Old 25th October 2009, 20:19   #1
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Cinema 4D

Here we discuss work with Cinema 4D.

This will help so that I don't have to search through the thousands of counting thread pages for information from our discussions.

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Old 25th October 2009, 20:48   #2
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Yay! (Trawling through the counting thread for all the gems does get quite tedious )

Okay so covering the Ubuntu Cubes
(Which, yes is just a load of coloured cubes, nothing that special except that it eats ram for breakfast.)

The scene was made in Cinema 4d 10 (iirc) which had used older and much outdated algorithms to calculate the scenes global illumination (GI), it also let you use the default light to render scenes under GI. However, both of these factors have now changed since v11.

This means that to render the scene now you need to place a light manually, (say x: -500, y: 2500, z: -2000) and then (since it auto converts the GI setup to the new version) tone down the GI settings (Well you could leave them be if you wanted but I've found you can get away with much lower settings, and thus a quicker render, without too much fuglyness - turn them back up if you notice any though)

To do this:
Click the button to the left of the Cube picture (This is the Render settings window, you'll visit this lots!).
Click Global illumination.
On the Irradiance cache tab you can probably get away with lower settings (I quite often use the lowest which don't look to bad for most things).
From top to bottom: Low, preview, Least Squares (aka don't need to touch), Minimal, should be greyed out, None.


BTW Ted, did I ever give you my Pens scene file?

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Old 25th October 2009, 20:52   #3
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Heh, I think I may have maxed everything out just prior to rendering... I may be here a while.

Currently it says 00:40:41 Irradiance Cache Prepass - Main Pass [1/8] - (3/9) so It's reeeeeally slow, even on a rather hardware-bloated machine. Next render I'll follow those steps and compare render times and quality.

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Old 25th October 2009, 20:54   #4
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Yeah, erm cancel the render then (Close the renderers window and it'll ask you if you want to)

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:01   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by swingdjted
00:40:41 Irradiance Cache Prepass - Main Pass [1/8] - (3/9)
I realize the numbers to the left represent render time, but what all does the rest mean?

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:15   #6
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That's slightly different to v11's, but it's like this (I assume):

00:40:41
Irradiance Cache Prepass <-- kinda obvious, I guess?
Main Pass [1/8] <-- what it's currently doing, and how many steps their are and what one it's on.
- (3/9) <-- How far through the whole GI calculating it is.

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:21   #7
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01:08:14 Irradiance Cache Prepass - Main Pass [1/4] - (4/9) now; I'm willing to wait. Task manager has been flatlined at 100% all 4 cores but with RAM usage at 4.27GB even though there are 16 available. Is there a way to use RAM as a scratch disc like on Photoshop CS4, or is the processor the bottleneck here?

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:28   #8
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I can't believe you'll going through with it, crazy.
Oh one thing, it's good to get into the habit of doing test renders, say 320x240 (or really, in the same aspect ratio as the final image) so you can see how it should look and then tweak as needed.

I'm not aware of any such feature, no.
Oh and: http://www.maxon.net/en/products/new...er-engine.html

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:34   #9
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I should have done the test render. I'll have to do the math to figure out what dimensions would work. Maybe 320x200 or 480x300.

Thanks for the link.

I'll let this run a few days if necessary - the computer is well-cooled and runs a lot anyway.

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Old 25th October 2009, 21:45   #10
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Oh I doubt that it'll take a few days, heh. it's not that complex.

The interesting part of that link was on the middle part of the page (on another link) it talks about the new render instances, which would also save loads of ram.


Want this scene?

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Old 25th October 2009, 22:05   #11
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Yeah, I'll take it. Is there a way I can use a picture and make it 3D, like a pic of the truck or something?

Close to 2 hours now, still running.

One thing I remember doing that might be taking forever was switching from 8 bit to 32 bit or something like that.

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Old 25th October 2009, 22:15   #12
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Tell me when you have it so I can remove it. Gone!

Bit too late to explain modelling today, but simply not really. Best you can do is use it as texture on a surface as a reference - which is quite often done using two or three plains each with a different view of the object on (front, side, top etc).

2 hours, jeez. even if it comes out crap it's worth saving it because of that, as a reminder.

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Old 25th October 2009, 22:19   #13
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I hope it turns out well. The little status bar thing shows about 33% filled. I guess I could use a picture as a reflection on another shape created in C4D.

I have the pens_objs_2.zip saved to my desktop now, so you can remove it now if you want.

2:08:22...

[edit] switched to [1/2] - (5/9) at 3 hours, 25 minutes, status bar looks to be around 40%, It'll be a long one for sure.

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Old 26th October 2009, 06:10   #14
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At almost 10 hours, it switched to [1/1] - (6/9)

I think the numbers in [brackets] have to do with detail. I noticed at [1/8], things were a bit faster, but with larger square pixels of color (about 16 pixels/square). At [1/2] I started seeing 4 pixel squares of color, with slower rendering. Now at [1/1] it's reeeally slow, but each pixel seems to have it's own color. Still really dark though. Perhaps in later passes things will lighten up.

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Old 29th October 2009, 04:31   #15
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After 24 hours and 24 minutes it finished, but I can't find where it saved! Did it just render a preview but not the picture?

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Old 29th October 2009, 11:17   #16
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Erm okay, bad news then.
If you just rendered the main view rather than to that separate window then I'm not sure you can save the picture directly - normally I screen shot it and paste into paint shop pro if I do that, and it would of only been as big as the main view is not the full size pic you wanted.
You probably just resaved the scene file.

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Old 30th October 2009, 22:37   #17
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To keep this from happening again, what should I do to save it as a standalone pic that I can use as a desktop wallpaper?

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Old 31st October 2009, 13:16   #18
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This should help

I can't really provide comparative RAM figures because XP doesn't accurately report RAM usage.

As for times; The simple-ish scene I just rendered (my old wallpaper with my avatar and the flames) clocked in with a 2 second diff (with 11 winning) but 2 seconds is pretty negligible. Probably see an difference with more complex scenes, more specifically ones using the new render instances feature and the other improvements that mentioned on the link up the page. (But my computer isn't the same as yours so you might see more improved times)

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Old 31st October 2009, 17:46   #19
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I started it again, hopefully It'll work this time.

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Old 31st October 2009, 21:08   #20
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Lowered GI settings this time I hope.

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Old 31st October 2009, 22:58   #21
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I don't mind waiting. My computer is sending video files of a school musical to people from my last job (they lost the original DVD and I had to fish out the files from my HDDs), so the computer will need to be on anyway.

5.5 hours so far, step 5/9

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Old 1st November 2009, 16:54   #22
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It worked, but not quite enough light, plus there's this slice of no light on the upper left.

22 hrs, 8 min, 22 sec.



The preview looked like plenty if not too much light, but the render is very much dim here. Also, is there a way to make the cubes big enough to fill the screen rather than seeing black floor?

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Old 1st November 2009, 16:58   #23
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Yeah, it's good that it's in the separate window!
Look at the picture I did above (This should help) and it shows how to save it.

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Old 1st November 2009, 16:59   #24
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I edited my post after waking up and shaking off the stupid.

My first render that happened in the main window was dimmer yet, so I switched to your settings in the first post of this thread, which helped a lot, but I'm wondering how to make it a little brighter yet, and without the black slash of dimming. I'm glad that I can at least know how to render in a way where I get a real pic now.

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Old 1st November 2009, 17:09   #25
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Why is the camera all the way out there?
For me when I open the scene file it's looking at a nice selection.

For what it's worth, it does look like a nice render though.

I can set the scene up so it'll do a nice (fast!) render for 1920x1200.

To tide you over (not that'll take long):
http://qoal.110mb.com/image.php?dl=u..._1920x1200.png
http://qoal.110mb.com/image.php?dl=u...920x1200_2.png

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Old 1st November 2009, 17:20   #26
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Thanks, send any other projects too if you're willing - e.g. wine glass etc. I'll also work on some others on my own on the laptop while the desktop renders. I really don't mind letting the long, long renders go, especially when I can still steal the laptop from my wife when she's not using it. Right now I'm making a 1920x1200 render of the pens/markers.

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Old 1st November 2009, 17:34   #27
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That felt tip pen scene could do with some work, which should be good for teaching some nice things.
(You might not notice but for one the pens aren't quite on the floor, which makes the shadows look odd.)
Doing a bit of mesh joining should make the models look nicer too.

--> http://qoal.kicks-ass.net/ortenga/ub...0x1200_2--.c4d
I set the Stochastic samples and Record density to Low on the second tab of the GI settings, you could make them Medium if you so wish.

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Old 1st November 2009, 17:47   #28
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Pens were 35 min, 42 sec at 1920x1200.


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Old 1st November 2009, 17:56   #29
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Cool.

You can see quite well a few little things that could do with some love, at that size.

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Old 1st November 2009, 20:26   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by QOAL
That felt tip pen scene could do with some work, which should be good for teaching some nice things.
(You might not notice but for one the pens aren't quite on the floor, which makes the shadows look odd.)
Doing a bit of mesh joining should make the models look nicer too.

--> http://qoal.kicks-ass.net/ortenga/ub...0x1200_2--.c4d
I set the Stochastic samples and Record density to Low on the second tab of the GI settings, you could make them Medium if you so wish.
Is there a light present on this file? edit - I added one.

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Old 1st November 2009, 20:41   #31
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You know what, that is the one thing I didn't check and I bet it didn't. *actually checks*


Okay I'm an idiot... it didn't.

I'll do it again.

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Old 1st November 2009, 20:48   #32
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Let me know what settings you used.

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Old 1st November 2009, 20:58   #33
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Light pos; x: 0, y: 10000, z: -6250

An Area shadow (General tab) with (on Shadow tab) Accuracy of 85%, min samples: 50, max 250 would probably make it look nicer too, but will increase render time.

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Old 2nd November 2009, 07:36   #34
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Here's the result of what you just posted. 5 hours 33 minutes 40 seconds. The Irradiance Cache settings were high, preview, least squares, medium, high, weak. Everything else was as you left it.




Here's a previous render I did prior to reading your last post. I don't remember the settings, but the only noticeable difference I see is the lighting, especially on the bottom left cubes.


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Old 2nd November 2009, 11:36   #35
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Hooray less than 24 hours! :P
Well yeah, but the lighting is much more evenly spread - I think it's nicer.
The area shadow isn't too great to though, it mostly looks like a black rim around the cubes.

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/2...12002hdrla.png

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Old 3rd November 2009, 00:06   #36
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What did you do differently there? It looks like you made a texture or image for the surfaces to reflect.

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Old 3rd November 2009, 14:23   #37
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Yeah you're kinda right.
It's the same method I used to light my avatar.
I used an HDR image, which are cool since they can store the light information without limiting it to being between 0 and 255 - like a standard image. So you can have a light source which like real life is really bright etc.

Here is an old (but still relevant) cinema 4d tutorial: http://www.maxoncomputer.com/tutoria...tutorialID=241

I find if I'm using a single HDR image rather than a light the render time is less too - probably due to area shadows being expensive to calculate.
Of course a good light setup uses more than one light, but still. (Although an HDR contains basically all the light you need anyway.)

Edit:
Just for reference and because I can't stop procrastinating, here is a picture showing the 3 different shadow types and example hdri lighting. The scene is a the same for each render.

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Old 4th February 2010, 10:55   #38
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How to do simple 3D text



Select a Text spline from the menu.


Now select a Extrude NURBS from the NURBS menu.


Select your Text spline from the right hand list and a box like this will appear in the bottom right.
Fiddle around with the settings until you get something you like.
(Not all fonts will come out right when made 3d and highly detailed fonts mean lots of polygons to render!)


Drag your Text spine on to the Extrude NURBS and then select the Extrude NURBS.
Only the stuff on the Object and Caps pages are interesting to us.
Play around with the movement and cap settings.
(You really need to just spend some time yourself figuring out what does what, but it's easy anyway.)


And with a little bit of tweaking you can end up with something like this.


Which could look like this when rendered.

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