Tell me, Why on earth would I, or anyone else believe in god?

[squakMix]

...Go ahead.

I dont understand.

[cyu]

There has been hundreds of threads like this. Do a search if you don't believe me.

[squakMix]

I remember one like 5 months ago, But this never got solved, it just died. I'm seriously confused about it.

Also, I have been visiting this Forum dayly (Sp) and I havent seen another thread about this. I dont want to revive a year old thread about the subject.

[Michgelsen]

Some people think this complicated world could not have excisted without the help of a higher power.

I think it is possible.

So, I don't believe in god. But I think that is the main reason.

[cyu]

knock yourself out
http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...arguments.html

[squakMix]

Scientists think that The universe Infinitely expands and colapses on it's self... It Has a "big bang" and then eventually comes back in on it'self. I believe that we didnt start out complex, but started out as some small, Extremely simple life-form, that eventually EVOLVED into something complex.

It's like saying "I dont believe computers could exist without a higher being that created them"... I know, a computer is way more simple than a universe, but It evolved slowely from something that was simple, into something that became very complex.

[Coman]

it makes many people happy to believe in better, have a goal and live optimisticly(sp), believing in god distracts them from some reality and pulls a better world over their eyes. some people of course just don't know enough science. i wish i wasn't an atheist, maybe i wouldn't be so pessimistic.

[cyu]

Yea, so how would there have been computers without humans to construct them?

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
knock yourself out
http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...arguments.html

Come On, I want to hear what you people think about this... I'm not trying to insult anybody's religion... Just simple discussion.

I cant think of ONE GOOD reason why I would believe in it.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
Yea, so how would there have been computers without humans to construct them?

the Humans represent Evolution.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by Coman
it makes many people happy to believe in better, have a goal and live optimisticly(sp), believing in god distracts them from some reality and pulls a better world over their eyes. some people of course just don't know enough science. i wish i wasn't an atheist, maybe i wouldn't be so pessimistic.

Yea, I think one of the biggest reasons that Christianity was invented, is because death is scary. Humans cant grasp the idea of "just being dead". It's impossible to imagine... lacking the copassity (sp) to think.

[cyu]

I am not insulted, since I am agonstic. The thing is that this debate has been going for thousands of years and both sides seems to bring up reasonable arguments, but none of which can be totally proven.

[cyu]

Originally posted by squakMix
the Humans represent Evolution.

yea, but my point is that humans are the higher beings which brought the computer into existence. I understand that the computer advanced and "evolved" but it was the creators who made it happen: human beings.

[edit]sorry about the double post[/edit]

[squakMix]

Well, I know that when I die, I dont think anymore. Your brain physically cannot generate another thought. I see that when I die, I die. I dont see, though, that when I die, I go to heaven. Nothing shows me that my "Soul" lifts out of my body, and goes to a magical palace in the clouds. It just happends to be Invisible...

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
yea, but my point is that humans are the higher beings which brought the computer into existence. I understand that the computer advanced and "evolved" but it was the creators who made it happen: human beings.

[edit]sorry about the double post[/edit]

Yea, that was probably a bad example, because Humans are the ones that make computers.

You can prove that humans have worked on it though, and that it didnt change by it'self. You cannot let a computer sit in a room, and have it automatically get faster, stronger, and smaller. It can't "adapt", as living things do.

[Myxomatosis]

You have to rememeber that computers are inamimate, thus, we have had to build them. Life forms for example the first singled celled organism (forgot name) had to have evolved.

[cyu]

Because "souls" belong to the metaphysical world, which is a place we cannot perceive.

I am just stating arguments that people might say towards your statements.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
Because "souls" belong to the metaphysical world, which is a place we cannot perceive.

I am just stating arguments that people might say towards your statements.

Why would I believe in the "metaphysical" world?

[cyu]

Originally posted by Myxomatosis
Life forms for example the first singled celled organism (forgot name) had to have evolved.

Why couldn't a high being just created a single celled organism or a multicellular organism for all that matters. It didn't have to have evolved.

@squax: hah why would you believe that anything exists squax? Maybe nothing is there. maybe this world is not real.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
Why couldn't a high being just created a single celled organism or a multicellular organism for all that matters. It didn't have to have evolved.

@squax: hah why would you believe that anything exists squax? Maybe nothing is there. maybe this world is not real.

Because I can see, feel, touch, taste and interact with it.

here's the question Why WOULD there be a "higher being" that created the small, single celled organisms? I cant disprove it, but I can tell you that modern science has proven that It could happen on it's own.

When you ask someone to DISPROVE something, that's hard. Such as, You cant disprove that I am really the king amenmotep, back to rule the slave lepricon army to freedom, and destroy the universe.
You cant disprove that santa clause exists.

[cyu]

Their argument states that God is both an omnipotent and omniscient being of which there is no greater. I don't get what you mean when you said it was created on its own.

[squakMix]

I say that everything essential to life is already there. You say: "Where the fuck did the molecules come from" And I say "From smaller atoms, made up of smaller, electrons, protons, and nuetrons." You say "where the fuck did THOSE come from" and I say "If god was 'always there' then why cant the universe have been?"

[cyu]

Theres a difference between "composed of" and "created". And who said that the universe hasn't there?

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
Theres a difference between "composed of" and "created". And who said that the universe hasn't there?

Well, if the ingredients for life, and the CONDITIONS for life have "Always" been there, then It's only a matter of time before life, well, lives. After life is created, it dies and composes to make dirt, which eventually makes rock, which makes mineral... the Organism evolves into several different branches... makes trees, mammals, bugs, ect.

[mrharhar]

The god 'was always there' argument is based on time moving forward from some point in the past. Modern physics does not require this.
There was no 'before' the big bang, because time did not exist. Time is a property of the universe created in the big bang.
We can explain how the universe was created. How we evolved. How we came to be.
I believe in god not because it solves the question ‘how’, but because it solves the question ‘why’.

Obviously, you can believe that there is no reason if you want to...

[cyu]

In all of your arguments, you basically proclaim that there is evolution. People who believe in God do not believe in evolution. They believe that one being created everything, not that one little cell "evolved" into the organisms we know of today. Therefore, all of your arguments are bias.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by mrharhar
The god 'was always there' argument is based on time moving forward from some point in the past. Modern physics does not require this.
There was no 'before' the big bang, because time did not exist. Time is a property of the universe created in the big bang.
We can explain how the universe was created. How we evolved. How we came to be.
I believe in god not because it solves the question ‘how’, but because it solves the question ‘why’.

Obviously, you can believe that there is no reason if you want to...

Why DO you believe that there IS a why?
Also, your religion then includes heaven, hell, souls, and everything else that doesnt seem to make sense.
I seriously dont understand how you can believe in souls more than lepricons.

[Loveless]

post_count++

If a person believes in a diety, they do so because that diety is a part of their fundamental beliefs.

A person might adopt a religion that includes a diety for many reasons, but most derive from the same fundamental situation: the human situation. By this, I basically refer to man's need for reassurance in the face of an inexplicable environment.

This environment entails not just physical phenomena (lightning, thunder, death, birth, the physical origin of the universe) but also purpose. The eternal why?.

A diety helps explain both the physical and spiritual quandries of mankind if placed in the right context. So does science.

I'm hoping that you know all of this. What I'm also hoping is that eventually you'll realize that the kind of "investigation" you're conduction serves absolutely no purpose. You'll learn nothing by running your mouth. If you truly, really want to understand another person's point of view, you need to empathize with that person - to understand the basic circumstances that helped formulate their beliefs and to understand how their beliefs address those circumstances. For instance (a very brief, non-comprehensive for instance) Judaism helped provide a unifying force for a numerically inferior and landless people. You'll also need to investigate the spiritual needs of a people. If you listen to any of the angst-punk-pop on the radio, you're more than capable of this.

In short, I'm saying what the first person to respond said. If you really want to know, shut the fuck up and research, observe, listen to people. If you don't really want to know, then just shut the fuck up.

[LollipopLustKil]

We're all made of carbon, and according to scientists they might have found the center of where this happened. They say they can find high levels of energy radiating from around a certain spot, so they believe that to be the center of, well, everything.

"God, he is the biggest bitch of them all." - South Park

But I'm not exactly into thinking of why I "should" believe. My beliefs are simple, if no one has literally seen something and can literally prove it, I might believe it. I've gone through these conversations at school many times.

I had to debate this in my school in front of the entire school one time, and I won. Now think about that, being that 90% of the school was Christians. Hard, it seems like. No.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by cyu
In all of your arguments, you basically proclaim that there is evolution. People who believe in God do not believe in evolution. They believe that one being created everything, not that one little cell "evolved" into the organisms we know of today. Therefore, all of your arguments are bias.

Goddamn, I hate creationists.


Ok, then if they believe in that, how can they believe in birth? Why doesnt god just "make" humans? The only reason that evolution is a "theory" is because of the fact that there isnt a mathematical equasion that can PROVE evolution. There is, in fact physical proof that things adapt to their surroundings. Say, if a person, and the last ten generations of his family lived on a lake, and went swimming every day, in a few hundred years it is likely that that family will "Evolve" or develope webbed feet.

[mrharhar]

Why DO you believe that there IS a why?

Ah the recursive question.

The recursive answer; if there is no why to your existence, why should there be a why to my belief?

Aie?

And lets not confuse issues.
You asked about belief in god. Not in the traditional Christian god of the old testament; "heaven, hell, souls, and everything else that doesn’t seem to make sense"
isn't part of the original question. Leave it aside for now.
Ditto evolution. One can easily believe in both evolution and god. One can’t be a creationist and still believe in evolution, but that’s not the issue at hand.

[Nimelennar]

I believe in God because there's times that I've felt his guidance in my life, and it's always guided me the right way. I believe in God because when I'm in church, I feel more complete than I do the entire rest of the week combined.
It also gives me a rock to tie myself to, so that I don't stray too far from where I am supposed to be.

[LollipopLustKil]

Originally posted by Nimelennar
I believe in God because there's times that I've felt his guidance in my life, and it's always guided me the right way. I believe in God because when I'm in church, I feel more complete than I do the entire rest of the week combined.
It also gives me a rock to tie myself to, so that I don't stray too far from where I am supposed to be.

"Felt his guidance"? In what way, like a guidance counsler? What if I were to hypnotize you and tell you advice, or whisper it to you at night while you were sleeping. You could believe anything, be guided in any ways.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by Nimelennar
I believe in God because there's times that I've felt his guidance in my life, and it's always guided me the right way. I believe in God because when I'm in church, I feel more complete than I do the entire rest of the week combined.
It also gives me a rock to tie myself to, so that I don't stray too far from where I am supposed to be.

If it's not sarcasm:

You're saying that the only reason you DO believe in god, is because believing in something that hundreds of other people do, gives you a sense of unity and comfort. You like it BECAUSE of the fact that you DO believe in god. You wouldnt like church if you didnt believe in god.

So, you say (summed down) that the only reason you believe in god, is because you believe in god.

[mrharhar]

<snippage> n a few hundred years it is likely that that family will "Evolve" or develope webbed feet.

Er No.
Do some damn research and come back. Firstly; Few hundred years? Mutations aren’t that common.
Secondly; Webbed feet would not give him enough advantage to give his genes more chance to propagate.

If you want to learn something keep an open mind.

In short, I'm saying what the first person to respond said. If you really want to know, shut the fuck up and research, observe, listen to people. If you don't really want to know, then just shut the fuck up.

Amen.

[mrharhar]

So, you say (summed down) that the only reason you believe in god, is because you believe in god.

So what your saying, summed down, is that you dont care what other people think, and will compleatly ignore the opposite viewpoint.

I dont have time to waste banging my head against this particular brick wall.

Good night.

Have fun.

[cyu]

OK this discussion way too objective. The important thing is not that God has to or doesn't have to exist. It is that people have faith, which is the primary reason why people pray.

[squakMix]

Hmm, is that why it has actually happend? Scientists did some research on this family that lived on lake or ocean somewhere, and got their food by fishing, by the 8th generation that actually developed a ressesive gene for webbed feet. I know, it sounds crazy, but I'm not making this up. I read it like 3 or 4 years ago... I think it was in the news..

[LollipopLustKil]

Yeah, I jumped in on this converstaion to actually talk about it, but you all seem to be almost ignoring what people say and peer around the corner for another angle at the topic.

[squakMix]

Originally posted by mrharhar
So what your saying, summed down, is that you dont care what other people think, and will compleatly ignore the opposite viewpoint.

You dont make any sense at all. How did I at all, ignore the opposite view point?