Old 15th November 2013, 22:19   #1
bjornor
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File rating

Hi winamp Developers.
When I rate a song it only change the rating in the media Library, not in the mp3 file information. So when I transfer the song to another computer the ratings are lost...

I want it to be permanent..

Thank you
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Old 15th November 2013, 22:44   #2
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when using v5.65, go to Preferences -> Media Library -> Options tab and check 'Save ratings to file for compatible formats (default: off)'.

you'll then likely need to re-rate any files in the library for the ratings to be applied to the tag (assuming you're using a file type and tagging format which supports it).
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Old 19th November 2013, 02:24   #3
SilverSlimer
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A quick question: are M4A/AAC files considered a compatible format? I have a lot of MP3 files and the ratings are saved but I prioritize M4A files because of their superior sound quality. After rating about 30 M4A files, I couldn't help but notice that the star rating didn't appear in the details of the file in Windows Explorer unlike MP3 equivalents.
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Old 23rd November 2013, 23:30   #4
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windows explorer does not recognize the %rate% atom m4a's use. mp3tag and winamp do, amongst some others.

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Old 7th December 2013, 17:07   #5
bjornor
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Hi. When it comes the ratings, I have alot of songs and I will not remeber all those I like.
Should'nt this option be on as a default. It seams a bit not userfriendly because its difficult to find out this thing...

Thank you
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Old 8th December 2013, 06:41   #6
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I agree but its all moot now. at least now you know anyway.

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Old 8th December 2013, 21:03   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjornor View Post
Should'nt this option be on as a default. It seams a bit not userfriendly because its difficult to find out this thing...
it went where it could be put in the preferences without having to do a complete re-organisation of them (which is absolutely needed but not practical with dev time needed and without messing up all of the language packs). it's been discussed to death why it's not been enabled by default and why it will not be and is why there is a relatively simple option to find to enable it (though for those wanting it. it's not as obvious but this is what happens with the legacy aspects that Winamp has had to try to maintain). now you know where the option is so you can enable it for your install as it's not going to be changed to default on even with the coming re-build of the 5.666 release as it doesn't deserve to be enabled by default (as per all of the other threads about this).
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Old 20th April 2014, 03:43   #8
svnpenn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra View Post
windows explorer does not recognize the %rate% atom m4a's use. mp3tag and winamp do, amongst some others.
Where are you getting this information? I have Windows 7 and Windows Explorer does recognize m4a ratings.
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Old 20th April 2014, 04:19   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svnpenn View Post
Where are you getting this information? I have Windows 7 and Windows Explorer does recognize m4a ratings.
how are your m4a's rated? meaning, what app rated them?

can you provide an example m4a that will show itself as rated in my win exp?

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Old 20th April 2014, 05:21   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra
how are your m4a's rated? meaning, what app rated them?
can you provide an example m4a that will show itself as rated in my win exp?
Using Windows Explorer
Right click, Properties, Details

Here is a sample that works with Windows 7. If you are asking about Windows XP,
that operating system is no longer supported by Microsoft, so it should not be
discussed.


soundcloud.com/svnpenn/norah-jones-dont-know-why-live
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Old 20th April 2014, 05:40   #11
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I am talking about win7.

I think tho you might be conflating things.

win7 will rate certain files using its own proprietary system. not just m4a, but jpegs and some other files like that.

mp3tag, the "gold standard" tagging app, (and winamp) does NOT recognize such ratings, b/c the rating is not in a universal standardized tag.

I can't even tell how win exp is writing the rating, it may be in the file header or something like that. but its not a rating in the traditional sense, meaning in the files tag.

mp3s for instance use id3, specifically the POPM field.
FLAC uses a vorbis field called RATING
and m4a's, outside of iTunes, use a field/atom called %rate% (as stated earlier, iTunes itself stores ratings only in a DB)

win exp isn't even using a tag at all to do the rating, afaict.

I have m4a's that are rated properly using the %rate% atom, and these DO show in winamp, (as well as mp3tag), but do NOT show up in win exp.

my guess is your ratings, done with win exp to m4a, will only show in win exp, and maybe also in WMP, and nothing else, (unless there is something out there that recognizes the win exp way of using file properties to store a rating)

ps. I really like that song btw.

EDIT: also, just to be clear, when win exp writes ratings to mp3, it DOES use the POPM field. but I don't think it writes to FLACs at all and obviously it does something proprietary for m4a, which in reality, is apples fault.

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Old 20th April 2014, 05:54   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra
I have m4a's that are rated properly using the %rate% atom, and these DO show in
winamp, (as well as mp3tag), but do NOT show up in win exp.
Okay Windows Explorer aside, my m4a files do not show ratings in Winamp. Not
only that, but I see no way to rate them using Winamp.

Again I am using Winamp 5.666 with "Big Bento" skin on Windows 7.
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Old 20th April 2014, 06:00   #13
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do you have the ML plugin?

you can rate them in winamp in either the tracks pane in ML in the ratings column, OR in the file info pane to the right of the player controls. you do need to go into winamp prefs and turn on the ability to write tags to files, as it is NOT on by default, unfortunately.

EDIT: in addition, your file had no tags at all, when I added artist, title info, etc, the rating box/stars became available afterwards (meaning in the file info box to the right of player controls)

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Old 20th April 2014, 06:35   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra
do you have the ML plugin?
I reinstalled Winamp and I am now seeing Rating field in the "File Info" pane.
Not sure what was causing the problem. Thanks!
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Old 20th April 2014, 07:30   #15
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Okay I found the source of the problem. On both "Bento" and "Big Bento" skin, if
you uncheck "Show Decoder" under "File Info Components", you will lose display
of M4A ratings. Note MP3 files are not affected.

This is strange because the Rating should be able to be seen, without seeing the
Decoder.
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Old 20th April 2014, 08:07   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svnpenn View Post
Okay I found the source of the problem. On both "Bento" and "Big Bento" skin, if
you uncheck "Show Decoder" under "File Info Components", you will lose display
of M4A ratings. Note MP3 files are not affected.

This is strange because the Rating should be able to be seen, without seeing the
Decoder.
that is actually NOT accurate.

did you see this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra View Post
EDIT: in addition, your file had no tags at all, when I added artist, title info, etc, the rating box/stars became available afterwards (meaning in the file info box to the right of player controls)
that rating is still available to me AFTER unchecking "show decoder" as long as the m4a has any kind of tag.

it is not available to me if there is no tag, regardless of if show decoder is checked or not.

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Old 20th April 2014, 08:20   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra
it is not available to me if there is no tag, regardless of if
show decoder is checked or not.
True.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSinatra
that rating is still available to me AFTER unchecking "show decoder" as long as
the m4a has any kind of tag.
While it is true the file I linked earlier has no tags, I have some M4A files
with only a "Title" tag. Even though these files have a tag, the displayed
rating will disappear if decoder is unchecked.
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Old 20th April 2014, 08:31   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svnpenn View Post
While it is true the file I linked earlier has no tags, I have some M4A files
with only a "Title" tag. Even though these files have a tag, the displayed
rating will disappear if decoder is unchecked.
well, decoder should be checked.

but as long as you have an artist value in the tag, it [the ratings box] will be shown even if decoder is unchecked.

sounds like a very minor race condition bug.

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Old 20th April 2014, 11:21   #19
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interesting....

DL'd a mp3, had no v1 tag but did have a v2 tag but it was blank. had "show decoder" checked.

couldn't see the rating box.

filled in artist.

still couldn't see the rating box.

filled in title as well, and THEN I COULD see the rating box.

now, I am using the so called 105 ver of the decoder, so maybe that has something to do with it, maybe not. but even when the show decoder check is on, this bug can surface, and apparently how it will surface will vary from format to format.

my advice to all is to always keep show decoder on, and use at least artist and title tags, at a minimum.

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Old 20th April 2014, 22:16   #20
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check out this thread:

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?t=376798

sounds like DrO has determined that win exp in win7 writes its own proprietary atom for ratings in m4a. its too bad win7 doesn't just support the %rate% atom that everyone else uses.

EDIT: something else that occurs to me, is that windows has a well known bug that when you rate a file with it (or WMP), it will destroy RG tags. now, I am only sure that bug applies to mp3/id3, but it may apply elsewhere as well, like with m4a.

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Last edited by MrSinatra; 20th April 2014 at 23:59.
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Old 21st April 2014, 07:17   #21
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This commit fixes the Rating issue.


github.com/svnpenn/grand-bento/commit/12d7704
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Old 21st April 2014, 09:13   #22
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did u make your own ver of bento? that's pretty cool.

just to be clear, as I showed above, the ratings box could disappear even if "show decoder" WAS checked. it just seemed to happen more often if it wasn't.

does your fix then apply to that scenario as well? seems like it would.

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Old 21st April 2014, 09:30   #23
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Yes I have my own version with a few fixes. I have about 10 more commits that I
have written but need to push through.

If you can link to the MP3 I will test it.
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Old 21st April 2014, 09:45   #24
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just take one of your mp3s, copy it, play it, and doubleclick the ticker as it plays and you get the alt+3 dialog.

there, you can uncheck all the tags, and click ok to save it. it will be tagless then. then alt+3 again and you can add a blank v2 tag.

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Old 21st April 2014, 09:54   #25
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the skin doesn't get additional tag updates once its playing (I've not read the rest of the posts fully as there's just too much waffle to pay attention to on a small screen but what is posted sounds like I've guessed right).

ideally more needs to be added from some of the 5.66x api additions to have them exposed to the skin engine so it can better track tag changes (which would help with the long running rating display not updating on all updates issue). which is on my more immediate to do list.
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Old 21st April 2014, 10:01   #26
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I only told him to play it so it would be easy to doubleclick it to get to alt+3.

when you have time to give this a good read, there are some interesting minor bugs here that it looks like he might solve via changes to the skin.

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Old 21st April 2014, 10:14   #27
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I'm already aware of some of the changes svnpenn has made to the bento skin which I may roll back into the official versions.

though the above change still has issues as it'll still show if the library is not present and the input plug-in for the format does not support rating tags - it's ok if the library is present as then it should be able to store it, but if not present and the input plug-in doesn't support it, then the rating field really shouldn't be displayed or if it is then editing needs to be disabled.
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Old 21st April 2014, 20:51   #28
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yes, those are good points. I'm more interested tho in the weird inconsistencies... like why does "show decoder" impact any of this one way or the other? and why on mp3 do u need both artist and title but on m4a only artist?

I realize its probably not that fascinating to you, it likely has ordinary picayune origins, but I find it really interesting.

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Old 21st April 2014, 20:59   #29
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because that's just how martin et al coded the skin to work. and if it's basing things on the metadata available, different plug-ins sometimes do things a bit differently which could cause differing views. but as i've not looked into the specifics, i can only speculate on what i remember.
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Old 22nd April 2014, 12:55   #30
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i've made changes for when we get a new client which will do like i proposed above (as it needs a core change in gen_ff and also all applicable plug-ins to be updated outside of skin file changes).

so it make use of the patch (removing the 'n' check) and will then make use of the @HAVE_LIBRARY@ value (as an extra parameter to the fileinfo.maki script i.e. it needs some xml file changes as well to the maki changes) which will make use of that along with a new "rateable" metadata field to determine when to show the rating line or not.

so if the library is present it'll always show. if the library is not present and "rateable" returns 1 (which indicates the format can support native read/write of ratings) then it'll show it, otherwise it'll not show the rating item. that'll do enough to cope with full vs weird non-ml+modern skin setups and "rateable" has potential uses else where the client (so the means to disable rating aspects in other parts of the ui based on the selection at the time, etc).
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Old 22nd April 2014, 12:59   #31
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sweet, I look forward to testing it out!

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Old 22nd April 2014, 13:07   #32
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you'll be waiting a while
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