Seeking information ....

[hhb]

Hello,

For about a month now, at odd hours, have been working with NSV software and activex controls for displaying its content -- both nsvplayx and the ravetrax.com ampx versions. Information posted here and at scvi.net has been most helpful, and I thank you all very much for making it available.

Project goals point toward, eventually, having the wherewithall to broadcast small, live events noncommercially, and it may be getting there.

If anyone wishes to try out the current running version, which uses nsvplayx, you can try it HERE. The page uses JS and php to add a few features to the player. Please be advised that this is a TEST page only -- online for a limited time period. File content in all channels is temporary too, and for testing purposes only.

If the live webcast (channel 1, the default loaded channel) is broadcasting, you should see the stream in the player. Otherwise, the page will play a very brief "off the air" video, then go black. Below the player are some channel buttons -- channel 1, as mentioned, is live when broadcasting, the rest stream stored content. Because this whole setup was created simply so a complete newbie to nsv could test the possibilities -- please don't expect cohesive content. (PS here -- channels 2, 3, 4, and 5 stream content converted from flv format to avi with Super -- really nice free program -- before nsv encoding, so the rendering isn't as good as it could be without the conversion steps)

Now, would like to get to the end of this story for the sake of putting this project on the shelf, so would appreciate anyone here in the know providing some answers to the questions below, and thank you very much indeed for some information:

1) Logo overlay with live stream with Camtasia? Have downloaded, installed Camtastia Studio 3.0 for trial, read commentary on scvi.net, but so far cannot manage to make this work. Any pointers are welcome.

2) Some posters here refer to an "original" nsv activex control:

a) Is this original version open source? Is source written in C++ or VB 6? Is it generally available somewhere?

b) Will there be an update for nsv activex with accplus/vp6.2 (also xpi versions for this), or have updates to nsv activex ended?

c) Is there another version different from the "original," and if so, is it available anywhere?

Thanks very much for your time, and hopefully, some answers.

HHB

[hhb]

Hello again,

Wish someone would reply with any info about the status of nsv activex. Lots of reads but no replies. Surely, someone knows something about this.

Nevermind on the Camtasia problem -- solved but unusuable right now. Works fine, but apparently Camtasia is a CPU hog. Tried it on a desktop work machine here:

Pentium 4, 2.6 Ghz with HT, 1 GB RAM - with normal work use, usually takes about 10% CPU. Camtasia jacks cpu use up to around 50%.

Then tried it on the laptop I want to use for future NSV events:

Pentium 4, 1.6 Ghz, 512 RAM - usually, with only NSVCap running a 250 KBS/25 FPS stream plus mixer audio (aac 48KBS), cpu use is in the 40s range (seems a bit high). Add Camtasia/watermark, and cpu use jumps to 100%. Works fine for the brief test time, but no way otherwise.

Two questions:

1) Does ANY other software besides Camtasia enable watermark/overlay with a live stream?

2) Is the high cpu usage partially a "laptop" thing? In other words, would an updated laptop -- say a Pentium 4, 3 Ghz HT, 1 GB RAM -- handle the NSVCap/Camtasia combination better? (For this project, need software overlay and a laptop for portability)

Am not sure this topic is appropriate for this forum, but because NSVCap/Camtasia is the heart of the problem, don't know where else to post it. Apologies if inappropriate, move it or whatever. But please, someone reply with pertinent info, and thank you.

HHB

[sankt]

All the original and subsequent NSV folks are long gone unfortunately.

The person who developed the NSV ActiveX and XPI plugin left NullSoft last year.

The Ampex application was first spotted by T0quer ( I think ) and soon moded by Rava of Ravetrax.

NSV developement by NullSoft / AOL has ground to a hault. Any additional developement has been through the community itself.

[sputnik radio]

I have searched high and low and cannot find any capture software that acts as a capture device other then camtasia. I have found many many webcam type software but none of them are recognized by my system or in nsvcap as a device. I reccomend creating a new user account on your system and in that user account disable all the services that you are not running in msconfig. There are but loads of them so be carefull what you disable. Also set your system properties to run on "performance optimized" settings and not the fluffy stuff that comes with xp if that is what you are using. Also might want to get a ram flusher like ramboost that helps keep your memory from leaking and flushes out old processes keeping an avaialble cache of memory.

of course with me runnnin webcamxp for my chroma keying effect then capturing that with camtasia and using nsvcap and winamp to play my music MY CPU is Maxxed out at 100% constantly. But i have another older computer sitting right next to me to do my web surfing on while my streaming machine is dedicated to the task of running all the above mentioned processes. Would be nice if somebody would put out a mimick program to nsvcap sorta like SAM broadcaster did for dsp. But instead it have full video functions with effects and chroma keying etc.

[ravetrax]

camtasia is by far the best... i have tested everything i have found, and by far, camtasia beats them all...

[hhb]

Hello. Ravetrax, you said:

camtasia is by far the best... i have tested everything i have found, and by far, camtasia beats them all...

I just wondered whether any other software you tried worked at all.

Using Camtasia here, and only capturing with its recorder, instantly ups CPU usage considerably and more or less, depending on which machine is running it, of course.

The usage range is from 50% (heaviest machine here) to 100% (this on the laptop I want to use for portability with livecasting). That's without even turning on NSVCap. Camtasia is consuming cpu all by itself.

Is this typical? If so, what computer specs does one need to use it? Thanks for any info on this, anyone.

HHB

`

[toqer]

FFDshow allows you to do a overlay on live video, and it eats up much less CPU than camtasia. I just discovered it 2 weeks ago.

http://www.afterdawn.com/software/vi...rs/ffdshow.cfm

It works for DVSD video (firewire cams), not sure about anything else.

[sankt]

Can you give us a quick run down of how you set this up Toq ?

[rockouthippie]

I keep getting crashes from loading ffdshow. Mainly any folder that holds an MPEG4s has kittens if you open an explorer window on it. You can disable thumbnails in the system registry and it fixes the problem.

I thought I'd mention this because the bug seems to universal on any XP box I tried it on.

And yeah Toq, I could figure it out, but if you have some cliff notes, that would be cool.

[toqer]

It's pretty easy. I've been hearin other folks have probs gettin it installed, I might have installed the sourceforge version first, then this one, then another version(leaving residuals), but i'm pretty sure I installed this one last.

So i'm not gonna cover installation problems or problems on your systems This has only been tested with NSVenc, and i'm not sure if it's gonna work with anything else.

If everything is installed correctly your start menu should have these things under start>all programs>ffdshow.



You want the bottom one Video Decoder Configuration.

When you open it, a big ass window pops up trying to scare you. Do not fear. First place you want to visit is the codecs section. You can pretty much tell everything to use libavcodec, but for this demonstration, we're just going to select DVSD.


Next go to the tray section, make sure show tray icon is checked off (this will let you know its working once you launch nsvenc)

This is how I have the overlay section setup.


And finally the bitmap overlay section



(you can play with all this stuff once nsvenc is running.)

Finally, run NSVENC. THIS IS NOT A TUTORIAL ON THE COMMAND LINE NSVENC PROGRAM, THERE ARE STICKIES AT THE TOP FOR THAT! Once NSVenc is running, and you're capturing from your DVSD source, you'll notice a little ffdshow icon in your system tray.


Double clicking that will bring up the FFDshow dialog. From there you can tweak things on a live stream. Add filters, change picture properties, psuedo zoom (digital) change overlays, all kinds of fun stuff.

The bitmap overlays i've used are bitmaps. Not jpg,png,gif,etc. Black is a transparent color if you use the lighten mode. Maybe other can fill in some more blanks.

Anyways, that's it for this tutorial. I'm hopin someone can help me make something superduper with this, like something that can listen for shoutcast style title updates on the encoding machine, then generated a new bitmap on update, and fade it in and out. (would be way cool on the karaoke stream)

[hhb]

Toqer, you are a prince.

Thanks, HHB

[slavas]

>Next go to the tray section, make sure show tray icon is >checked off (this will let you know its working once you >launch nsvenc)

probably you meant checked?

plus enabling settings per application would be useful if ffdshow is used more that for streaming (i dont have any capture device so its untested, but i dont see why it shouldnt):

[slavas]

//

[toqer]

That's pretty neat. I only use this machine purely for the bamboo

How about some slavas graphical title shoutcast style updates compatible overlay programming love?

[hhb]

Hi, have barely tested with both Camtasia and FFDShow, both work fine but use high cpu here -- FFDShow seems to have a lot more features. Very nice.

Question for anyone using Camtasia with watermark for live transmission:

Default capture FPS for Camtasia recorder is 5. Anytime I tried upping its FPS rate to even 10 -- tried 20 and 25, too -- the Camtasia activity screen showed that it could only capture at a 8-9 FPS rate. Asking for more FPS shot cpu use up to 100 percent (DV Camcorder output is 720 x 480, Camtasia set at 320 x 240). And Camtasia recorder could not up its capture rate above the 8-9 FPS in any circumstance.

Is the hangup a local machine limitation (2 models -- P4 1.6 Mhz and P4 2.6 Mhz with HT), the Camtasia recorder's limitation, or the resizing requirement, or all of the above? FFDShow, using resizing and other filters too, shows 29.+ FPS, doesn't max out machine cpu.

Thanks for any info -- HHB

[rockouthippie]

Camtasia is just CPU intensive. That's the bottom line. It's why I haven't considered it an option.

I think if you had some machine that was state of the art fast, and were willing to use it exclusively for that, you'd be ok.

But....

[hhb]

Thanks for the comments. The main concern here is how a 5 FPS capture rate would affect output for live NSV broadcasting of small events -- the voice synching, lots of motion in the content, and so on. I can see 5 FPS for overlay of still content working okay.

Just don't know enough about how all this stuff works together to decide how Camtasia's 5 FPS from dv cam to NSVCap at 25 FPS would work out. Testing outside in good light -- waiting for a weather break here -- which would be the normal broadcast environment, might give the answer, but if anyone knows ahead of time, thanks for the info.

As said, FFDShow, while using several filters (unsharp mask, resize, overlay, others, too) shows a 29+ FPS rate that NSVCap accepts just fine, a rate that should cover the situation. Doesn't max out machine cpu either. Maybe am getting to be an FFDShow fan.

HHB

[hhb]

Technically challenged, somehow made a double post, so edited this to zip. Sorry for the mistake.

HHB

[ravetrax]

ok here is a major tip for camtasia

run 15bit color... 24 bit sucks crazy amounts of cpu.

and yes i've tried many various creen capture tools, for me personally, camtaisa is by far the most stable and useable.

[ravetrax]

Originally posted by ravetrax
ok here is a major tip for camtasia

run 15bit color... 24 bit sucks crazy amounts of cpu.

and yes i've tried many various creen capture tools, for me personally, camtaisa is by far the most stable and useable.

erg, just realized i said 15 bit... its 16 bit color.

just didn't want to confuse anyone.

[hhb]

Not a problem, guessed the same. I dunno, ravetrax -- I think now that most of the high cpu usage problems here arose from machine limitations. Upgraded the laptop test machine to a more powerful one a couple of days ago, and now cpu issues have disappeared.

Was testing with a P4 1.6 Ghz/512 RAM/5400 rpm HD XP laptop as a dedicated machine. Both ffdshow and camtasia recorder generally maxed out its cpu. High cpu usage also when testing on a desktop XP P4 2.6 Ghz with HT/1 GB RAM/7200 rpm HD -- either one of the programs consumed from 60-85% cpu, still too high.

The new entry, a laptop with duo processors at 2 Ghz/1 GB fast RAM/7200 rpm HD, performs the above tasks like it's a piece of cake -- 10-20% cpu usage maximum, which should suffice for most situations. Also, the machine allows Camtasia Recorder to capture at 30 FPS, if needed.

Because cpu usage is apparently no more an issue, have opted for ffdshow as the helper app. It enables the logo/whatever overlay, customized subtitling, and most importantly in this live situation, it allows almost infinite picture quality adjustments, all in real time. Its flexible features should be about right for a live broadcasting situation where the environment is practically never the same. Sure do hope so.

Thanks very much for your help with this, and for your excellent example of javascripting a webpage activex player, which is also an essential part of this project.

HHB

[spikechu]

how did you get it to work with NsVcap ? i seem to be having a problem getting FFdshow to work with it.

[john@ROCKNTV1]

spikechu,

ffdshow , when configured correctly in the
"supported codecs" area will be you usable with
NSVCAP when your source useS them during NSVENC



http://forums.winamp.com/showthread....hreadid=244102

[spikechu]

what if im using NSVcap to stream live video. will it still work?

[gavin2812]

hi, just followed a link here and although i've read through the thread, ive realised that I may be thick and dont understand as much about this as i tohught... so please excuse my slight ignorance on the subject (im trying my best!)

i am looking at using NSVcap to capture a live audio/video input on a capture card for a live stream and i would like to include the compnay logo on the live stream...

I have read thorugh the tread and it seems that camtasia seems to use too much ram and i should go for ffdshow. I did go onto the camtasia forum and ask whether or not the software would do this but got no response so may not bother!

My question is, will ffdshow do this successfully? will the steps described earlier in the thread work OK, has anyone else tested it? any feedback on camtasia workign for just a logo on live streams?

thanks again.

[hhb]

Hi, am using FFDShow for logo overlay on live video broadcast with NSVCap, and it works very well. Camtasia also works. In my situation, I opted for FFDShow because:

1) the app itself offers a variety of features to adjust and improve the live broadcast image quality in real time

2) After configuring it to your tastes, using it as an NSVCap helper is not complicated -- it automatically starts up when you start encoding with NSVCap.

Initially, used the method described on this forum. Since then, have stumbled on other FFDShow features.

For example, if you want to include a screen announcement overlaid on the live broadcast screen, FFDShow makes this easy to do. In the same way you made your logo bitmap for logo overlay, you can make announcement bitmaps.

FFDShow lets you save a profile for each one -- load the announcement bitmap for overlay, you'll see it appear on the live screen. Then go to the "image settings" part of FFDShow config and save it as a profile to use whenever you want to overlay the announcement. You can make as many different bitmap profiles as you need.

Overlaying a profiled announcement live is simply a matter of loading the profile for it -- takes about 5 to 10 seconds to appear on the live screen, but the lag is an unavoidable result of encoding to a remote shoutcast server.

In addition, outdoor live broadcast tests here have presented a variety of environments -- bright sun, overcast, and so on. With FFDShow as helper, you can correct the image appearance in real time to suit the situation. You can also save the adjustments in a profile to use later in a similar situation.

I dunno, am just an FFDShow fan I guess. It works very well, and after configuring it to personal preferences, using it requires practically no attention from you as broadcaster.

hhb

[toqer]

Originally posted by hhb


FFDShow lets you save a profile for each one -- load the announcement bitmap for overlay, you'll see it appear on the live screen. Then go to the "image settings" part of FFDShow config and save it as a profile to use whenever you want to overlay the announcement. You can make as many different bitmap profiles as you need.

hhb

Dude, I think you just stumbled onto something.

[Barney Boo]

Hi there, I've been interested in live overlays for NSV streams for a long time, and ffdshow certainly looks to be a potentially great solution.
I'm having some problems, however. I'm using NSVCAP to stream a webcam. I've set everything up in ffdshow so that I can see the results of various filters etc. in the NSVCAP window, however when I play the live stream in Winamp, none of the filters are visible - just the clean feed from the webcam.
ffdshow seems to be only applying the changes to the overlay mix - what step am I stupidly missing to carry the effects onto the actual stream?

[hhb]

Unless you click the "Apply" button after making your settings, FFDShow won't use them the next time it opens -- you'll get its default settings instead.

If you're disabling NSVCap preview before you start your capture, FFDShow closes at the end of preview and reopens when you capture. Just a thought.

hhb

[Barney Boo]

It's definitely applying - whilst it's capturing I can see all the effects in place, with NSVCap preview enabled during the capture
I'm not really sure what else to try...

[john@ROCKNTV1]

Originally posted by Barney Boo
It's definitely applying - whilst it's capturing I can see all the effects in place, with NSVCap preview enabled during the capture
I'm not really sure what else to try...

______________________
Strange, i have never seen the overlay in my preview window, as ffdshow applies its werks during nsvenc...
now you have a latency diff from the in put to out put.
use winamp to view output file local host and make adjustments....almost realtime......20/40sec.
1394 =best conventional method....
svid loop back out put 2 secondary recorder
watch on secondary moni. real time adjustment ...NO latency.
john


http://forums.winamp.com/showthread...threadid=244102

[hhb]

Apologies for missing your post, Barney Boo. Received a thread update notification via email for John's addition, saw your question then. Am pretty much an NSV newbie -- since January, and don't have an answer for you. Have not run into what you describe before.

If you're seeing in your NSVCap preview your stream with FFDShow's adjustments (i.e., picture quality, bitmap overlay, whatever) while NSVCap is capturing/encoding to the shoutcast server, the same view should be visible in the live stream, as you already know.

Am NSVCap encoding to a remote shoutcast server, works fine, FFDShow changes appear in the NSVCap preview window instantly (preview usually disabled while encoding though) and in the live stream about 10 seconds later.

Have tried this method using 2 different dv camcorders, analog wide view cams, etc -- connecting to NSVCap encoding computer with straight firewire.

Also have used same cam devices (AV out) with multiple wireless transmitters >>> 4-channel receiver >>> converter box (analog in, dv out) >>> laptop with firewire -- stream switching and FFDShow adjustments work okay.

Initially, tried connecting the wireless cam streams to laptop with a "USB Grabber" that had its own driver. The video stream showed in NSVCap preview window, but FFDShow could not function as helper app -- its icon would not even open on NSVCap stream preview.

Decided that FFDShow, for whatever reason, could not recognize the USB Grabber stream. Switching to a converter box with firewire connection to NSVCap laptop enabled FFDShow.

Would like to help, but as already said, haven't run into the situation you describe. Here's hoping someone else has, can explain what's going on and offer a solution.

hhb

[Barney Boo]

This might be related then - this is a USB webcam - I will try playing around with some other sources.
Thanks for your help and lengthy experimentation

[Barney Boo]

Hello again! For some reason now, it's all working wonderfully. I was playing with the Output settings in ffdshow and noticed that it was playing a very important role. After a LOT of trial and error, I got to a combination which works - curiously, now in the NSVCAP preview I DON'T see the changes, but I do in the encoded stream.
Thanks again for all your help!

[hhb]

Well that sure is good news. Just remembered when I tried the USB Grabber with its driver, the wirelessly transmitted analog stream via RCA passed to the grabber, where it was supposed to be converted to DV as it entered the laptop and appeared in the NSVCap preview window. In NSVCap, the USB driver appeared as a device choice and its stream opened in the NSVCap preview, as it should have.

Problem for me was I needed the FFDShow adjustments for a quality live output, and the FFDShow icon would not open automatically as it should have, so scrapped the whole idea. Perhaps if I had manually opened FFDShow, made the adjustments, then encoded, live output would have shown the FFDShow adjustments, as you described. Might just give it a go to see what happens.

However, am now a converter box fan because this one works flawlessly with just about anything thrown at it, plus, for reasons not understood by me, it's dv version of color imaging is considerably more attractive than the straight cam to laptop via firewire rendition. The difference is obvious even to these untrained eyes. Don't know how to figure it, but blind luck is always welcomed ....

hhb