Your favorite quote?

[nature spirit]

it was well chosen for a final quote huehue. a quote that I always tell in fact..

[rm']

Originally posted by Huehuetenango
but doesn't religion give a reason for someone who otherwise not be moral to be moral?
some people, if not given incentive, will not think twice about their actions, the promise of reward for good behaviour on earth gives them this incentive

Are morals really worth bloodshed? Furthermore, by promoting greed (for the afterlife), aren't religions advocating the very things they are against.

I say that morality should not even be a consideration. They are far too subjective and rigid to be of any use.

[nature spirit]

RM.. may be you're missing the point here or may be I didnt get exactly what you mean. no body mentioned that morals are worth bloodshed.. morals in fact are different from religion. they are of something connecting to humanity, whereas religion connects to spirituality. in the end of the tunnnel, everything crossmerge.
heaven is not a prize that is preached so ppl would be greedy for. at least in christianity. it's the ultimate goal to unite with God. it's beyond all what one could imagine.
as for morals, they are subjective in someway, that's true. but their essence is universal. just imagine a society without them.. wouldnt it be a jungle? even worse.. in jungle, animals aren't evil aligned. they follow their instinct to survive. where as the conflict of good and evil inside of human keeps a balance and morals keep the world a place worth living in.

btw, here's a quote, so we dont miss the point of this thread


There is nothing higher and stronger and more wholesome and useful for life in later years than some good memory, especially a memory connected with childhood, with home. If a man carries many such memories with him into life, he is safe to the end of his days, and if we have only one good memory left in our hearts, even that may sometime be the means of saving us.

Feodor Dostroyevsk

[Howesy007]

"I float like a butterfly, sting like a bee"

"The crowd didn't dream when they laid down their money that they would see a total eclipse of the sunny"

"I am the greatest"

"Get up sucker, and fight. Get up and fight"

"I don't always know what I'm talking about but i know I'm right"

"It will be a killer and a chiller and a thrilla, when i get the gorilla in Manilla"

"Superman dont need no seatbelt"

"It's not bragging if you can back it up"

"Now you see me, now you dont, George thinks he will see me but i know he wont"

"There are more pleasent things to do than beat people up"

"I'll beat him so bad he'll need a shoe horn to put his hat on"

"I'm not the greatest, I am the double greatest"

"I figured that if I said it enough, I would convince the world that I really was the greatest"

Muhammed Ali's quotes

[fuct'n'bored]

layer: Is ther a any relationsip betwen ADD and ritolin
AMA: No
Press:


I think this pritty much sums up the american drug industry and press

[ertmann|CPH]

well i never said that they were exactly the same but

They all promise us an afterlife
They all teach monotheism (some disagreements on the trinity though)
They all have a non personified god
The list goes on......(im to tired to remeber, but my teacher in religion listed some 30-40 similarities)

But offcourse a religion have to adapt to the society in which they come from

[nature spirit]

well the game of similaritie si so easy.. i can find plenty between a devil and an angel. it's a commun religious trend nowadays to merge all religions in one universal stream, but this just doesnt work because it's completely irrelevant. A religion, if true, is not region-specific and could adapt to any given society I believe.

and btw, if you believe that God is inifinte, then this is only normal that he is non-personified. in christianity for instance, incarnation is the key for humans to perceive the father through the son.

[and1k]

Originally posted by Xerxes
"The existence of free society depends on a free market" -Xerxes

"The wheels of bureaucracy have never turned slower because of the extra grease applied to them" - Xerxes

"Batteries are never included" - Xerxes

All Ferengi Rules of Acquisition rock.

Xerxes = trekkie.
(me too)

[james]

"Losers only whine about doing their best - winners go home and fuck the prom queen!" - The Rock

Short, sweet, and to the point!

[nature spirit]

hum.. poor queen

[ertmann|CPH]

Originally posted by nature spirit
well the game of similaritie si so easy.. i can find plenty between a devil and an angel. it's a commun religious trend nowadays to merge all religions in one universal stream, but this just doesnt work because it's completely irrelevant. A religion, if true, is not region-specific and could adapt to any given society I believe.

and btw, if you believe that God is inifinte, then this is only normal that he is non-personified. in christianity for instance, incarnation is the key for humans to perceive the father through the son.

well anyway it would be good for world peace, if everybody started looking at how much we have in common istead of using all that energy on finding the small differences

just my thoughts - you can quote me for that

- stefan

[nature spirit]

that's an excellent one sertman, no kidding..
but the whole point is that differences are never a cause against peace.. or they should never be.. so instead of fearing them, we should not ignore them and hide our head in the sand. we should accept others as they are with all their distinctions.

[rm']

Originally posted by nature spirit
RM.. may be you're missing the point here or may be I didnt get exactly what you mean. no body mentioned that morals are worth bloodshed.. morals in fact are different from religion. they are of something connecting to humanity, whereas religion connects to spirituality. in the end of the tunnnel, everything crossmerge.
heaven is not a prize that is preached so ppl would be greedy for. at least in christianity. it's the ultimate goal to unite with God. it's beyond all what one could imagine.
as for morals, they are subjective in someway, that's true. but their essence is universal. just imagine a society without them.. wouldnt it be a jungle? even worse.. in jungle, animals aren't evil aligned. they follow their instinct to survive. where as the conflict of good and evil inside of human keeps a balance and morals keep the world a place worth living in.

I highly recommend that you read The Prince and Tao te Jing to see the folly of morals. They attempt to apply rigid rules to a fluid world, thus, will always fail in their purpose. I am thoroughly convinced that if the world stopped trying to do what was right, and tried to do what is best, we'd all be much happier. That's because what is right depends on who you are, but what is best is absolute in any given situation.

[nature spirit]

I will take in consideration your recommendation RM, thx.

but again, what is best is something very, very relative in a concrete and unperfect world that is crowded with both instincts and spiritualities..
it has been observed that even for ppl very far from society and civilisation, there is a nucleus of commun sense that is related to moral, in a more universal way.. something often called conscience..

[Merlin]

Here's a good one:

"Wise men make proverbs, fools repeat them"

[rm']

Sometimes, what is best is to make peace with your neighbours so that they will live peacefully with you. But sometimes it is best to attack them so that you can gain an advantage. Making a blanket statement like "Thou shalt not kill" excludes the possibility that sometimes it may be necessary to kill in order to serve your own interests. After all, we are on this planet to live, and we must do whatever is necessary to continue living.

[Xerxes]

Originally posted by nature spirit
but again, what is best is something very, very relative in a concrete and unperfect world

Logic error- nothing is concrete. Everything lives only long enough for it to die. Or it could be said, "Change is the only Constant in the Universe"

[rm']

Right. To expand on the idea, it's only possible to perform actions in the short run, because the circumstances which you are planning for only exist in the short run. The long run is unpredictable, so it is impossible to plan for. That's why it's best to do what is best. What is best depends from scenario to scenario. In one scenario, it may be best to steal, but in another, it may be best to donate. Morality attempts to dominate the long run, and apply rules to it, by saying things like "it is always better to give than to recieve". However, the world changes, so sometimes it is best, sometimes to recieve.

[Bogger]

'I don't believe in god but i fear him'

[nature spirit]

I can't see the link however, Xerxes.. concrete doesnt mean in any sense it's something that is here to stay. of course it's a constant changing world, that's for sure..

but RM, your hinting that one's own interests should be taken as priority, and everything should orbit around that. So it is justified that I hurt a human being just if the circumstances allow it, or require it.. which I see as completely against human nature..

[Musicfix59]

"There is no situation on earth that can't be made better with the right kind of music."

[nature spirit]

very pertinent. just you didn't specify the author.. is it you?

_______________________
euh.. who is Yoko??

[Xerxes]

Originally posted by and1k


All Ferengi Rules of Acquisition rock.

Xerxes = trekkie.
(me too)

Those arn't rules of Aquisition, they are basic economic truths.

Rules of Aquisition are

"Never let family get in the way of opportunity"

"Never trust a man wearing a better suit than your own"

"Nature Decays, but Latinum Lasts Forever"

and of course rule #1-
"Once you get their money, you never give it back"

[Xerxes]

Originally posted by nature spirit
So it is justified that I hurt a human being just if the circumstances allow it, or require it.. which I see as completely against human nature..

Sometimes it is justified. Klling people is not always good in the long term, however. But sometimes it is- when Japanese christians were discovered by the govt during the Christian explusion, their families were not only killed, but the three neighbor families adjacent to their house on each side were killed.

Thus by killing a few, people were quick to find all the Christians in the country because they themselves did not want to be killed living next to one.

Shockingly Brutal? Absolutely. Barbaric? Probably. Effective? Extremely.

(Note i dont hate christians its just the first policy example on the top of my head)

[Xerxes]

Originally posted by N e m e s s i s


latinum . . . is that anything like the euro? whats the symbol for it?

Star Trek Money The only material in the universe unable to be replicated ...

[Xerxes]

Originally posted by nature spirit
I can't see the link however, Xerxes.. concrete doesnt mean in any sense it's something that is here to stay. of course it's a constant changing world, that's for sure..

Nothing is concrete. Everything is only in flux between two or more different extremes. Once you see the everything in the world as different configurations out of an infinite possible, it is easier to see that alternatives and solutions to problems either rely mainly on adapting to configurations, or changing the problem itself.

[nature spirit]

Sometimes it is justified. Klling people is not always good in the long term, however. But sometimes it is

so killing ppl is justified when is convenient. effective? extremely. true. so effectiveness justifies it?? who decides if the cause is good enough for a genocide?

I donnu.. but either you're arguing this way as in a form of satire of how humans use to twist causes and destinties, or you really believe in it, which surprizes me indeed.

[NRen2k5]

Let's get back on topic!

"For all the advances in modern medicine, there's still no cure for the common birthday." — John Glenn

[nature spirit]

hum.. since we're back on track:

Art is man's nature; nature is God's art. P.J. Bailey.

[rm']

Originally posted by nature spirit
so killing ppl is justified when is convenient. effective? extremely. true. so effectiveness justifies it?? who decides if the cause is good enough for a genocide?

I donnu.. but either you're arguing this way as in a form of satire of how humans use to twist causes and destinties, or you really believe in it, which surprizes me indeed.

Killing does not need justification. Killing is just an act. Acts need justification only when there is a concept of right and wrong. As Xerxes pointed out, the world is not concrete, so there is no such thing as right or wrong (because the circumstances of every event is different). There is only success and failure. Sometimes it is necessary to kill, sometimes killing will lead to failure. Other times, the success that could be had by killing is not large enough to warrant the effort.

[eleet-2k2]

"It really isn't a bad place once you get used to all the druggings." --Marge Simpson

Somehow, this quote really applies to reality. Scary!

[dead-beat]

<accompanied by cheesy sound effects>

whamm!!! bammm!!!! whack!!! smack!!!! snap!!! Kick!!! etc etc
</accompanied by cheesy sound effects>

gadzooks batman!

the origional batman

"and its go go go","ive said it once and ill say it again anything can happen in formular one, and it usually does","if is F1 spelt backwards" - murray walker itv the voice of formular one

"thats all folks" - if you dont know, uve been living in a cave...

oh and of course... those fuckin usless network administrators - any person who uses anytype of networked computer that they dont administrate themselves

[nature spirit]

I really got your point guys, but as if your dealing with the whole matter as a mental excercise with theoretical projections..
at the end, it's a human being we're talking about here.. in front of it fall all notions of success.. well being.. and the colors of clouds.
I could never imagine something worth making a soul bleed a warm tear..

[Jon Deaux]

"I have never had sex with that woman. Miss Lewinski"- Bill Clinton