Opus support? {Implemented with a 3rd party plug-in by thinktink)

[thinktink]

NARF!!!!
Wahoo!!!!! I resolved the side-effects of in_bpopus (and in_bpxfade) causing gen_ff to crash when trying to playback an ogg (or any other already natively supported) stream.

Dance with me!

I just need to do some additional testing and I'll have a new release out soon. It might also resolve the in_gsf conflict but having some difficulty testing that at the moment.

[gottkaiser]

@thinktink

Thanks for creating this plug-in for opus files. It is relay useful!
When I use it it doesn't show the "year" and "title number" tag of my opus files. foobar2000, Mp3tag and MediaInfo can show them without problems. So I guess there is a problem with your plug-in.
Would be great if you could fix that.

PS: If you need the file I'll provide it.

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by gottkaiser

@thinktink

Thanks for creating this plug-in for opus files. It is relay useful!
When I use it it doesn't show the "year" and "title number" tag of my opus files. foobar2000, Mp3tag and MediaInfo can show them without problems. So I guess there is a problem with your plug-in.
Would be great if you could fix that.

PS: If you need the file I'll provide it.

Please attach an example file that shows the issue inside a .7z or .zip archive.

[thinktink]

Whatever encoder you used to encode that file with is, it's rubbish. It does not include the super-mandatory vendor field (which is the first field in the tags section.) It's not the cause of the original issue you posted about but you should be aware to toss it.

[gottkaiser]

It was an alpha version of the next release.
So, don't worry about it. :-)

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by gottkaiser

It was an alpha version of the next release.

Of what?

[gottkaiser]

Off the official opus-tools.
But it shouldn't matter. As all the opus tag reading programs I know can cope with the file.

[thinktink]

I need a nap.

[gottkaiser]

It is working now.
Big thanks to you!

[Melkor]

When you run the install in windows 7, since the installer uses elevated permissions, when it launches winamp it launches winamp with elevated permissions. The problem with this is you can't drag and drop between regular apps and those elevated.

Plugin seems to work without issue, and winamp was happy enough to retag my files.

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by Melkor

When you run the install in windows 7, since the installer uses elevated permissions, when it launches winamp it launches winamp with elevated permissions. The problem with this is you can't drag and drop between regular apps and those elevated....

Noted. Thanks.

[MrX_1980]

Good morning, with Winamp beta3 I get only "HTTP/1.0 200 OK" messages.
You too ?

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrX_1980

Good morning, with Winamp beta3 I get only "HTTP/1.0 200 OK" messages.
You too ?

I haven't installed it yet. I've been super-sick lately and have been trying to get some rest. However, I will check it out today after I have completed my regularly scheduled tasks at my less than part-time job at the church. Probably sometime this afternoon.

[thinktink]

I was not able to replicate your 202 issue.

I did find a crash issue after installing the new beta 3 however. Try closing Winamp and re-installing the plugin.

I'm not 100% confident, but it might be a conflict with the Winamp installer's "optimizer".

[thinktink]

If it still does the [HTTP/1.0 200 OK...] thing after following the above try listening to opus://repeater.xiph.org:8000/clock.opus and see if it does the same thing.

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrX_1980

Good morning, with Winamp beta3 I get only "HTTP/1.0 200 OK" messages.
You too ?

Since you have not responded I can only assume the issue somehow cleared up for you.

Whether by reinstalling the plugin or by installing the new Beta4 I would like to know so that I can try to prevent future miss-haps.

If not, please let me know either way.

[MrX_1980]

Hello think think,
after reinstalling your 1.1.14.34 plugin I had only crashes while starting an opus stream.

Winamp client version: 5.7 build 3364 Beta winamp caused an Unknown exception type (0xc0000024) in module ntdll.dll at 0023:77e327b8.
Exception handler called in Winamp.

I have then uninstalled Winamp & deleted all remaining folders/files and installed it again.
Now I have very often "[Waiting for data...]" and nothing happens. If I start the stream in Firefox it starts after about 2 seconds.

Example stream: http://radioserver1.delfa.net/64.opus

[thinktink]

By the looks of the info report the plugin is unable to locate the supporting DLLs. Which is odd because it's been programmed to search for them dynamically.

Open the the plugin's about box and see what it says about the version of the opus libraries that are loaded (if they are.) You can get to it by opening Preferences->Input-Plugins then select "BogProg Support for Opus v?.?.?.?" and then click the About button.

It will appear at the bottom of the blue about box and should read something similar to "Opus Library version: libopus ?.?.?"

[MrX_1980]

BogProg 1.1.14.34
libopus 1.0.1

Folder: C:\Program Files (x86)\Winamp\opusfile\

[thinktink]

Gawddamnit that was NOT what I was expecting. That's just more frustrating than being a legless Ethiopian watching a doughnut roll down the hill.

Ok, there's two plugin attachments on this post.

The first being a new version of in_bpopus.dll that changes the way is searches for the support DLLs (which probably won't fix the issue but it's worth a shot.)

The other is my version of an info-tool plugin that will give me the required information the Koopa Info tool does not provide (in this circumstance.)

Please install the new version of the opus plugin first then install the info tool plugin and generate a report by opening the Winamp Preferences window and double clicking the "BogProg thinktink" plugin in the treeview Plugins-Generic category. It will ask to confirm to generate the report, click "Yes". It can take anywhere from 10 seconds to a minute to create the report depending on your system, afterwhich time (hopefully) an explorer window will open with the compressed report file ("BPInfoToolLog.zip") selected. Please attach that file in your next post.

[EDIT/]
I removed the previously attached info tool report generator plugin as it's not exclusively or directly related to the Opus plugin.

[MrX_1980]

With 1.1.15.36 it is now better. The opus streams are now starting at the first or second try. Thanks
Above the valus from my main computer and here from my notebook.

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrX_1980

With 1.1.15.36 it is now better. The opus streams are now starting at the first or second try. Thanks
Above the valus from my main computer and here from my notebook.

Good to hear it's working now. The issue with it sometimes needing more than one try to start the streams is usually due to high-latency issues on DNS lookups. The only time I've seen an issue like that is when I was on a bad or slow network connection. The codec itself is very low-latency so once you get passed NS lookup issues like that you shouldn't have problems with a stream even on particularly bad networks.

[thinktink]

I thought this was relatively amusing:


Torrent of one of the very first versions of the plugin as well. 1.0.1.1

I would advise against using it. It's (relatively) really old.

[MrSinatra]

hey TT,

now that u have conquered opus and embedding artwork, and now that winamp supports both metadata and decoding for ALAC natively, do you have any interest in creating the ALAC encoder?

its the missing piece to let people convert their FLACs to ALAC so their lossless stuff will natively work with both winamp and iTunes/idevices.

either way, thx for the consideration, and great work on OPUS.

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrSinatra

hey TT,

now that u have conquered opus and embedding artwork...

Actually, there are a number of things I still should add to the plugins.

• OpenSSL/Authentication support.
• Proxy support (of which, by the way, I wonder if there's not already an internal mechanism or API that already has proxy configuration parameters available.)
• 44.1Khz resampling to the encoder plugin.
• See if maybe I can compile a version that doesn't require the internal VCL libraries (maybe) for a smaller/faster package.

Sorry for the lengthy delay in my response. It seems that YouTube videos provide a better distraction from the pain I'm in at the moment than the forums are able to provide currently.

[MrSinatra]

ugh, that sounds grim. heal quickly!

I understand as to the rest. hopefully someone as talented takes up the challenge, or you change your mind once healed and done with opus.

thx.

ps. whats the 44.1 for? if opus doesn't support it on playback, i'm not following what u intend to do?

pps. winamp does have proxy settings in prefs>g.prefs, but I don't know if that applies.

[MrX_1980]

Originally Posted by thinktink

• 44.1Khz resampling to the encoder plugin.

That would be nice to have. Then we would be able to rip Audio CD's directly to opus.

[MrSinatra]

Originally Posted by MrX_1980

That would be nice to have. Then we would be able to rip Audio CD's directly to opus.

maybe I misunderstood, but does opus support 44.1 for playback natively?

b/c if not, whats the point? if it does, then obviously I see the point.

[Kaminari]

Opus native sampling rate is 48 kHz. Right now ThinkTink's encoder can only work with 48 kHz audio sources, which is not the case for CDs.

https://wiki.xiph.org/OpusFAQ#What_is_Opus_Custom.3F

[MrSinatra]

yes, I understand sample rates and CDs etc, but I don't know much about opus itself. my impression was that it did not support, at all, 44.1 for playback. your link seems to suggest however that it does, it just really recommends strongly against it.

(i'm still not clear if 44.1 playback is natively supported, or supported only via on the fly resampling)

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrSinatra

...supported only via on the fly resampling)

Yes.

Opus Custom is not just unrecommended in this situation (plugin inside a media player.) The specifications for Opus inside the OggSquish container format (the standard, and only known used as of this post, container format for Opus files) does not accommodate for the Opus Custom API. It is only for specialized applications (of which Winamp is not one of them) where a developer's custom container format is used, which is not suitable at all in this situation.

[MrSinatra]

forgive me, I can be thick...

but if you are saying 44.1 is not supported at all natively, and only by on the fly conversion during playback, then why work to make the encoder able to encode at 44.1?

that's what i'm asking, assuming I understand the facts right?

[thinktink]

Originally Posted by MrSinatra

...why work to make the encoder able to encode at 44.1?
...

It's not about making the encoder able to encode at 44.1KHz. It's about adding an on-the-fly resampler to the encoder to convert 44.1KHz to 48KHz so that people can rip CDs directly to Opus using the encoder instead of having to rip to a different format to resample it to 48KHz before converting it to Opus.

[MrSinatra]

ok, its now finally coming together for me! thx for dragging me across the finish line.

so, when ripping to opus, the 44.1 will be converted on the fly to 48, and the end result will be a file that is 48. my confusion was in thinking this was about making CDs.

while I would not want to rip a normal redbook CD to anything other than 44.1, I guess I can see a scenario where someone demanded to have Opus rips of their stuff, and in that case that seems like the best way to do it I guess.

[Kaminari]

44.1 to 48 kHz upsampling is non-destructive.

http://hydrogenaudio.org/forums/inde...howtopic=97051

[thinktink]

Yes, I've seen that thread more than several times. The issue isn't whether it's destructive or not. The issue is that the only references to an actual resampler in the current library is one that only does mono channels. I haven't found any other yet. To use it would require the daunting task of creating an encapsulating API that would need to deinterlace the incoming audio into each channels' separate buffer, chuck each buffer to each channels' own resampler (one for each channel), and then reinterlace it all back into a single buffer before passing it on to the encoder. Much easier said than done.


The thread also mentions a GPL resampler but fails to mention where to find it in the source. Kinda annoying.

[Aminifu]

Originally Posted by MrSinatra

while I would not want to rip a normal redbook CD to anything other than 44.1 ...

I think it is pass time for that standard to be updated. A larger bit depth and sampling rate would allow for better sounding files. The files would be larger so less would fit on a CD, but that is solved by using DVD discs instead of CDs. They cost the same in bulk. Just saying ...

[Kaminari]

Mmm, careful what you wish for...

http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

[Aminifu]

Originally Posted by Kaminari

Mmm, careful what you wish for...

Thank you for the link to that article. I read it quickly, have to go back and reread some parts. But one thing is clear, facts are stubborn things (the human ear works the way it works). The distortion aspects are also key. Looks like the standard 16/44.1 got things mostly right.

I don't know why, but upsampling my mp3s does make them sound a little better to me (along with a little DSP doctoring, which helps even more). Going forward, I had already decided to use a lossless format (wavpack) for my personal ripping.

[innotect]

I am agree to your comment.