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View Poll Results: Should we keep Nsv going ?
yes 19 67.86%
no - its dead 9 32.14%
Voters: 28. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11th September 2008, 17:17   #1
Jkey
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Keep Nsv ?

ok as shoutcast moves forward just wondered what
the thoughts were on keeping the Nsv format going ?

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 18:20   #2
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It's such a great video format.
We can't let it die
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:25   #3
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put it out of its misery ...

it was a great idea, no tools, no integration into browsers anymore, too much for the modern internet user who wants point and click ...

kill it now ... otherwise it will languish on forever.

BW

Without open minds the world will die. Open yours and correct the mistakes you are making right now.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:35   #4
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I clicked the wrong button in haste so you can remove one vote from the total poll.

i wont edit it as it will look like a fix.

so its 3 votes for bin it.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:38   #5
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so you wanted to click bin nick ?
just change it im sure the community will
not accuse of rigging the poll.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:48   #6
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yep bin it for me please

ill leave you to do the buttons.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:50   #7
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Tis done sir nick of ss.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:53   #8
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TVM.
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Old 11th September 2008, 19:56   #9
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I think NSV could live strong if only it got some more support from programmers. If NSV had a some better tools, and an Browser integration fully working, it could be among the best of cross platform/cross system Streaming video formats. Even in it's beta stage, I have found it to be the easiest to use so far. If I only had some damn time, I would code a lot for it, but I have to put my school as top priority =(
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:00   #10
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my surgestion is for programmers in the community
to group together and formulate a plan and collectively
design new tools etc.Maybe then Aol may take notice.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:08   #11
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So, me you and Smelter then? =P Oh wait... Smelter converted to Flash =/
But, I'm all for that idea, I have the tools I started on as Open source, in the hope someone would join in on developing them, or at least use them =P
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:09   #12
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i voted bin i moved to flash

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:10   #13
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Traitor =P I'll never leave NSV!
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:28   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by wildex999
So, me you and Smelter then? =P Oh wait... Smelter converted to Flash =/
But, I'm all for that idea, I have the tools I started on as Open source, in the hope someone would join in on developing them, or at least use them =P

I'm not a coder yet, but I can test for you every tool you want me to test
I'm an NSV fan, that's sure.
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Old 11th September 2008, 20:40   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by wildex999
Traitor =P I'll never leave NSV!

Hehehe ive still got your lib loaded in eclipse as part of
my current project on my linux machine,so ive only
half given up :P

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 21:59   #16
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What does nsv offer?
1. captive audience inside winamp.

2. advertisments in the media library.

AOL will never, ever, ever catch up with flash!

The future of video on the web is 'real time', multiuser-interaction, in 3D 'environments'.

It is now a two-way interaction.

nsv is good for one thing these days, and one thing only.

Automation. However, this was developed early on. The same function for flash streaming is only a matter of adding one function to the actionscript.

As much as I hate to see it go, there has been NOTHING NEW except friggin advertisements in the new media library.


Looks like the same 271 nsv stations as when I streamed nsv in early 2004.

red5 is only a few weeks away from live h264+aac streaming. It is 100% opensource java, and there is no way any clients of mine would consider looking at nsv. No way!

Right now I can create both desktop AIR and web-based Flex applications with little or no effort. Applications which connect to finacial services, customer support, googleEarth, entertainment, Pay-Per-View, video conference, 3DMonsterTruck mutliuser demo-derby(lets see this in nsv format). Webcam snapshot program... On, and On, and On.
I've happily made my living this year strictly programming red5, flex, and php services to support them.

Keep nsv? heh, just keep this forum for legacy and have AOL make an official statement that nsv has failed due to stagnation, and lack of funding. Failure to react to OBVIOUS MARKET TRENDS, including failure to provide a browser plug-in.

THe browser plug-in alone could re-spark at least a hint of interest. However, again, the timing is so late that things like flex-remoting-over-rtmp KILLS ANYTHING GAINED by this plug-in development.

Furthurmore, the price of a dedicated server to host red5 is about double the price of a small nsv host, but you get the ability to run a hundred shoutcast servers IN ADDITION to red5.


Where do you think people with money are heading?

Andy
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Old 11th September 2008, 22:08   #17
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Quote:
red5 is only a few weeks away from live h264+aac streaming.
Ive been hearing this for a long time,so long infact
that ive left red5 behind for now.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 22:25   #18
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Well, since nobody is paying for it except private clients, it wont be added as open source until a couple things happen.

Everyone one wants it, but nobody will pay for it.

Besides, it appears you only have VOD listed in your signature link, which is already supported by flash and does not require red5 one bit. All you need to VOD h264 / aac flash files is some simple 5$ web host.

As long as you are satisfied with nsv limitations, you are still satisfied.

The rest of us are building new applications and will have no trouble switching to better codecs within these applications.
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Old 11th September 2008, 22:45   #19
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dont be confused by the link in my sig it is a very
small part of what i actually do.

i have already paid for the mainconcept aac+ plugin
a while back,but this $300 purchase was sat idle
while i was waiting for red5 to catch up.

in the end i set clients up with fms because they
needed h264/aac+ support for their video services.

Lets take the link in my sig that particular ondemand
setup all though small requires live streaming and
recording serverside,as well as other serverside code
to control various scripts/data to maintain a list of
videos and audio files,control schedule,and some other
things i dont want to mension.
Just because it doesnt show it ,the functionality
is there for future use.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 11th September 2008, 22:54   #20
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heh, which all makes my point that people with money and a business plan, are moving to flash now.

Even MicroSoft and 'siverlight' which is in rapid development cannot come close to what flash offers now.
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Old 11th September 2008, 23:10   #21
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Smelter, imho the only problem of Flash right now is that there aren't valid free tools to stream live video and p2p is not supported.
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Old 11th September 2008, 23:11   #22
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the flash live encoder is free and streams in H264
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Old 11th September 2008, 23:37   #23
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yeah, that particular thing was that the IOClass within red5 does not contain the parser to regulate the delivery.

We do already rock the h264+acc with other servers.
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Old 12th September 2008, 02:07   #24
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just want to add further that in my opinion
h264 does not perform as well as vp6,since
flash player wont support vp6/aac+ i give
10s point back to nsv

[edit]h264 at lower bitrates[/edit]

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 12th September 2008, 07:33   #25
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NSV still have one great advantage over Flash... Flash is closed source, NSV is open.

If Adobe wanted to make a change to Flash, we would all have to follow their decisions. But WE can form NSV however we want, if AOL likes it or not.

EDIT: just a simple example: How long did it take Flash to implement X264/AACP codecs(Have they released an encoder yet?)? NSV had it almost the second it came out. What will happen next time a great codec is released?
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Old 12th September 2008, 09:18   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nick@ss
the flash live encoder is free and streams in H264
And it sucks.Framerates are buggy and the h264 quality is much much lower than what x264 does.
I completely agree with wildex
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Old 12th September 2008, 16:37   #27
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1. swf format and flv format, and flex is now OPEN source 100%.

2. vp6+aac IS an option.

3. Adobe is adding p2p streaming. How about that direction?

4. Users.... Just look at the installation base.

I made a pay-per-view credit card payment system in flash that cannot be made in nsv....

Seriously folks..... There was potential in 2004.
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Old 12th September 2008, 17:19   #28
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1. Well, even so Adobe still controls what is the format used for the end user.

3. Is adding? Well, so? I can start adding p2p NSV and say it is being added too(Rather, I have actually tried it once)

4. Well, they got the user base, for sure.

Pay-per-view? That's easy to make, and is really independent of what format you use. Just make some kind of server side check to see if they have paid, and woila, pay-per-view.

Potential is always there, you just have to find it.
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Old 12th September 2008, 17:24   #29
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All I can say is , Have fun....

I will continue to make a living , programming php,as3,java and consulting people on the use of red5.

Good luck.
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Old 12th September 2008, 17:35   #30
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oh smelter,how i like you telling people how great
you are since you found flex/red5.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 12th September 2008, 17:48   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Smelter
All I can say is , Have fun....

I will continue to make a living , programming php,as3,java and consulting people on the use of red5.

Good luck.
Well, there's a very valid point for you, you're trying to make a living, I'm just doing this as a hobby
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Old 12th September 2008, 17:53   #32
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Yes although my last comment was a bit naughty
its great your earning a good living out of it
smelter,however most people like wildex999
who are involved in Nsv do so as a hobby/fun.

There is no rule that says you must make money
from doing what you like but it can be a great bonus.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 12th September 2008, 20:14   #33
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I was great long before I found flex and red5! lol

No offense taken, and by no means do I advocate destroying nsv.

The real question is , "What is AOL going to DO ABOUT IT?"

Plugin? ActiveX? Release the source code to DNAS? What?

I expect to hear silence and see a black screen with a llama image....
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Old 12th September 2008, 20:25   #34
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Give AOL a reason to do something and they will.

BTW just updated forum title :P

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 12th September 2008, 20:30   #35
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Source code to DNAS? Wat would we do with that? It's not that hard to re-create.

Nice forum title Jkey
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Old 12th September 2008, 20:58   #36
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A vicious cycle into the toilet, much as my turds.

Give aol a reason to develop it and they will, but nobody has a reason to use it because aol is not doing anything with it....

No, it doesnt work like that. Nobody is jumping to a ship that stopped sailing long ago, and nobody is going to get on board with the captain saying he'll sail if enough people do get on board....

First question of nsv user after he/she finally streams successfully....
Can I load it in the browser? So-and-So doesnt want to install winamp...

IF AOL makes nsv available in the browser like flash plugin... then , and only then, will I make nsv an option to clients.

nsv in media library = MONEY to AOL from Advert's.
Lets see them do something that benefits others whether finacially or just 'so I can put it on my web page'.
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Old 12th September 2008, 21:08   #37
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Didnt AOL switch to flash themselves?

Quite telling, really.

Almost... 'end of discussion', dare I say?

heh heh
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Old 12th September 2008, 21:10   #38
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oh snap.

knockout blow from smelter ?

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 12th September 2008, 21:14   #39
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I have never have, and probably never will care what AOL does or doesn't. Since I started programming for NSV 3-4 years ago, I have never seen anything to AOL. But NSV is quite precious to me, as it was programming for NSV I first learned how to program C/C++, how binary and Hexdecimal worked, and how video/audio streaming worked. I'll never let NSV go.
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Old 12th September 2008, 21:17   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by wildex999
it was programming for NSV I first learned how to program C/C++, how binary and Hexdecimal worked, and how video/audio streaming worked.
same.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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