Media Libraries

[lukeprog]

Are there other free, skinnable media players that have a media library that is as functional as Winamp's?

[sanosuke]

Why don't you want to use winamp?

[will]

I think its "Classic doesn't have enough funcionality, but Modern uses too many resources"
An argument which doesn't fly very well with me.

[asellus]

I think Classic is just as functional as Modern, except docking (and color theme).

[lukeprog]

Well, I'm hoping to find a media player that has the functions of winamp I love and use (media library, assignable global hotkeys, and very skinnable), but one that I don't have to be a computer programmer in order to skin.

[Reaper]

Originally posted by lukeprog
Well, I'm hoping to find a media player that has the functions of winamp I love and use (media library, assignable global hotkeys, and very skinnable), but one that I don't have to be a computer programmer in order to skin.

Good luck; Your search probably won't too far. I doubt if any skinning engine that resembles Winamp's modern skins will just allow you to layout some bitmaps and construct the skin. Some kind of code has to tell what the images do and where they are placed.

[Kickboy12]

Yeh. Nothing of that nature exists. It's really not that hard to learn, either. Just takes time and patience.

In the world of programming: Error is more common than success.

[electricmime]

hmm, i just want to change the 'open' button on the modern skin so it opens up album list menu instead of the open file thing..

would that be hard to do?

[lunarboy1]

need a plug-in for that. It has nothig to do with the skin.

[electricmime]

you would need a plugin to change the function of a button on the skin?

it seems like it would be just what you told the button to do >.>

[StreetWalker]

The Media Library is the best thing to happen to WinAmp. I'd like to see the Media Libr playlists to look like the main window with columns. This is an obvious thing to do but somebody is afraid of change in the development group.
Steve

[StreetWalker]

Steve,

You will never see this because the old WinAmp guru's don't want this change.

Steve

[chris_d_smith]

@electricmime

you would need a plugin to change the function of a button on the skin?

I think what they mean is that you would need a plugin to build/display the album list and allow you to choose things from it etc (?).

The button is easy enough to change inside the skin (xml\player-normal-group.xml line 1119->1128).

[sanosuke]

Whats the point of reviving this thread?

[mikm]

Because eith Mr. Walker is pissed that nobody responded and decided to whine, or he has multiple personalities and was talking to himself without realizing it.

[siebe83]

Originally posted by StreetWalker
I'd like to see the Media Libr playlists to look like the main window with columns.

I don't even understand what he means...
What is he talking about?

[mikm]

I think he wants the playlists in the ML to look like the "Local Media" view.

[siebe83]

Ok, in that case I will quote Drewbar:

Originally posted by drewbar
NO. Playlists are playlists, views are views :/

(taken from this post )

So, Steve has his answer now...

(Crosspost and you'll get crossquote)

[d3x7r0]

I just wished the Winamp Tradicional Playlist where to become a special playlist in the library itself, that way one could have both funcionalities together as one and have a winamp3-like behaviour for multiple playlists...

It would be great...

[electricmime]

Originally posted by d3x7r0
I just wished the Winamp Tradicional Playlist where to become a special playlist in the library itself, that way one could have both funcionalities together as one and have a winamp3-like behaviour for multiple playlists...

It would be great...

is this better?

[d3x7r0]

well it does sort of do what I asked but it's so bulky :S

I rather wait for DrO's Extended Playlist to give me something more like I wanted.

It's a pity that skin's so bulky but there's no way arround it, you can't hide the sidepanels in the Media Library (IDEA )

[StreetWalker]

Originally posted by m²k
I think he wants the playlists in the ML to look like the "Local Media" view.

Thank you sir. You are the only one to understand this simple concept.

siebe83 who is a (Major Dude) bring us a quote from
drewbar who is also a (Major dude) who said:

"NO. Playlists are playlists, views are views
This is NOT a brilliant statement dude. Just a smart ass response to a serious question.

Dudes, this is so simple. The Local Media view has tabbed columns which can be customized by order and size. The Playlists View are really the same thing except they hold your favorite songs in a list. When you select a playlist, why don't you see the same tabbed columns?

Every other major player does it this way because it is a more functional and consistent interface. More functional so you can easily sort by column and is why they do it this way in WMP9. Many of you so called "dudes" are just a bunch of rogue pretenders who would do the opposite of what you see in WMP9 even when it's the superior way to do it. Whose paying the bills for development of WinAmp 5 anyway?

Steve

[electricmime]

but playlists are set up like the playlist window(which is why you can sort like you can in the playlist, and the titles are set up like the playlist) it wouldnt be consistent to have the playlist window and the playlist section be totally different

hence playlists are playlists, views are views...

playlists are lists of songs, views are more like filters of your entire library...

and major dude is an automatic title given to you for how many posts you have made, and btw.. i have never used the columns, and one of the major reasons why i couldnt stand itunes

btw, dont crosspost

[StreetWalker]

electricmime, thanks for the info and help. I have an idea: Make the Media Libr playlists work the old way or the new way as an option. The new way would have tabbed columns as I am asking for. I will make you a bet that if you do this 90% of the users will choose this option. Any takers? If this is true, it will be because 90% of users want an easy solution as opposed to the cryptic old way of doing it with % this & % that macro language.

Steve

[electricmime]

the gigantic flaw in tabs(that no media player that uses them has corrected that i have seen) is they arent customizable..(you cant abbreviate albums/titles, you cant choose which order you want to sort in, for example say you want artist->title->album) though some more atf options would be great (like rating and playcount)

and i wouldnt be so sure that 90% people would use it, being that i have heard complaints that there are columns in the views section...

[StreetWalker]

electricmime,

When I copy a CD into WMP9 all the information is looked up and presented perfectly in the correct columns. The new option works fine in this scenario. When you download mp3's you get filenames as you describe which must be broken down into the proper columns. Maybe this is where you you need the old option. But once all the files are complete why wouldn't you want the easier to use new option?

NOT because "views are views" and "playlists are playlists".

Steve

[sanosuke]

Views are view and playlist are playlist.

The playlist window cannot change because it would render the thousand of classic skins imcompatiable.

[siebe83]

As said, I am (Major Dude) only, because I posted a certain number of posts. I don't pretend to be any better than junior/senior members; I just reply to the content they post. If that content needs a smart ass respond, I will give a smart ass respond.

As also said, with one atf-rule you can customize much better than with several columns. I like the idea of columns, though it only makes sense when your files are properly tagged: otherwise it will be a mess. And if your files are properly tagged, you won't need columns to sort your files: you can do that through atf (or sort on filename, if your files are not properly tagged).
If you need help with atf, post a new thread and there will be people willing to help you.

I like the idea of a playlist being just a list. You can change the sort method, you can also make your own order. In the latter case, it'll not be ordered by one column at all. I wonder wether that'd be possible with columns.
I like the Winamp playlist for what it is, not for being different from WMP. Fuck WMP, btw.

Don't expect the playlist to change any time soon (if ever): as said, any changes in the layout of the playlist editor will make 1000's of classic skins useless. Well, off course they could only change the Media Library playlists; but that would be confusing: The same playlist will look different in ML vs. playlist editor.

Maybe there's a plugin that displays playlists by columns, for a long list of playlist management plugins take a look here:
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread....974#post434974

[edit]
Ok, I now see you crossposted this in the BUG reports. Tsshhh... Behave.

[StreetWalker]

Originally posted by sanosuke
Views are view and playlist are playlist.

The playlist window cannot change because it would render the thousand of classic skins imcompatiable.

sanosuke & siebe83,

I understand this as it pertains to the Playlist Editor Window which comes up when you hit the PL button on the player. However, the playlists in the Media Library do not have skins associated with them do they? I don't care about the Playlist Editor having columns. I've been talking about having column in the Media Libr Playlists ONLY. I hope we've been talking about two different things and there is still hope to do this.

Steve

[sanosuke]

Originally posted by StreetWalker
I don't care about the Playlist Editor having columns. I've been talking about having column in the Media Libr Playlists ONLY.

Ahh ok...understood.

Maybe this can be added to the wishlist? (any mods around?)

[DJ Egg]

I can add it to the "never never" section...

[siebe83]

Actually, that's a good idea: creating a "never never" section...
That way, you can lock threads and say 'already in the wishlist'

[StreetWalker]

Sorry Major Dudes. I've never been so humbled as I am now. I probably just don't understand anything here.

[siebe83]

Well, Senior Member...

Originally posted by siebe83

Don't expect the playlist to change any time soon (if ever): as said, any changes in the layout of the playlist editor will make 1000's of classic skins useless. Well, off course they could only change the Media Library playlists; but that would be confusing: The same playlist will look different in ML vs. playlist editor.

In addition to that: columnized playlists would need a different way of storing info.
Winamp m3u files look like this:

code:
#EXTINF:226,Pixies - Where Is My Mind? {1988}

C:\Geluiden\Muziek\Pixies - Where Is My Mind.mp3

#EXTINF:301,10cc - Dreadlock Holiday {1978}

C:\Geluiden\Muziek\10cc - Dreadlock Holiday.mp3

After 'EXTINF' it will state which info the playlist editor should display. For columns this makes no sense, so it should be divided in multiple info entries (per column) in the playlist file.
BUT, that's only for the playlists in ML. So if you made a playlist in the ML, and open it in the playlist editor, it would need to read all metadata again.

To summarize:
it would be weird to have two sorts of playlists in one Winamp, imho...

[StreetWalker]

siebe83,

Thank you for the information. WinAmp5 has many options in it so you add a new option for the "ML Playlist" to be the old style macros or new style columns?

Each "new style ML Playlist" will have its own index file (similar to main.idx) that point to the data inside main.dat. Also the .idx file would have a header containing assignments for column order and size for that folder. When you send a mp3 file from the local media list or from another playlist it will add another index to playlistA.idx file.

Steve

[siebe83]

Ok, let's state it this way: there are way too much requests to implement them all in Winamp. For instance, the wishlist. When something is in the wishlist, it does not mean that it will (ever) be implemented. It just gives the developers an idea of what is asked for. Most of the requests don't even make it to the wishlist (only much-asked for features will be put in the wishlist).
The feature you are asking for demands a lot of coding: it needs a completely new way of storing playlists. Also, if I understand you correctly, it will use the Media Library to get song info. That's a new point of view, regarding playlists. The difference between ML playlists and 'normal' playlists will only increase more. This won't contribute to the (already not that good, in my opinion) Media Library integration in Winamp.

Off course, it could be 'an option', but it's just not a thing a lot of people want, I think, and therefore probably isn't worth the coding.
Besides that, I think it's better to keep Winamp as clear as possible, which would not be the case if a new sort of playlist would be introduced (through a backdoor, as the ML is) while keeping the old one as well.
Maybe there's someone who's willing to code a plugin that could do it.
(that's a great feature of Winamp: you can add features by making/using plugins )

Siebe

[edit]
btw, a great thing of playlists is that they can be used across programs/plugins etc.
If i make a playlist in the playlist editor, the ML will be able to read it, so does Dynamic Library (see my sig; it has columns in playlists!! though not sortable , also, it doesn't store the metadata, so it'll take longer to load a playlist), and so do a lot of other plugins/progs.
This won't be possible with the sort of playlist you suggested.

[StreetWalker]

siebe83, Thanks for the insight on this and I see your point about backward compatibility concerning playlists. My idea of using indexes may be too complex and an insider (programmer) may have a simple solution with less coding that would still be backward compatible. I still believe that the columns should be in an ML Playlist same as done in the Media View for consistency as a user interface. It's obviously not popular to say this but the WMP9 is a much better overall user interface. However, WinAmp5 is a great player and offers tons of flexibility not found in WMP9. I do karaoke shows using WinAmp5 and associated plugin's and it works great for 4+ solid hours.

Peace!
Steve