Old 15th May 2008, 07:03   #1
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Wow... Just wow...

So, I make a joke about killing someone, with my friends and a teacher over hears this. Now I'm under intense watch and have to see a counselor every three days.

The counselor has made no progress apparently in changing my evil ways. And this apparently "worries" them. How in the fuck can I get this shit to stop.

Everyone knows I was joking, and everyone knows what I'm like. But I'm also a quiet person, I don't say something unless I feel its important. This makes no sense at all.

Other teachers are fighting in my case to say that I don't mean any of it but thats not going to stop it. I just had the bad luck of being heard by a new "student" teacher who does not know how to understand sarcasm. So she reported me to the police.

Now I'm stuck to go to this crap or I'll get arrested or some shit like that. Can't a guy make a joke about killing someone in peace anymore?

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Old 15th May 2008, 07:05   #2
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Old 15th May 2008, 07:05   #3
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Quote:
From: BC, Canada
I dare not say that this joke was from a site I saw on the INTERWEBS. Or it would probably end up in some type of "Ban the internets" thing.

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Old 15th May 2008, 07:11   #4
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Old 15th May 2008, 07:19   #5
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If you want to stop the councilling thing you could just actually kill someone. I think it'd stop then.

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Old 15th May 2008, 07:26   #6
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"Wow" indeed. It's going to suck, but, you'll have to go with the program. At least they gave you the option of consuling instead of a "go direct to jail".
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Old 15th May 2008, 07:33   #7
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I have no idea what the legal system in Canada is like, so I can't help you.

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Old 15th May 2008, 07:53   #8
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Old 15th May 2008, 12:46   #9
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Claim that your just confused because your still exploring your sexuality.

At least they will stop worrying about you killing people...

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Old 15th May 2008, 13:11   #10
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Give them an ultimatum: You'll either quit school, or they'll take you off the counseling crap. Put the future of your education in their hands. Should be a simple decision for them in that case.

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Old 15th May 2008, 13:35   #11
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Just don't go? It's not a crime to make a joke or think about killing someone and it's only a threat if you actually said it to the individual. I would hope that the police have the brains to know a joke when they hear it.

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Old 15th May 2008, 19:24   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by SSJ4 Gogitta
Give them an ultimatum: You'll either quit school, or they'll take you off the counseling crap. Put the future of your education in their hands. Should be a simple decision for them in that case.

They would say go ahead and leave school, and then probably send a cop on my ass to make sure I went to the sessions.

I know this stuff probably is not legal but I don't think I'm in any position to talk to a lawyer. No cash, no bash.

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Old 15th May 2008, 20:16   #13
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Until you can get out of it, just have some fun and dick with the counselor.

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Old 15th May 2008, 20:29   #14
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Oh I have been, but its annoying when I have to miss work because of it.

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Old 16th May 2008, 04:19   #15
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There are many considerations here. At this point, I would advise you to take the path of minimal resistance.

Under Canadian law, uttering a threat constitutes assault, which is a serious crime.

On the other hand, you have a right to freedom of expression under the Canadian constitutional law.

In my estimation a judge would not consider your comment a threat, especially if the other listeners interpreted it as a joke. Your age will be of particular relevance here (a death threat from a 50 year old is much more credible than one from a 14 year old).

Your options for refusing counseling may be limited because of your age (I'm assuming you're a minor). You may need to retain a lawyer. And you definitely should discuss the matter with your parents, because you may need their help if you choose to challenge the counseling.

Has your counseling been assigned by the police or by your school? Have you spoken to the police yourself? If so, what did they tell you?

You should also consider that your school may choose to add additional penalties if you decide to drop the counseling. Your freedom of speech can generally be limited by a school, and they may expel you if they think you went too far.

It may also be a good idea to be up front with your counselor. If you calmly explain to him that you were making a comment among friends that was not intended to be serious, and you're willing to apologise to the teacher who overheard your conversation and the one who was the "target" of your comment, he/she might change their mind.
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Old 16th May 2008, 04:58   #16
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He just kept talking in one long incredibly unbroken sentence, moving from topic to topic, so that no one had the chance to interrupt him.
But really quite hypnotic.

Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic,
Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic.

Moving from topic to topic.
Quite hypnotic.

Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic,
Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic.

Moving from topic to topic.
Quite hypnotic.

Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic,
Incredibly unbroken sentence,
Moving from topic to topic.

Moving from topic to topic.
Quite hypnotic.

notic-notic-notic-notic

present day present time
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Old 16th May 2008, 05:16   #17
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Why don't you ask the kids at Tiananmen square?
Was Fashion the reason why they were there?

They disguise it, Hypnotize it
Television made you buy it

I'm just sitting in my car and waiting for my...

She's scared that I will take her away from there
Her dreams that her country left with no one there

Mezmerize the simple minded
Propaganda leaves us blinded

I'm just sitting in my car and waiting for my girl
I'm just sitting in my car and waiting for my girl

I'm just sitting in my car and waiting for my girl
I'm just sitting in my car and waiting for my

Girl
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Old 16th May 2008, 08:57   #18
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Where did the world go wrong...
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Old 16th May 2008, 11:04   #19
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more like when did the world go wrong :P since it went wrong pretty much globally

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Old 16th May 2008, 19:37   #20
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Those statements were taken very seriously at my school too. It's not really something you ever want to say. I would suggest doing as they ask. Sometimes you need to choose the path of lease resistance.
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Old 16th May 2008, 19:39   #21
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I guess they dont want you do go all Columbine on them!

"Well, got to love you and leave you, need to go get into the shower and rub my hard naked body all over with soapy bubbles, I'll be back later to carry on playing....

It'll take you some time to get over the image of me naked in the shower......mind you don't masturbate to hard thinking about it...."
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Old 16th May 2008, 20:05   #22
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School systems are generally retarded. When you graduate you don't have to worry about it anymore.

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Old 19th May 2008, 19:38   #23
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Agreed. Oh, and they lied about one other thing: grades don't always matter.
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Old 19th May 2008, 20:07   #24
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Nobody seemed to care at my high school, even when I showed my chem teacher a big three ring binder I had, full of notations on how to build nuclear bombs. It was just a fascination of mine, it never harmed anyone.


If I tried that now, though, I'm sure someone would send me to the guidance counselor or school shrink.

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Old 19th May 2008, 22:13   #25
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Or to the feds.

Spiral out, my friend. You will find your way back to yourself, we all will.
I'll be waiting, and shall see you on the other side...
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Old 23rd May 2008, 00:19   #26
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I know you were just kidding, and I'm glad there were others around you who knew it too. But technically, threatening to kill anyone - even in an abstract statement - is against the law, so in this age of school shootings they're required to act on it. And understandably so.

I'm not saying you should be where you are - I'd rather everyone had let it go based on how well many of the people there know you.

The problem is the school authorities have something they can hold over your head which the police can use to file formal charges at any time, so keep your head down, tough it out and let it pass. And don't even joke about killing someone any more. In 1962 it wouldn't have mattered much, but this is 2008. Things are different now than they used to be.

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Old 23rd May 2008, 00:35   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by PaperClip
Those statements were taken very seriously at my school too. It's not really something you ever want to say. I would suggest doing as they ask. Sometimes you need to choose the path of lease resistance.
Eh I agree depending on the tone or the perception of the person who oveheard it...probably ridiculously blown out of proportion

Now if you said it in an angry tone like seriously I am going to kill this person...might ought to take more seriously but...I'm going to give an extreme example here. If it was like the classic schoolgirl like omg i am going to kill my friend stacey because she forgot to buy ______ type mascara when I specifically asked for _________. omg...i can't believe it.

You know. Obvious sarcasm...

But in this day & age...people are so twisted schools can't know or take chances. Consult the observations of other students who heard the same comment whether they considered the remark obviously in the sense of sarcasm.

You'll have to go to the classes most likely...just go to them...but make it clear you never had any intent of causing any harm to anyone and think up a good comparison along the lines of the schoolgirl sarcasm tone. Preferably something not so...gossippy/annoying/schoolgirl-ish...but again my example is one extreme of sarcasm.

I mean acknowledge that someone took something in complete sarcasm as something that could have been very serious. blah blah blah something like that

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Old 26th May 2008, 20:34   #28
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Where I live, it is the law that anything of this nature, joke or not, must reported, and if it's not reported, the teacher gets sued - literally. I've been working full time in public schools since the '01-'02 school year, and it's always been the case. The above posts are pretty good at explaining why.

Even if out of 1000 cases of this, only one turns up to be worthy of investigating, it's still worth looking into all, since it's not able to be determined which of those thousand is legitimately serious.

Plus, student teachers have very little experience and are fresh out of the classes that preach this to them, and under the microscope of their supervisors. They'll lighten up after teaching a year or two.

Furthermore, the school might be using you as an example to scare other students away from doing that sort of thing, in an attempt at promoting a brand of 'zero tolerance' which is rather unfair to you. Based on the little information I know about your case, had this happened in my school, you would still have been subject to meetings with a police officer, parents, and the building principal, but after some hard warnings, they'd probably let you off the hook and not mandate counseling, considering it's the first offense on record.

I'm guessing if you just play ball on this one, it'll be over and forgotten sooner than any other route, since there's very little to be gained by going any other direction.

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Old 27th May 2008, 16:50   #29
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yeah, what's wrong with the world today?
we're so busy shoving our heads up our asses trying to not offend anyone some people are seeing something that looks like daylight after a while.

get a fucking attorney, fight it, get one of those "we don't get paid unless you win" ones, they're often pretty good since they're total complete slimeballs and will get you off on technicalities even if slightly unethical.

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Old 27th May 2008, 17:38   #30
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I don't need to "speak" about killing anybody, where it can be overheard by any "student" teacher (or anybody else), and then be misinterpreted (or not).

Nope... there is no speaking needed at all because...
I kill with my mind - I kill with a single thought!
And I've done it often!

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Old 27th May 2008, 19:38   #31
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It will apparently be over soon, heh.

Should I mention that I've made 3 of the counselor's give up?

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Old 27th May 2008, 20:04   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by mike-db
It will apparently be over soon, heh.

Should I mention that I've made 3 of the counselor's give up?
More on the counselor's giving up. Sounds interesting.

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Old 27th May 2008, 20:09   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nunzio390
Nope... there is no speaking needed at all because...
I kill with my mind - I kill with a single thought!
And I've done it often!
Ah, you're just a silly piece of sh.............ow.....Ow......OW.........OW OW OW OW......oh Jesus......OUCH......ARRRRGGGHHHH!!!!

I'm a psychosomatic sister running around without a leash.
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Old 28th May 2008, 06:14   #34
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Here's what I would probably tell the counselor:

"Have you ever considered that all this counseling, watching and attention to me is having the opposite effect? Before this started I was just a normal smart person, but now I am feeling agitated, depressed, and angry.

My whole life could be ruined because someone misinterpreted what I said in passing. Rather than let me tell you what I meant by what I said, you guys feel the need to explore my inner workings.

I understand that there are people out there who need this kind of assistance, but let me assure you, I am not one of those people."
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Old 28th May 2008, 06:19   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rellik
Here's what I would probably tell the counselor:

"Have you ever considered that all this counseling, watching and attention to me is having the opposite effect? Before this started I was just a normal smart person, but now I am feeling agitated, depressed, and angry. [...]"
That statement could get you into more trouble. After making what school management sees as a threatening remark, saying you're more depressed and angry now - regardless of the reason - will not have the desired outcome, but instead would probably get you a counseling extension. Or worse.

I'm a psychosomatic sister running around without a leash.
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Old 28th May 2008, 06:39   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by ScorLibran
That statement could get you into more trouble... [and]would probably get you a counseling extension. Or worse.
Very likely so.

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Old 28th May 2008, 06:59   #37
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I'd recommend to Mike, now that the chips are down, to walk on eggshells until this scenario reaches it's logical conclusion: The counselor being satisfied that you are not a threat and "releasing you on your own recognizance". The only things that will improve the situation at this point are time and patience.

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Old 28th May 2008, 17:05   #38
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he could just keep it up untill all the counselors in his area refuse to work with him too

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Old 28th May 2008, 23:23   #39
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Generally when a counselor has given up, the client is referred to something more serious, like a psychologist, a psychiatrist, or a cell mate.

Don't forget to live before you die.
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Old 30th May 2008, 04:14   #40
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Yeah its getting to the point where I'll be spending time in city cells for 3 months. (Thats worse then that prison kids go to I can't really spell it)

I went in there once for a week because I was caught drunk in public a few times they always threw the fucked up crack heads in there.

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