fix the tray bug, it's sure fixed now lol, the skin I linked to up there , had jumpy play icon in tray mode, and now it dosn't so somethings fixed it.......[/edit]

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Old 15th May 2001, 14:45   #32
THEMike
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Dagnamit, totally re-writting this post cos I'm confused.

Ok my old MikroAMP 2.1 went from 0,79 to 32,102 right? And the new 2.1a one goes from 0,79 to 32,101 right?

So you lose the bottom line? Correct? and there is a single line of white pixels between the top of the pause body and the bottom of the state above?

Ok so if I change it to go from 0,80 to 32,102 don't we all lose the top line instead of the bottom line of your existing skins? Or am I too confused?

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Old 15th May 2001, 15:04   #33
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Hmmmmm, looking at the two copies of Mikro.bmp that I have on my pc at present I find them to look like this....

Original , bottom left corner of the pause state lives at....
0,101

new style, bottom left corner of pause state live at....
0,100


Or to put it in context, the way I skinned this beastie was to create the "master" in the top 32x32 block, then slice the bottom 31x21 section off for play/stop sextions, then the bottom 32x22 section for the pause state, these section sizes fitted the original template layout.

So by starting your cut at 0,80 you wouldnt acctualy be chopping the bottom line off because anyone who used the original bitmap the bottom line will still be there.

My skin template always went as follows.

0,0 -0,31 initial shape defining window
0,32 - blank line
0,33 - 0,54 play button region
0,55 - blank line
0,56 - 0,77 stop button region
0,78 - blank line
0,79 - 0,101 pause button region

So is the new version looking one pixel to low ?
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Old 15th May 2001, 15:34   #34
THEMike
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones

Original , bottom left corner of the pause state lives at....
0,101

new style, bottom left corner of pause state live at....
0,100
That is correct.

The Pause bitmap is 22 pixels high, and 32 pixels wide. It starts one pixel after the stop graphic. (i.e. there is a blank like between the two). This is the "correct" skin format. That is how I intended the graphic to be. However when I was pasting the original in, I accidentally pasted one pixel too low, leaving a blank white line and a blank black line between the stop and pause. Therefore when working out my coordinates for the pause button I was one pixel too high.

This made it squash.

Previously I was reading a 23 pixel high block for a 22 pixel high destination, now I am reading a 22 pixel high block.

If I go from 79 at the top, one line at the bottom is lost.

If I go from 80 at the top, one line at the top is lost.

Now I beleive MikroAMP 2.1a is reading the correct set of pixels, from 0,79 to 32,100 (please note I made a + 1 error in the height in my old posts due to the fact that copyRect routine in delphi being EXCLUSIVE of the bottom and right most line of pixels. ie to copy a block 100 square I have to specifiy coords of 0,0 -> 101, 101)


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Old 15th May 2001, 15:53   #35
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Hmmm so the original faux pas of where the pause state was pasted into the bitmap , one pixel lower than it should have been is the cause of this.

I guess that anyone who followed the logic that the bottom of the pause area must be the same as the bottom of the main mikro shape will now have mikros that jump down a line when pressed into pause mode.

I've just tweaked one of mine , move the pause area up a pixel and it works fine starting on 0,79, however as all of the one's I've worked on have that pixel located at 0,80 I guess I'm stuffed LOL, 0,80 followed by a block 22x32 leaves it in line with the original template.

If this can't be worked around I'm buggered If I can be bothered to go back and alter everything back to 0,79, I guess a lot of this will also depend on which base skin you followed originaly, hmmmmmmmmm oh well to bad, jumpy mikros for me then from now on...........
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Old 15th May 2001, 16:11   #36
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Ok so what you are saying is that if I set it to 80 pixels, the majority of MikroAMP skins will look correct?

If I set it to 79, the majority of MikroAMP skins will jump?

Fine, unless I here differently, I'll move it to 80, and there will be a two pixel blank line between the two.

Legacy skin bugs suck ass.

[edit] and so do damn smiley codes [/edit]

[edit2]And if I really wanted to be cocky I could say that if the pixel above the icon transparency pixel is black, then use 79, if it's any other color use 80[/edit]
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Old 15th May 2001, 16:24   #37
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Looks like it will be a 50/50 split if you ask me, all mine would work at 0,80, but I'm guessing a lot will work at 0,79

I sigh with you man, bugs suck

Back to the day job
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Old 15th May 2001, 16:49   #38
THEMike
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argh

right if it's gonna be a case of random/50/50 type thing I'll stay at 79.

I will add a skin bug compliance option, you can enable the damn thing to work at 80 pixels instead.

Unless I see a difference of opinion in the thread.

"Beer?"
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Old 15th May 2001, 17:51   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by THEMike
I'm gonna ship your Skinmaster skin in with the MikroAMP install
Yahoo! Did I tell you about one of the SkinMaster 'fan email's' I got...this sweet guy said he'd always wanted to meet an 'english artist'...I almost didn't have the heart to tell him I live in Iowa

Did you say 2.1a is here? Where's the link? I got the mikroamp.zip (by the by, the pause button is now 17x16 for the tray icons )

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Old 15th May 2001, 17:53   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by THEMike

I will add a skin bug compliance option, you can enable the damn thing to work at 80 pixels instead.

My hero
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