Old 16th November 2004, 04:41   #41
billyvnilly
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not if your catholic. the emphasis of the protestant church is to learn the bible...there is no emphasis in catholicism...are there any catholics here btw? i would like your opinion.
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Old 16th November 2004, 04:47   #42
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hahah
You have fucking Dogma, you're adding shit to the bible. That's worse than interpreting the Bible improperly in my opinion.
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Old 16th November 2004, 05:19   #43
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i dont see it as an authoritative voice, i asked if there were any catholics here.

im not adding shit to the bible. catholicism is not part of the bible nor is protestantism...

Catholics learn through their priest. protestants have a bigger emphasis on the individual learning him/herself....it was part of martin luthers points...or whatever.

so i dont get it germ. what did i add to the bible???
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Old 16th November 2004, 05:26   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
Personally I think most people interpret the bible in whatever way suits them best.
True, but luckily there's a certian amount of orthodoxy that holds bad ideas at bay.


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Old 16th November 2004, 05:48   #45
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Does the bible say much about Germs?
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Old 16th November 2004, 05:48   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by ScYtH
which of course makes all the versions complete BS, (except for the orginal King James Version, of course)
http://ebible.org/bible/kjv/Preface.htm

The King James version was written at a time when all sermons/masses were done in Latin. It was a follow-up to Queen Elizabeth's plan of keeping England Protestant and the final wedge to break off with Rome. Even then, there were those that felt that the language was too top-lofty for the common people. Don't forget the rumors that Shakespeare may have had a hand in writing KJ. Anyone that has read Shakespeare, knows that it can be confusing, and how many times have you just wished that it could've been written in plain english?

From what I understand, (this was picked up a couple of years ago, don't remember where) an ancient manuscript was found, and scholars realized that it was the New Testament. But, what made it so different was that it was written in prose. Dating of the manuscript, put it around a couple of centuries. Please don't quote me on this, as this was several years ago and the details are very fuzzy.

After all my rambling, the point I'm trying to make is that the King James version is just a version and in this day and age, could it not be considered to be outdated, style wise?
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Old 16th November 2004, 06:16   #47
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The thing with the King James is that it has to be translated too many times. (imho)
here Let me show you:

to interpret the KJV you have read through it like this:
NT
oldest greek texts (the NT was originally written in greek)> younger greek manuscripts >the Latin Vulgate > Elizabethan English> Modern English.
OT
younger Hebrew texts > the Septuigent (greek OT)> the Vulgate> Elizabethan English> Modern English


Now, It doesn't do a terrible job with the the NT (I've studied Biblical Greek), But there are much more accurate translations.

Modern translations interprete straight from the oldest Greek and Hebrew Manuscripts, thus providing better accuracy. The NASB is probably the best literal translation(the KJV is also a literal translation), the NIV is great because it provides accurate original wording, but rearranges the Greek grammar structures, so it reads more like modern English. There are also transpositions, which try to capture much of the "feeling" the original author tried to express in the original texts in modern language, which more literal translations often miss.

I say pick a Translation to suit your purpose, and for exergesis purposes, it's best to use a couple translations.


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Old 16th November 2004, 08:27   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by billyvnilly
i dont see it as an authoritative voice, i asked if there were any catholics here.

im not adding shit to the bible. catholicism is not part of the bible nor is protestantism...

Catholics learn through their priest. protestants have a bigger emphasis on the individual learning him/herself....it was part of martin luthers points...or whatever.

so i dont get it germ. what did i add to the bible???
I didn't mean you personally, the Catholic denomination add's dogma to the Bible.
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Old 16th November 2004, 10:01   #49
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frankly, i find the fact that the old testament can be thrown out so easily a true testament to the content within the books as a whole.

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Old 16th November 2004, 10:04   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by CraigF
frankly, i find the fact that the old testament can be thrown out so easily a true testament to the content within the books as a whole.
I concur.

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Old 16th November 2004, 10:23   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by CraigF
frankly, i find the fact that the old testament can be thrown out so easily a true testament to the content within the books as a whole.
Well, you don't throw it out, it is now interpreted differently, due to Jesus enlightening us as to what it means.

Compared to the violence of the surrounding cultures,
when God told the people of Israel, "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" (OT) that was a very merciful and graceful way to do things.

And thats what Jesus taught the Pharisees, eye for an eye tooth for a tooth is a commandment to be merciful(to turn the other cheak), not a commandment to kill a murderer. Same ideas, different perspective. So no, you can't throw out the whole OT. And little of the OT even has to do with The Law and the OT sacrifical system. All most all of it is history of the Jewish people, Wisdom literature, and prophesy.


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Old 16th November 2004, 12:26   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
I didn't mean you personally, the Catholic denomination add's dogma to the Bible.
my bad then.
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Old 16th November 2004, 12:28   #53
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Eh.

I'm not sure i understand how you can say "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is to say "do not kill murderers". Infact, it sounds like a green light for murder, which is clearly told in the NT to be wrong.

So if the OT is wrong, how do you know that the NT is right?

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Old 16th November 2004, 12:49   #54
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Because things were so much different in the ancient world.
In most ancient societies if you looked at someone wrong you could be killed. If someone was killed, the muderer and his entire extended family could be sentenced to death.
So an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth was much more graceful than all other ancient law systems.


So the point of efae tfat isn't:
If you smack someone, they can smack you back.
The point being made is: If you smack someone, they can't kill you.

Can you see how this theme of grace and love connects in both the OT and NT teachings?


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Old 16th November 2004, 12:50   #55
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jesus is in my pants


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Old 16th November 2004, 13:08   #56
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Well, DUH.
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Old 16th November 2004, 13:43   #57
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God has graciously granted America a reprieve from the agenda of paganism
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Old 16th November 2004, 13:52   #58
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Can anyone find an actual verse in the Bible that states plainly that you don't have to follow the laws of the Old Testament anymore? That there is a Holy Trinity? I don't want your interpretations of what is written, most of what ya'll have written to attempt to validate these views are just utter bullshit.
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Old 16th November 2004, 13:56   #59
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It's a simple return to that same old argument that doesnt hold water.

"It's right because it is."

Well sorry, whether it installs good morals or not is not subjective to it being right because it is. Its not His word. It's no more right or wrong than those books that they gave to young girls in the 30s and 40s of how to behave morally and support their man.

The fact of the matter is that it's akin to worshipping at the alter of Martha Stewert. I realise there are plenty of people here who believe this shit is some kind of holy profound speaking. And be damned if I can change that. I don't claim to be humanities saviour, and it appears that is what is required to make change via those christian eyes.

Jesus came to earth, the embodiment of a combination of humanity and God. There is but his word to believe this.
It was His teachings that led to the beliefs of today in comparison to the old testament. However, what stops someone claiming to be the son of God and wiping clean all of the previous teachings?

The concept is a flawed one. In so many more ways than simple historics.

A belief is just that, a belief. I can be just as incorrect as it can be correct.

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Old 16th November 2004, 14:10   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
I don't want your interpretations of what is written, most of what ya'll have written to attempt to validate these views are just utter bullshit.


This Is So Much Fun..!! LMAO!!!
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Old 16th November 2004, 14:39   #61
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Quote:
Originally posted by CraigF
It's a simple return to that same old argument that doesnt hold water.

"It's right because it is."

Well sorry, whether it installs good morals or not is not subjective to it being right because it is. Its not His word. It's no more right or wrong than those books that they gave to young girls in the 30s and 40s of how to behave morally and support their man.

The fact of the matter is that it's akin to worshipping at the alter of Martha Stewert. I realise there are plenty of people here who believe this shit is some kind of holy profound speaking. And be damned if I can change that. I don't claim to be humanities saviour, and it appears that is what is required to make change via those christian eyes.

Jesus came to earth, the embodiment of a combination of humanity and God. There is but his word to believe this.
It was His teachings that led to the beliefs of today in comparison to the old testament. However, what stops someone claiming to be the son of God and wiping clean all of the previous teachings?

The concept is a flawed one. In so many more ways than simple historics.

A belief is just that, a belief. I can be just as incorrect as it can be correct.
Of the many denominations available to humanity..One thing is a common binder..We all drink at the same trough..

Well...The beliefs are those of the vast majority..

Whether it is Correct or Incorrect is a choice for many, for many others it is uncompromising at all odds..

I've lived enough life and have been subjected to far too much of what it is that this world has to offer to ever think about looking backwards..

The choice is always left to the individual..I never concern about anothers choice, it's not my decision...Why would I..

Of 284 million Americans:

Ninety three percent or 264 million of them are Christians.

249 million Christians belong to an organized church.

15 million are Christians who are not members of an organized church.

7% or 20 million are non-Christians

1.9% or 5.4 million are Muslims.

1.9% or 5.4 million are Jews.

0.6% or 1.7 million are atheists.

0.3% or 0.9 million are Buddhists.

0.3% or 0.9 million are other religionists.

2% or 5.7 million are of other religions or are non-religious.

2% or 5.7 million have no opinion about it.
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Old 16th November 2004, 15:12   #62
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The United States isn't the entire world. In fact our population only makes up a very small portion of it. What are you trying to prove by posting these statistics? That as a whole nation we are the most retarded? And what is with posting a picture of my avatar and name? You don't really think much before talking do you?
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Old 16th November 2004, 15:20   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
The United States isn't the entire world. In fact our population only makes up a very small portion of it. What are you trying to prove by posting these statistics? That as a whole nation we are the most retarded? And what is with posting a picture of my avatar and name? You don't really think much before talking do you?
Just posting the numbers...

As a matter of fact...I'm sorry you don't understand the irony of my post..I'm sure it will come to you eventually.. LOL!
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Old 16th November 2004, 15:31   #64
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Just posting the numbers why?

Anyone else understand what she's trying to imply by both the numbers and by posting a picture of my avatar? Does anyone speak retard? I can't seem to decipher what she's saying and I need a translator.
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Old 16th November 2004, 15:34   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by shakey_snake
Because things were so much different in the ancient world.
In most ancient societies if you looked at someone wrong you could be killed. If someone was killed, the muderer and his entire extended family could be sentenced to death.
So an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth was much more graceful than all other ancient law systems.


So the point of efae tfat isn't:
If you smack someone, they can smack you back.
The point being made is: If you smack someone, they can't kill you.

Can you see how this theme of grace and love connects in both the OT and NT teachings?
I see. So what you are saying is that the OT is too old to be relavent to todays socity?

The NT is old as well (1500 years) so whats to say that it is still relevant today?

Furthermore, this obvious contradiction allows for any number of interpretations.

I can see someone saying "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, so lets destroy the entire muslim world to avenge 9/11 in some sort of crusade!"

Oh, wait....

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Old 16th November 2004, 15:35   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ


I can't seem to decipher what she's saying and I need a translator.

LMAO!! I have no doubt!! Rotflmao!!
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Old 16th November 2004, 15:55   #67
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King James Version... ...Galatians 3:

24: Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25: But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Zondervan NIV Version.... ...Galatians 3:

23: Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed
24: So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith
25: Now that we are no longer under the supervision of the law..

By The Way.......

The Meaning Of Christianty is Just That..Christianity.....One Who Follows The Teachings Of Jesus Christ...(CHRISTIANITY!)
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:00   #68
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Quote:
Originally posted by MagnumOne
LMAO!! I have no doubt!! Rotflmao!!
I don't see why you're laughing when it's your fault I can't understand you. I'm willing to bet nobody else understands what you're trying to say either.
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:02   #69
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less crack.

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Old 16th November 2004, 16:05   #70
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Magnum what are those verses supposed to prove? And seriously, are you doing any kind of speed? I'm not kidding when I ask this.
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:05   #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
I don't see why you're laughing when it's your fault I can't understand you. I'm willing to bet nobody else understands what you're trying to say either.
I'll bet there are a few that understand, a little more versed in the knowledge than you and a few others are obviously!...

I told you before... You're Here To Amuse Me and you're doing a damn fine job..

Please Continue.. LOL!!
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:07   #72
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
Magnum what are those verses supposed to prove? And seriously, are you doing any kind of speed? I'm not kidding when I ask this.
You can ask me anything you like..Seriously!!. LOL!!
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:07   #73
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Oh you've got me right where you want me huh
Gosh, what am I ever to do?

If you're so confident that you're making sense then why not explain it to someone so lowly and stupid such as myself?

By the way, you're the only one laughing. You're not funny at all. If you're making jokes I can't tell.
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:08   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by MagnumOne


This Is So Much Fun..!! LMAO!!!
I have no idea what you mean by this (or much else in this thread), I see nothing funny or poignant about that image, and I can't even tell if you're trying to be sarcastic or happy or ...

Suggestion:
Quote:
Originally posted by CraigF
less crack.

Freedom of speech is the basic freedom of humanity. When you've lost that, you've lost everything.
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:09   #75
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Quote:
Originally posted by Germ
Oh you've got me right where you want me huh
Gosh, what am I ever to do?

If you're so confident that you're making sense then why not explain it to someone so lowly and stupid such as myself?
No...You've placed yourself there..Don't go thinking I care where you are.. LOL!!

Well...There you have it...Lowly And Stupid You Say??

Ah Well..
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:11   #76
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I keep thinking "troll", but most people just aren't that persistant.

Freedom of speech is the basic freedom of humanity. When you've lost that, you've lost everything.
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:11   #77
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Well..This Has Me Bored..

I'll have to check in later to see the results..

Ta...Ta!!

Have A Good Day.....
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:12   #78
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hahahahaha
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Old 16th November 2004, 16:17   #79
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Quote:
Originally posted by CraigF
less crack.

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Old 16th November 2004, 16:54   #80
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Well...The beliefs are those of the vast majority..
not really. The majority of the world's people are non-christian. I'm not sure what your point was with all those numbers either, but if it was that the majority is usually right, then you shot yourself in the foot.

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