Old 16th January 2004, 02:50   #1
Mixolydian
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Winamp 5.01 hangs on start on Win 98SE

Suddenly 5.01 hangs up on startup. The task manager list shows the equalizer not responding. I've uninstalled, deleted the directory, cleaned the registry, re-downloaded and reinstalled. Same behavior.

This is probably a conflict with some other program...new VB runtime; etc.

Does anyone have any ideas? I really like the new library functions with the filters and would like to keep using the program.
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Old 16th January 2004, 04:57   #2
DJ Egg
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The EQ shows as a separate entry in Task Manager?

Modern or classic skin?

What other programs are running at the time?
Maybe a StartUpList might help us determine where the conflict lies?
Attach the log to a new post
(attachment feature available c/o Post A Reply button).
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Old 16th January 2004, 20:55   #3
Mixolydian
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I've attached startlist.txt as suggested.

Close Program ((CTL-ALT-DEL)) Shows
"Winamp Equalizer (Not Responding)".

I've tried both skins.
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Old 10th February 2004, 03:06   #4
Scorch999
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Confirmed

I have the same issue -- also running 98se, fully patched. I may be able to give you some more details on what is going on ... (although I don't have an answer to the problem, so I'm posting here to get one, really) ...
  • The Equalizer window has focus and displays as the process title.
  • Winamp never gets far enough to create a taskbar entry or a systray entry
  • Winamp does create child windows before its demise: Main, Equalizer, Media Library, etc.
  • The condition is irrespective of where the window is positioned on the screen. It occurred originally on the top right hand corner and after several successive fresh installs, it showed the same problems in the default screen area.
  • Both skins crap out just the same. I have edited the INI to load the classic or the modern, and neither one gets any farther.
  • I have noticed that this problem happened in tandem with v3.0 as well, but only after I had installed 5.01. (v3.0 worked fine for almost 6 months prior to that, and now won't work at all, even with a clean install.)
  • I had no trouble with 5.01 for a few days, then suddenly it stopped working completely. I believe the last major area of the application I messed with was the Media Library. IIRC, the program crashed when I added a 17GB+ directory of MP3s. I tried turning it off manually via the INI, but that did not help.
  • I have come to the tentative conclusion that this is related to the WASABI architecture in some way -- the old versions of Winamp still work fine (v2). Could you give a list of DLLs to check for corruption related to those libraries that are not installed by Winamp? (ie, WASABI dependencies that won't be fixed with a fresh install)
  • I have manually killed all running applications except for Explorer and the problem persists. AFAICT, it's not an application conflict. (Like I said before, I've never had a problem with this before, and I didn't change anything except for installing the new version of Winamp.)
  • I have COMPLETELY uninstalled ALL traces of ANY version of Winamp from my computer SEVERAL times. Afterwards, rebooting a few times and manually cleaning the registry, then rebooting a few more times and then reinstalling the new version, but it never works.
  • I have updated to Dx9 as your website recommended, but that did not help. Problems originally started on a stable install of Dx8.01a.
  • Although I'm not sure how, this does appear to behave like a DDE conflict. That may be a track worth exploring on your end.
  • I am running a Creative SoundBlaster Audigy (first gen) with current drivers. Between working and nonworking times, the drivers were not manipulated at all. An update did not fix the issue after it stopped working.
  • After running this gimpped installation, my entire system becomes unstable. If I open Windows Explorer, it stops when it has to display a folder under the first drive letter listed. The trees never fill out. It just stops, dead. (Reasons I think it's DDE related...)

If you want other details or you have a specific question, ask me. I hope that helps you guys. This is a real problem somewhere. I'm not sure your code is causing it, per se, but it definitely takes two to tango, and any track I could try for a resolution would be greatly appreciated. I don't want to be without my Winamp!
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Old 10th February 2004, 03:49   #5
Mixolydian
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I've gone back to 2.91 and its working just fine. I can live without the fancy features of later versions. The library functions meet my needs. I basically queue up a few hours of music, play, minimize, and go about my business.

I don't have any more information to contribute toward the analysis of this problem right now but will monitor the thread and chime in if I have anything to offer.

Fat, dumb, and happy(or at least content) in East Maine, New York.
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Old 10th February 2004, 04:50   #6
DJ Egg
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Well, as far as I can see, the only common denominator here is Win98SE.
If 2.x is working fine, then I guess it could be an issue with one of the extra plugins in 5.x, eg. modern skin support, ripping/burning, hotkeys, etc.

There has been only two other reported cases of this weird phenonemum,
and we did seem to have some success with one of them.

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?threadid=167928
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?threadid=166874
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Old 10th February 2004, 05:49   #7
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I'm going to take a shot at some of the tips in the success thread. For now, some stuff I neglected to mention, which does correlate, unfortunately:
  • AMD Athlon Thunderbird 1.4G overclocked to 1.507GHz on 143MHz FSB
  • 512MB Corsair ECC SDRAM (Single chip, DIMM)
  • SoundBlaster Audigy
  • Abit KT-7A Mobo (VIA KT133A Chipsets)
  • ATI Radeon 7500 AGP @ 4x
  • Video in Composite Sync mode for a Sun monitor VGA->13W3 adapter
Specifically, AMD and Abit correlate each to at least three of four cases, possibly all. That lends me to believe it's instruction related or perhaps a chipset problem, but the question is with which binary or which part of the chipset, and why fail over time? Why not be flaky or simply not work at all? In two cases (mine and the jerk's), the systems were overclocked -- although his much more so than mine. I currently can't try taking the clock speed down because I don't have a real monitor, so I don't get video until I get into Windows. I don't think that's related, though -- the other two systems don't seem to be pressed too much.

Thanks for taking notice of this thread when it resurfaced, Egg. If you won't mind sticking this one out with us, I'll be happy to help everyone get this one solved.
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Old 10th February 2004, 06:24   #8
DJ Egg
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Ok. Thanks for the info

Yes, it could be a combination of abit / AMD (oc'ed ?!) / Win98SE,
though we didn't get Mixolydian specs.

Sure, I'm more than willing to stick this one out...


Also note that 5.02 is the latest version.
Though I've no idea whether this particular issue has been addressed, or whether it is infact a Winamp issue. But hopefully we can get to the bottom of it somehow.
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Old 10th February 2004, 12:07   #9
Scorch999
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I upgraded to 5.02 before posting.

I wouldn't follow the OC track. It doesn't make any sense. When you have OC problems, it is a result of unset or preset bits that you didn't want. That causes unpredictable instructions to fail in the course of computing. This problem is entirely predictable.

My first instinct is to ask what libraries the program has accessed at this point during the run. We know most of the window structure has already been generated, but most of the controls are missing and there's no response from paint messages.
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Old 10th February 2004, 13:57   #10
Mixolydian
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My system is an old 450 PIII. I'm not sure of the motherboard but Device Manager shows an Intel chipset. All that I've added since I got it almost 6 years ago is 512Meg memory and a CD-RW drive. I do use a USB hub since there are only two ports on the system board. My graphics card is a Matrox MGA-G200 AGP.
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Old 10th February 2004, 23:29   #11
Scorch999
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that seems to rule out the hardware theory. shoot.

i should also mention that i have MSVS6 on my PC, so i have access to all the debuggers and stuff therein.
  • When I attach the debugger to the stuck process, it hangs MSVC++ while trying to load symbol info.
  • Dr. Watson finds "nothing obviously wrong" ... and neither does the process show up as "Not responding" on the task manager.
  • There is only one thread started for the Winamp process at the time that it hangs.
  • The DDE Spy shows no messages going in or out of the Winamp process after it freezes (unfortunately, I can't monitor all processes and then start Winamp -- I have to bind to a process that's already running, so I can't tell you what leads up to the crash ... the same applies to the tracer.)
  • VBSpy does allow me to extract handle info from the main window and view the window tree from that point.
Now i'm going to go retire to some star trek with my newly acquired headache ...
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Old 11th February 2004, 04:47   #12
Scorch999
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OK Good news and bad news. I've done a clean install of 5.02 with the MINIMUM options selected (no fun stuff, just the core winamp), and IT WORKS. Just fine.

I'm going to slowly add components back on top of this installation and see what fails ...
  • Minimal ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active) ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support, Agent (not active) ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support, Agent (active), Visualizations ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support, Agent (not active), Visualizations, Extra Audio Output ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support, Agent (not active), Visualizations, Extra Audio Output, Video File Support ... OK!
  • Minimal, Modern Skin Support (modern skin active), UI Extensions, Audio Files Support, Agent (not active), Visualizations, Extra Audio Output, Video File Support, Library ... FAIL!
I'm going to reboot and then test a clean install with just the library to see if it still fails.

Slight Correction to the above post: my task manager DOES show "Not Responding" next to "Winamp Equalizer" ...

Last edited by Scorch999; 11th February 2004 at 05:02.
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Old 11th February 2004, 05:22   #13
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Dash it all -- I rebooted, uninstalled, rebooted, and then reinstalled with just the core and the Library, and it still worked. The Library must be conflicting with something else. I'm testing other components now ...
  • Minimal, Library ... OK!
  • Minimal, Library, Modern Skin Support ... OK!
  • Minimal, Library, UI Extensions ... OK!
  • Minimal, Library, Audio Output ... OK!
  • Minimal, Library, Agent (not active) ... OK!
  • Minimal, Library, Audio Files Support ... FAIL!
  • Minimal, Library, Video Files Support ... OK!
  • Full, No Audio Support ... OK!
Now tracking down the problem to a specific audio filter ...
  • On a hunch, I tested with a Full installation, minus the Sonic Burn/Rip support ... OK!
That's your problem. The Library module is conflicting with the Sonic burn/rip plugin. If you uninstall one or the other, everything else works fine. So, the tentative solution for these problems is to simply deselect burn/rip support when installing under these conditions.

Ergo, what kind of burner/ATAPI drivers is everyone running?

Damn straight. Now I'm going to bed.

Last edited by Scorch999; 11th February 2004 at 05:45.
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Old 11th February 2004, 06:27   #14
DJ Egg
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Wayhey. Wow, you've certainly been busy.
Process of elimination. Never fails!

I take it you rebooted after installing Sonic Burning/Ripping Support?
Though I'm almost certain you get prompted to do this on Win9x/ME.

Of course there's the possibility that the Sonic Engine has compatibility issues under Win98SE with certain hardware setups.

So, yes, it looks like a list of cd/rw drive make/models is required,
plus whatever other burning software/drivers are installed
(eg. Adaptec ASPI Layer version, ECDC/Roxio, Nero, Sonic RecordNow, etc).

And maybe some StartUpLists might prove useful after all? Just to see if there's a potential conflict with any other concurrently running software.

btw, you could also try using SysInternals' Filemon to monitor processes in real-time.


I'll also add a link to this thread in the Sonic Engine Bugs thread.

Cheers!
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Old 11th February 2004, 15:24   #15
Mixolydian
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Thanks Scorch...I eliminated the Sonic component and 5.02 works for me, too.

For what its worth, I have a Toshiba DVD-ROM SD-M1202 (came with the system) and a LITE-ON LTR-522465. I have Nero 5.5.9.13 with the Incd component. There are probably odd components lying around from the software for my defunct Adaptec PlexWriter 12/10/32A as well.

An awesome piece of problem determination. Reminds me of the old days when I was doing OS development for IBM 360/370. Device support problems are a bear.
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Old 11th February 2004, 15:47   #16
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Any time! Let me know if ya'll have any issues with Shareaza. I work their support forums among other things.

I am running:
  • AOpen CDRW2440, Firmware 2.02 (24x10x40)
  • VIA KT133A Chipsets
  • VIA Bus Master PCI IDE Controller
  • Adaptec WINASPI v4.71, Alpha 2 (Rel. 20 Nov 2002)
  • Nero Burning ROM v6.0.0.11 (which installs a new disc detection handler)
  • inCD is NOT INSTALLED
  • Creative Labs Disc Detector v2.00 (I have tested with this disabled, same results.)
Egg, I did reboot after installing the Sonic support when I originally did it, yes.
No, I was not prompted to reboot at all. The application launched as soon as the registration box was closed.
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Old 25th July 2004, 16:48   #17
BWatzman
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So where's the fix????

This problem was posted in February, it's now July. I just spent the better part of 3 days because of this before finding this thread. The problem is very real and is exactly as described: On at least some Windows 98SE systems, Winamp 5.x locks up the system on startup if both library and the Sonic rip/burn modules are installed (which, by default, they normally both are). The lockup is pretty serious, it screws up Windows, a restart is usually required, and can't always be started cleanly (e.g. you might have to turn off the power because you can't "shut down").

The problem is really serious, I would have expected this to have been fixed by now, after 5 months, but it's not.

In my view, the problem is serious enough that Winamp should disable the Sonic features by default when being installed on 98SE.

In any case, this needs to be made a LOT more visible to people installing Winamp 5 under Windows 98SE (and perhaps 1st edition also).
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Old 26th July 2004, 00:52   #18
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I think the bug report forum is more useful for this thread now.

"Rules are for the guidance of wisemen and the obedience of fools"

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Old 16th January 2005, 18:39   #19
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I have the same problem win WinME. I installed the ECS Card reader in my ECS K7V5A MoBo and WA locks up on startup. I disabled the card reader and it starts fine. Disabling the Sonic Plug-in didn't help, but removing it makes them co-exist. Is there another plug-in that is available to give me back the functionalities lost? I can't rip from CD anymore because my CDROM doesn't show up in the Media Library window.
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Old 16th January 2005, 19:09   #20
DJ Egg
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The Sonic Engine doesn't need to be installed for Ripping Support (but does for Burning Support).
All that's required for ripping is in_cdda.dll (the CD Input plugin) and wnaspi32.dll
(requires "use sonic engine" to be unchecked in CD Ripping Prefs).

I don't have the Sonic Engine installed, and ripping works perfectly ok for me...
then again, I don't have the evil WinME, heh.
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Old 16th January 2005, 19:28   #21
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Interesting that you mention a card reader, BillStocker -- I assume you mean a CF-Card or SD-Card reader? I have a Lead Data 5-in-1 reader on one of my USB ports ... perhaps that is the root of the conflict?
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Old 16th January 2005, 19:29   #22
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I reinstalled the "Nullsoft CD/LineIn plug-in (CDDB2) v3.02 {IN_CDDA.DLL}" and it hangs up again. I have the "Use Sonic Engine when Possible" block unchecked on the plug-in and the "read audio data from CD's~~" block unchecked in ripping. Still hangs up. WinME is evil, but I am to lazy to pirate another OS.
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Old 16th January 2005, 19:30   #23
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I agree the card reader is the root of evil, but is there a work around with WA?
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Old 17th January 2005, 18:03   #24
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probably not yet -- but if we informed sonic, they may be able to update their software to work around the bug. i'm sure it has to do with the aspi layer communication with the cd drive.
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Old 18th January 2005, 01:33   #25
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OK. Thanks for the info!
Bill
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Old 1st April 2005, 23:28   #26
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Just an update to maybe help someone else...

I'm running WinME and had suffered the same lockups as described above. By unplugging my external USB card reader and shutting down its media detection system tray applet, Winamp starts ok.
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