Old 26th February 2011, 00:51   #1
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New Bike??

Thinking about getting a bike. Down to 2 bikes I think.

Cannondale F8 $420(on sale from $500)

Raleigh Talus 3.0 $350


Main thing is the F8 has disc brakes and the Talus doesn't. Other than that they're pretty close in comfort and durability/reliability. I got to ride both. I'm leaning towards the Cannondale but not sure. Any thoughts?

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Old 26th February 2011, 02:42   #2
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links?

also, i currently have a trek 4series 4300 which is a bit above your price range for the ones you listed but my old one was a mongoose full suspension instead of a hardtail like this one and i'd never ever consider looking back on that purchase, it's incredibly fast and easy to pedal, sometimes i swear this thing thinks it's a pavement only racer, it doesn't get me too many warnings for speeding though (just one, so far) and has been pretty reliable as well.

i'm not sure of it's exact weight with all my gear and stuff, but my roommate has a crappy little BMX type Next (brand) bike and this one despite being much larger, nicer and having front fork suspension weighs less than two of the bottom of the barrel Next.

http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...4_series/4300/

also, unless you really really plan to wade through puddles a lot, i wouldn't pay (much) more for disc brakes than standard.

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Old 26th February 2011, 03:47   #3
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Cannondale F8

Raleigh Talus 3.0

I do tend to ride in all weather conditions so disc brakes would be of benefit. And I've been screwing up my Outlook so much recently.

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Old 26th February 2011, 04:19   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deeder7001 View Post
I do tend to ride in all weather conditions so disc brakes would be of benefit. And I've been screwing up my Outlook so much recently.
same here actually, my point was mainly that i've yet to find any weather conditions that make the standard non-disc seem like a regret, i've ridden the trek in some bad rain fairly often and i've yet to see the non-disc brakes slip because of it.


they do both look pretty comparable, i couldn't tell for sure but both look to have an adjustable preload on the front fork suspension and (hopefully) a lockout for same as well, both have double wall rims as well.

personally i'd keep my trek compared to both of those, but neither looks "that bad"

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Old 26th February 2011, 04:33   #5
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Only issues I've had with the non-disc brakes is the rim that needs truing. Which is why I'm even considering the Cannondale. Though I haven't had a real big problem with that.

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Old 26th February 2011, 05:25   #6
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well depending on how flexible you are price wise $189 more would get you both disc brakes and triple wall rims on the trek 4300 disc model.

i was honestly extremely tempted to go for the model with the disc brakes too personally, i picked it up for around $650 total and decided i was already borrowing enough that $750 was a bit much to ask.

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Old 26th February 2011, 15:27   #7
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I'm going to go back either today or tomorrow. I want to ask questions but don't really know what to ask. Any tips/suggestions?

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Old 26th February 2011, 23:28   #8
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ask what the weight difference if any between the two is about all i can think of.

always good to ask the proprietor for recommendations too.

can't really say i can think of many burning questions you shouldn't miss asking though.

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Old 1st March 2011, 09:04   #9
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I bought a Giant Transend DX a couple years ago ($500). I've added a few things here or there. It's a commuter style, all aluminum. Came with a rack and fenders. Tough bike. Very light. Can hold up 200lbs of me + 100 lbs of cargo. I am not sure I wouldn't rather have a steel frame. Steel gives a little. This aluminum frame translates a lot of road bumpiness into the handle bars. It is light though, so it's a tradeoff. It's not a racer, but it'll move along pretty well.

I don't think disk brakes are a big deal. Calipers will stop you. The thing I have been considering is the internal drivetrain Shimano came up with. It's 8 speed. It also will let you shift when stopped. That seems like it might be a real nice thing for comfortable riding. It will push you past the $500 mark, so I didn't buy the Transend EX. It has disk brakes and the internal drive.

Use a bike shop when you buy, and then buy something you like. Most of these bikes have the same parts anyway.

If you have a Giant dealer near you, you might check out:

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-US/...na/7357/44082/

I can swear by these Alluxx alloy frames. Very light, very tough.

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Old 1st March 2011, 20:44   #10
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Quote:
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The thing I have been considering is the internal drivetrain Shimano came up with. It's 8 speed. It also will let you shift when stopped.
interesting, i have to wonder if it'll take as well to shifting more than one gear at once as well as the standard type, i do that a lot riding my Trek - especially since it has a nice amount of total gears - and it really helps to maintain gain speed quickly, the one time i got a speeding warning as i mentioned i timed that up and down sidewalk driveway slopes, almost like slingshotting yourself.

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I'm going to go back either today or tomorrow. I want to ask questions but don't really know what to ask. Any tips/suggestions?
here's the real question, what'd you wind up getting?

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Old 1st March 2011, 22:03   #11
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I just can't think of how many times I didn't downshift and ended up having to stand on the pedals to get started again. I have tried these. I didn't think it was worth the money at the time, but I might be reconsidering.

I don't see the Transend DX in the 2011 catalog. The EX is there, with the internal shifter and disk brakes. Retail $920. It was $700 for a EX and $500 for a DX when I bought mine.

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/...le/2306/32160/

I'm going on the third year of owning one of these. I probably ride about 20 miles a week just to exercise the dog. I usually don't fire up the car unless I'm going more than a couple miles. Maybe altogether 40 or 50 miles a week.

I can't bitch about the quality of the bike. I did get strong enough to twist the front crankset out of it at about a year and a half and bend the pedals. Bike n' Hike replaced it free, even though it was out of warranty. I don't think you would have a different story given that almost all of these bikes in the price range have the same drive parts. Even being an old guy, I still can leg press 900 lbs.
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Old 1st March 2011, 22:17   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Too-DAMN-Much

here's the real question, what'd you wind up getting?
So far I haven't gone back to the place. I don't know if I trust the guy there. He seems more of a car salesman or something. I ask to look at Diamondback and he shows me the higher-end/more expensive stuff. Still leaning Cannondale but we'll see when it comes time to buy.

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Old 1st March 2011, 22:22   #13
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He might be right. $500 is really on the low end of anything you'd really want to be riding. It's the reason I picked the Transend. It was the cheapest bike I found that I thought would be worth riding. I wanted fenders, and a rack. I added a shock seat post and a gel seat. I changed the handlebars to get me more upright and save my old back a little.

With saddlebags and lights, I'm probably in it about $800. But hell, I'm going into the third riding season and everything seems to be holding together nice. You'd have to look pretty close to tell the bike isn't new.
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Old 1st March 2011, 22:31   #14
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I'm not a big time rider so much. I rode a bike because I didn't want to walk several miles a day to work. I may end up just saving for a car.

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Old 1st March 2011, 22:36   #15
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If you are commuting, I'd nix the idea of a mountain bike and get a 700c bike with fenders. With my bike, a few miles doesn't matter. I rather enjoy riding. I usually tool along at 15 or 20 without beating myself up.
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Old 1st March 2011, 22:39   #16
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In Merced a mountain bike was a better idea because the streets aren't always in good condition. Maybe one of those "hybrid" bikes could be something to look at. I also enjoy a good bike ride. Just hate riding in the rain though.

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Old 1st March 2011, 22:42   #17
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I'd have to say, the double wall rims I have on this bike are very strong. I've hit a quite a few potholes, jumped off curbs... stuff like that.... never have used a spoke wrench yet. I remember the old days, when this would have been a weekly maintenance thing.
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Old 1st March 2011, 22:43   #18
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Quote:
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I rather enjoy riding. I usually tool along at 15 or 20 without beating myself up.
same here, i had no clue how nice going from a mongoose piece of shit to a real bike would wind up being.

it was literally like riding without a few hundred pounds of deadweight on my back, night and day difference to say the least.

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Old 3rd March 2011, 00:20   #19
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Sticking with hard-tail is very, very smart. Rear suspensions absorb loads of pedaling power. Also, if you're not on a mountain or lots of roots and rocks, and you're not actually competing for anything, don't get a mountain bike; they're a waste of weight. You'd be better off with a hybrid or comfort bike.

With brakes, V-style brakes are a need in my opinion, whereas disc brakes are only necessary in mud or long-term downhill wet riding. The cheap brakes that came before V-brakes are unacceptable and unsafe for street riding if you ask me.

I will agree that Trek bikes are excellent, so much so that although I loved mine (a pretty well decked out 4900) when I had it from 2002-2004, someone also loved it and stole it. I can also say that I have ridden some Giants and also liked them. Cops/police stations often use Giant brand bikes. I have some limited experience with the brand "Specialized", but I didn't seem to get used to or comfortable with them. I hear GT and Gary Fisher are good, but I have no experience with them.

If you can afford it, trigger shifting is worth a lot to someone who rides often, and once you use it, you'll hate everything that doesn't use it.

Make sure you budget for a helmet, water bottle cage, and security cable, but don't depend too much on that cable - I had a very thick one and it was bolt-cut right off the back of Renee's car.

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Old 3rd March 2011, 10:11   #20
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The ones you used to want to have were "center pull" but the newer caliper brakes work just fine. I would forget cable locks, get a big, heavy nasty U-lock. Damn bike stealers have cordless grinders. It'll cut through a cable like butter. I have one made by "OnGuard". Cost about $50, but hell, the bike hasn't gone missing. I had a bike just like mine go missing with a 3/4 inch cable off my front porch. If you are leaving your bike someplace unattended, take the front wheel off and put in in the "U".

Quote:
same here, i had no clue how nice going from a mongoose piece of shit to a real bike would wind up being.

it was literally like riding without a few hundred pounds of deadweight on my back, night and day difference to say the least.
No kidding. You wouldn't think there would be that much difference between riding something decent and a piece of shit, but it is about like that.... isn't it?

One more thing you want.... absolutely... is tire liners. They make poly stripping that you can stick between tube and tire. It doesn't improve the ride, but it makes your tires damn near bulletproof. I was bitching at the bike shop about flat tires. Dude turned me on and I haven't had a flat since.

I'm an old guy and 20 miles doesn't even make me break a sweat. I describe this as a good bike being a "walking amplifier". A decent bike works for you, not against you. I've been riding for more than 40 years. If you don't chimp out and buy something halfway decent, these new bikes are killer.

Quote:
Just hate riding in the rain though.
Get some decent clothes, and a decent bike.... it shouldn't confront you much. I ride all year. Fenders is the thing. Otherwise, you'll get that nasty mud stripe up your ass.

I think if you find cycling to be a bitch, and not a joy, you didn't get the right ride. I put the comfy gel seat, with a shock post on mine. Some handlebars that were longer to get my old back straighter. The end is a bike that doesn't hurt me anyplace. A guy can tool along pretty effortless. I'd rather ride 10 miles than walk a mile.

If it fits, and you get it dialed in the way you like it, and it doesn't hurt you anywhere, a bike is a great tool. It's never been cheaper to get a good ride.
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Old 4th March 2011, 01:42   #21
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Quote:
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If it fits,

You know, we could talk brands, features, and pricing until we're blue in the face, but really, what I quoted matters more than almost anything (except maybe safety like brakes and a helmet). Anyone considering buying a bike should start by finding someone who knows their shit, and having that person measure you for the right fit. I think that makes the biggest difference in bicycle selection. I'm rather upset at myself for not bringing that up earlier.

Also, when considering price range... consider the price of gasoline, insurance, parking, maintenance, repair, payments, etc. that one must pay if they drive instead of biking. Even expensive bicycles could pay for themselves a few times over if they don't get stolen.

Are you sure you meant 3/4 inch cable? That's a full pound per foot meant to easily lift at least literally 23+ tons (46,000 pounds). That stuff wouldn't likely be flexible enough to use as a bicycle security line, but I'd sure get a good laugh if I saw someone trying to use it for that. 3/4" is more common for hard core crane use.

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Old 8th March 2011, 08:51   #22
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The lock I have now is "case hard" steel. It is also not impenetrable to a cordless grinder, It might survive 3 or 4 minutes. The difference is that you would make a hell of a lot of noise cutting it.

Considering that a thief was able to cut through a heavy cable taking a bike off my front porch when I was sleeping..... I'd consider cables completely ineffective. It wouldn't have mattered if the cable was 2". It's a cable. Cutting strands is easy and unfortunately quiet.

Quote:
Even expensive bicycles could pay for themselves a few times over if they don't get stolen.
Really, I think even if they do get stolen once in a while. I've spend about 3G's on bikes in the last 20 years. Their fate is usually theft. Even with that, they had to save me well more than their cost. Plus I enjoy riding. Plus my pooches love "walkies". It's really hard to adequately exercise a dog on foot. A well exercised daddy and a well exercised pooch leads to harmony.

I have lost 2 bikes that I locked with heavy cable. Get a case hard U-lock ($50), take the front wheel off and put it in there too. How many have I lost with that setup? None (knock on wood).

If someone wants your shit, they will get it. Making that a bitch is indicated. I sometimes gripe that I ride a 29lb bicycle and have to add a 6 lb lock.
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Old 8th March 2011, 12:58   #23
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Really, I think even if they do get stolen once in a while. I've spend about 3G's on bikes in the last 20 years.
honestly, with that shitty little mongoose one i used to have i might agree with you on that, but the only bicycle i've ever had stolen was by a black person when i was young and got tricked into basically letting him pedal off on it, furthermore if my current one gets stolen i can safely say i won't even look into getting it replaced, it just cost too much to begin with and it'd compete for money with other life necessities if it needed replaced suddenly (like the computer, obviously)

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Get a case hard U-lock ($50), take the front wheel off and put it in there too. How many have I lost with that setup? None (knock on wood).
typically if i'm just going to a mini-mart type thing i'll set the front light to flash and aim it through the window that way it's easy to tell if someone thinks they're smart and needs an ass kicking, if i'm going to the grocery though typically i'll lock it up with one of those kryptonite U lock things you were talking about, or leave it just inside the door, the lock came with a cable for stringing through the wheels, but honestly it's just too much to fuck with if i'm not going to be in there for more than an hour, it takes me roughly somewhere around 5-10 minutes to lock it up entirely U-Bar and Cable both.

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Old 8th March 2011, 23:16   #24
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How are you going to catch someone who you just saw stealing your bike at the grocery store - they pick it up, toss it in a pickup and drive off, or ride it; either way you're not going to catch them on foot. You really need to be more careful than to just leave the light flashing where you can see it if it's a place where it's likely to be stolen.

I would agree that the U-bolt would be an improvement over cable, but I would hate having to take off the front tire all the time - even with fast release, you have to undo the brakes, then the fast release is set very tight, so it presses into your fingers, which hurts when it's really cold, that is a pain, plus you have to be gentle when setting the front end down. I really liked the long cable that I could string through front and back tires. Can bolt cutters get through those U-Bolts or are they too thick?

Perhaps a long log chain with an extra strong padlock lol.

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Old 9th March 2011, 02:45   #25
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Can bolt cutters get through those U-Bolts or are they too thick?
You won't get through hardened steel with a bolt cutter. You actually wouldn't get thru a good cable with a bolt cutter. Cordless grinders are a bitch. When you add a security torx bolt to your seat post, it sends a big "NO" to douche bags.

Look at these U-lock devices. I wouldn't be happy if I lost my keys.

http://www.onguardlock.com/?page_id=329

Dis is da chit you want.

I usually don't remove the front wheel, but if I leave the bike unattended I do. You can't really stop someone from stealing. You can make other people's stuff look like a better target. At the supermarket, I take the bike with me and load the bags.

They do make looped cables that you can run through the front wheel and secure with your U-lock.

I have been confronted a couple times:

"You can't bring your bike in here".

"Yes I can. It's $800."

I do have the advantage of knowing the store manager who had his bike lifted from the parking lot. Others have seen my point.

You can get "hardened" chain, but it scratches things up.
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Old 9th March 2011, 04:31   #26
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You actually wouldn't get thru a good cable with a bolt cutter.
quit tempting me to buy a larger set of bolt cutters, hell you might have to have home depot order out for a really big honkin pair but enough leverage and you'd get through in a few snips.
honestly, i'm tempted to bet you could just extend a pair of regular bolt cotters with some metal rods and a bit of welding skill and get through it in a single snip.

i'll call it.... the broomcutter?

@ Ted, i try to avoid just leaving it out front if i go to an actual store that isn't just some little 20 foot square corner of a building somewhere, typically only if i lose my keys and can't find them i'll leave it inside the door at the grocery, the mini-mart, i know for a fact i could bolt out the door fast enough they wouldn't have much of a lead if any so that's a non issue really.

kinda annoys me i bothered to get the lock that came with a cable in the first place though, even going into the full blown grocery store all i ever use is the U-Bar part, i don't even keep the cable on the bike unless i know i'll want it anymore, waste of fucking money and don't even get me started on the whole taking off the wheel thing, my bike does have quick release front tires but knowing my luck and mechanical skill it'd come off quick only to never go back on again.

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Old 9th March 2011, 05:04   #27
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You won't go through Grade 8 hardened steel with a bolt cutter. You'd probably be pressed to scratch it. It would probably take you several minutes to grind through it with a d/a. You would grind a hacksaw blade before you scratched it.

It is kind of a pain to take off my front wheel, but I doubt the R&I takes 15 seconds. Pop the brake wire loose and take it off. No biggie.
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Old 9th March 2011, 09:33   #28
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i don't really think that's a valid point assuming you could get enough leverage between the cutters.

then again you're making your point from the standpoint of factual proof (supposedly, i assume it's a given that some exists) i'm only really playing devil's advocate and debating it hypothetically for shits and giggles.

give a man an inclined plane and a long enough lever and he'll inevitably move the world, and all that.

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Old 9th March 2011, 14:52   #29
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Or ruin the tool.

I do have a lot of hard core hardened log chain that I could cut to length and use, but I'd have to find or make a fabric sleeve to prevent the chipping and scratching, and that sleeve would have to last through a lot of chafing and weather. Plus, the weight would be quite significant. Luckily around here I don't have to worry; there's always a safe place to leave the bike, and crime is pretty much non-existent, but I'll probably move this summer, possibly to a less secure place.

Around here, people leave 4-wheelers, tractors, trucks, snowmobiles, etc. sitting around with keys in them. Doors are rarely locked on cars, homes, barns, garages, etc. and I get odd looks from people when I use the key fob to lock my vehicles. Everywhere else I have lived has been a place where you should lock everything.

That web site you linked to looks pretty good.

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Old 10th March 2011, 21:03   #30
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Originally Posted by Too-DAMN-Much View Post
then again you're making your point from the standpoint of factual proof
From my experience from having a bike stolen. Cables have succumb to bolt cutters and grinders. Testing the remainder of the cable lock.... It was pretty much butter to either.

Bolt cutters... I lost my keys for a U-lock. A 3 ft. bolt cutter on a 10mm hardened bar U-lock.... nope.... I cut it off with a grinder. That took 10 or 12 minutes. It made a lot of noise and sparks. It also ate the grinding wheel.

Nothing is indestructible, and it might be possible that you could find a pair of bolt cutters that would do the job. It probably wasn't a problem with the cutting edge, more a problem that you couldn't get enough leverage. Perhaps one with 6 foot handles? Or Hulk Hogan. I am pretty stout. I couldn't. I was bending the handles pretty good.

I think cable locks are almost useless. A few tries with a bolt cutter.... A U-lock is pretty tough to get to. Some $100 chains are hexagonal, and Rockwell 62 hard. The hex design spreads out the force of the bolt cutter, so again, you'd have a tough time.

Nothing is perfect. I am more relating what has worked and what didn't work.... Oh. And as a friend of mine found out.... Don't chain your bike to a stop sign. Bastards broke off the stop sign and took the bike.... lock and all... It looks like a couple or 3 guys can break a stop sign off by rocking it back and forth till it snaps off.

In general, security is making other peoples shit look like a more attractive target than yours. Thieves are more interested in an easy target.
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Old 10th March 2011, 21:30   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockouthippie View Post
Oh. And as a friend of mine found out.... Don't chain your bike to a stop sign.
yeah that's kind of a no brainer since anyone with a tall thing to stand on or vehicle that's large enough can slip it over the top of the sign possibly anyway, or unbolt the sign, then slip it over failing the easy method, not only that, a bike stolen and sold, plus a stop sign destroyed, let me tell you to a criminal both are a good thing, it's like chaining your bike to a bar of gold, they get to steal your money and give the local police a headache, don't give them another incentive.

oh and, jaws of life, i bet that wouldn't even break a sweat killing a u-lock, honestly.... maybe a good powered jack for working on off-road trucks or large vehicles could do the trick too, i wouldn't put it past that at least as a possibility.

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Old 10th March 2011, 21:33   #32
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So far.... 2 bikes stolen with cable locks. Zero bikes stolen with U-locks. Knock on wood.
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Old 10th March 2011, 21:35   #33
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Originally Posted by rockouthippie View Post
So far.... 2 bikes stolen with cable locks. Zero bikes stolen with U-locks. Knock on wood.
yeah, agree to a point, it's been months since mine actually had the cable part of the lock on it when i took it out somewhere, it made it take too long to setup even just the u-bar since it wrapped around the u-bar in it's holder thing and using both took around 5 minutes lock and unlock each.

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Old 10th March 2011, 21:37   #34
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I've heard of your stop sign scenario, but the one I know about they just "rocked" the sign until it snapped off at the ground.
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Old 10th March 2011, 22:59   #35
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yeah that wouldn't surprise me either.

honestly, i've met stop signs i knew my friends and i could get out of the ground if we cared enough they were so loose.

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Old 11th March 2011, 04:29   #36
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Raleigh Talus is better,I think.My brothers like it.I have no idea.
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Old 13th March 2011, 04:08   #37
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I'm not sure we are talking about the right bike. When gas hit a bunch of money a couple years back, it did start a trend in what they call a commuter bike. It has a rack. It has fenders so you don't get a slime streak up your ass. It has a rack and a chain guard so you don't rip your jeans. They have double wall wheels and are usually 700c. If they weigh 35 pounds, they weigh too much.

Back and forth to work on a race bike in bad weather is a drag. These commuter bikes won't win a speed race, but they will get you back and forth without bothering you much.

Don't run a mountain bike on the road. It sucks. If you have one, they do make street tread tires which will make your life much more pleasant. Still... if you need to huff it for a few miles every day..... You got the wrong bike.
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Old 26th March 2011, 21:20   #38
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I ended up getting the Cannondale F8 a couple hours ago. On sale for $400.

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Old 29th March 2011, 08:37   #39
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I don't think disk brakes are a big deal. Calipers will stop you. The thing I have been considering is the internal drivetrain Shimano came up with. It's 8 speed. It also will let you shift when stopped. That seems like it might be a real nice thing for comfortable riding. It will push you past the $500 mark, so I didn't buy the Transend EX. It has disk brakes and the internal drive.
I also think so.



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Old 9th April 2011, 04:35   #40
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Cheer help me to beget kitty
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