TIMOTHY MCVEIGH IS SCHEDULED TO BE EXECUTED - ONLINE

[SNYder]

http://ifilm.com/db/static_text/0,1699,16762,00.html

For or Against?

I for one am undecided as of right now. Is it moraly wrong or not? I just can't decide!

Also... there is some other amusing tid bits on that page you might get a kick out of

[Bilbo Baggins]

totally and utterly wrong. Anyway, won't this make him a martyr for his cause?

Still showing a mans death on the internet isn't new, just not live. Check http://www.rotten.com for more dead men...

[s1138]

$1.95!!!! guess i cant watch it.

[InvisableMan]

SWEET!!!

[simon snowflake]

It should not be so. Death penalty is wrong.

[Huehuetenango]

in most cases i'm against the death penalty, but for him, i think i'll make an exception

though i am AGAINST broadcasting his execution

[Curi0us_George]

Broadcasting it is ridiculous. I'm in favor of the death penalty, but broadcasting a human's death is not necessary. Viewing another's death is certainly not the right of "society."

[fish]

I'm undecided.

It's like a car crash - it's really terrible, but you really really want to look...

[Bizznatch]

but then again there used to be public executions in the middle ages and in the wild wild west....

and they were FREE

[SNYder]

I am whol heartedly against the death penalty.

[crazydude999]

Originally posted by SNYder


http://ifilm.com/db/static_text/0,1699,16762,00.html

For or Against?

I for one am undecided as of right now. Is it moraly wrong or not? I just can't decide!

Also... there is some other amusing tid bits on that page you might get a kick out of

This is somewhat off topic, but i noticed you put "amusing bits"... are you talking about where to watch peoples funerals ?

just so you don't take me wrong, i had to edit the post. I don't think it's amuzing that people die, i think it's kind of odd to be able to watch peoples funerals. sad events.

[rm']

Nothing wrong with it. Our society survives on spectacle, and at least by having his death watched and ridiculed by millions, MvVeigh will contribute non-negatively to society. As Bizz pointed out, public executions were commonplace in past eras. We're aren't all that much advanced morally than the Elizabethans, so we shouldn't use a higher power magnifying glass on ourselves.

[John M]

/me is against executions.

[rm']

Do while e < pi
Print "I am for capital punishment"
Do next

[Xerxes]

Public Executions should be allowed; heck, they still have public beheadings in Arabia (My grandfather watched one while in the Army) but nobody should be allowed to make money off of them- the government should be the only broadcaster.

[Gigabyte]

I am for the death penalty, but I do think it should be harder for someone to receive it. In his case I think he should get it.

I also have a theory of the death sentence was much more painful and torturous crime would go down. Executions should be televised, or maybe even publicly displayed. They should be bloody and sickening to look at. Terrible crimes would go down.

[rm']

Originally posted by Gigabyte
Executions should be televised, or maybe even publicly displayed. They should be bloody and sickening to look at. Terrible crimes would go down.

Better yet, eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth.

[ElChevelle]

The broadcast has been overwhelmingly denied for obvious reasons.
Old news.

[griffinn]

Originally posted by Gigabyte
I also have a theory of the death sentence was much more painful and torturous crime would go down.

Not necessarily. It depends on how judiciously the court applies the death penalty.

If the court punishes every murder by death regardless of circumstance, there's nothing to stop a criminal from killing again and again while trying to get away, because he has no hope of being spared the death penalty anyway after the first murder.

Worse yet, if you live in a country like mine, where the death penalty is applied to crimes other than murder, e.g. embezzlement and corruption, you get terrible cases like a manager stole money from his company, and then tried to get rid of all witnesses by killing his secretary and his boss.

[[LMF]ZeroKool]

Originally posted by Radioactive Man
Do while e < pi
Print "I am for capital punishment"
Do next

repeat
writeln("I am against capital punishment");
until (ZeroKool=Death)

[s1138]

if anyone watches it, could you like copy it or somethin, i wanna see it.

[[LMF]ZeroKool]

$1.95 to view for someone's death??? (I just notice)
Go to Israel or Palestine. See all the death you want!!
Just a thought.

[SNYder]

Originally posted by crazydude999

This is somewhat off topic, but i noticed you put "amusing bits"... are you talking about where to watch peoples funerals ?

just so you don't take me wrong, i had to edit the post. I don't think it's amuzing that people die, i think it's kind of odd to be able to watch peoples funerals. sad events.

actually, I was refearing to the Bush Palm Pilot game from China.

Back to the subject. My reasoning for being against the death penalty is rather complex.

A person only becomes evil and kills due to his backgound. At birth and as a young child, you are innocent. i.e. It is not the fathers fault that you killed your wife, but if your father hadn't beat you and your mother all your life, you may not have grown with the anger and rage that drove you to commiting murder.

Every cold hearted murder was once an innocent child looking wide eyed at the world with pure wonder and beauty. When you kill the murderer, you kill that child too. The child may have been hiden away behind the anger for years, but does his crime give us the right to end his life and the slim hope he might one day repent his sins and see what he has done was wrong? Even if he never learns a lesson, WE HAVE NO RIGHT TO JUDGE A MANS FATE, KILLING ALL POSSABILITY OF HOPE, cause for ever one man who never learns or cares, there might be another who will.

Frankely, I understand, but don't agree with how people justify killing another person cause he killed someone himself. I see both sides as commiting murder.

I understand the benifet of the death penalty, such as how it might stop a criminal from commiting murder in fear of the death sentence, but for the few civilian lives it saves, houndreds more human lives are lost.

Hmmmmm..... I think that is all I have to say for now.

Please note, I am passionate about the fact that EVERBODY deserves to live, but in no way do I look down on anyone else for thinking otherwise on this subject, cause frankely, I see your reasoning behind it oh so well. This is just my personal opinion on the matter.

Peace

[[LMF]ZeroKool]

SNYder got a point there, people only turn evil when evil comes to them. People stay good when goodness stays with them

[SNYder]

If someone kills a mothers daughter and she kill the murder in revenge, she will be be sent to prison and tried for pre meditated murder. If the mother of a slayn daughter can't kill the murderer of her child, then neither can the government.

We take away peoples freedom when they commit a crime. We have the power, and the right. It is our duty to protect the citizens who still abide by their countries laws, and that is why your freedom is thrown away when you commit horrid acts like this. You are a threat to society. In jail, you can't hurt those who are still law abiding citizens. But jail is also a place for punishment. If you steal something, sometimes you are sent to jail to live amoung the filth of the nation, in hopes you will learn your lesson. Punishment is given in hopes you learn your lesson. Otherwise, it is given to get even, and that is not a good enough reason. If a murder doesn't get death, the worst he can get is life in jail. The purpose of jail is to make you learn a lesson. But how can you learn your lesson when you are dead?

[Edited by SNYder on 06-04-2001 at 11:46 PM]

[Anacific]

If a criminal gets a life sentence WHY should people (or even relatives of the victims) pay [taxes??] to keep them in jail??

PS: I can find you a case on the web about a guy who raped a dozen or so young boys and then when he was given only a few years in prison some of those boys commited suicide[!!!!] What do you think?

[Xerxes]

THe person being executed learns nothing (Except a very brief, exciting lesson about completing an electrical circuit)

Instead; the state accepts the loss of a citizen in the hopes that that person will be an example to all the rest of the would be murderers out there.

[rm']

The purpose of jail isn't to teach a lesson, it's to punish the criminal...

Anyhow, people are born inherently selfish. Selfishness, unless controlled, turns to greed, which, unless controlled, turns to avarice, which will inevitably turn to evil.

Required reading: William Golding, Lord of the Flies, Niccolo Machiavelli, The Prince, Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy

It is impossible to undo the nature of man, i.e., people will never become unselfish. Prison, as a rehabilitative tool, is a futile endevour. Rather than try to change human nature, it's more effective to punish it once it gets out of control (i.e. when the person moves from greed to avarice).

[SNYder]

Originally posted by Anacific
If a criminal gets a life sentence WHY should people (or even relatives of the victims) pay [taxes??] to keep them in jail??

so killing people to save a few cents is ok?

Originally posted by Anacific
PS: I can find you a case on the web about a guy who raped a dozen or so young boys and then when he was given only a few years in prison some of those boys commited suicide[!!!!] What do you think?

That has NO relevence to this descussion. If you want to talk about that, then we should discuss how criminals get too little punishment, and how teens can cope in stressfull times.

We are discussing the possability that even criminals get too much unnessisary punishment.

Note: Life in prison is not too much unnessisary punishment. Unless your crime is accidently stepping on your neighbors rose peddles.

[Anacific]

back to the topic:

I am against Broadcasting just because for many people it would serve as another kind of entertainment

Death penatly is a serious punishment and it should be taken seriously!

[SNYder]

Originally posted by Radioactive Man
The purpose of jail isn't to teach a lesson, it's to punish the criminal...

Anyhow, people are born inherently selfish. Selfishness, unless controlled, turns to greed, which, unless controlled, turns to avarice, which will inevitably turn to evil.

Required reading: William Golding, Lord of the Flies, Niccolo Machiavelli, The Prince, Dante Alighieri, The Divine Comedy

...Prison, as a rehabilitative tool, is a futile endevour...

Rehabiliating is something we need to work on in our prisons. The conditions are horrible, but not as horrible as they are when your skin is melting in the electric chair. Even if the Prison itslef gives no effort to rehabilitate, rehabilitation finds it's ways to manny on it's own. Being in prison can and has made people relize just how drastic what they have done is. From their anything is possable. No matter what, it still is not our place to judge whether or not the person lives to even have a chance at rehabilitation.

...

Originally posted by Radioactive Man
"It is impossible to undo the nature of man, i.e., people will never become unselfish. Prison, as a rehabilitative tool, is a futile endevour. Rather than try to change human nature, it's more effective to punish it once it gets out of control (i.e. when the person moves from greed to avarice)."

By punish, do you mean, put someone to death?

[Gigabyte]

Originally posted by Anacific
If a criminal gets a life sentence WHY should people (or even relatives of the victims) pay [taxes??] to keep them in jail??

PS: I can find you a case on the web about a guy who raped a dozen or so young boys and then when he was given only a few years in prison some of those boys commited suicide[!!!!] What do you think?

I think when you get the life sentence you should get literally thrown into an unescapable pit. And you have to spend the rest of your (short) life eating whatever animals fall in and die.

PS:

[weedsatan]

Here comes the next marter...

[mr_sax]

i have one thing to say -

"look maw! a guy's gettin killed on the compooper!"




i think it's utterly STUPID that they would do a thing like that... just so a bunch of ppl can watch him die and a company can make a profit? i mean, yay they give all the money collected to poor ppl and shit, but many MANY ppl will be at their site watching it, and through that and the clicksters who like to click the annoying ads, they will make more than just 1.98$ per person.


WHY WOULD YOU KILL TO MAKE PROFIT!?

[rm']

Originally posted by SNYder
so killing people to save a few cents is ok?

There is something morally hypocritical and unjust about giving a murderer free room and board, while forcing the family of the victim to live on, possibly without the aid of the primary wage earner.

[ElChevelle]

Originally posted by zxypher
WHY WOULD YOU KILL TO MAKE PROFIT!?

Naive!
Haven't you ever heard the "Iceman" or "Sammy the Bull"?
Excellent money! I'd love to jump into the occupation and have several freebies lined up already in here

[rm']

Originally posted by SNYder
Rehabiliating is something we need to work on in our prisons. The conditions are horrible, but not as horrible as they are when your skin is melting in the electric chair.

It's not the purpose of prisons to rehabilitate in the first place. Their purpose is to keep dangerous elements away from society in general, while serving the dual purpose of punishment.

Even if the Prison itslef gives no effort to rehabilitate, rehabilitation finds it's ways to manny on it's own. Being in prison can and has made people relize just how drastic what they have done is. From their anything is possable. No matter what, it still is not our place to judge whether or not the person lives to even have a chance at rehabilitation.

Remorse is different from rehabilitation. Remorse won't bring back your victims, nor will it assure that you won't do it again. When you do something as heinous as mass murder or rape, you must be prepared to carry the consequences for life. Adding on to that, it was not the murderers place to judge whether his victim should lose his life or not, or not at the rapists discretion as to when his victim should lose her innocence. When you do certain things, you give up certain rights, that under normal, civil circumstances, should never be taken from you. When you become less than civil, you choose to give up those rights (such as the right to life).

Originally posted by Radioactive Man
"It is impossible to undo the nature of man, i.e., people will never become unselfish. Prison, as a rehabilitative tool, is a futile endevour. Rather than try to change human nature, it's more effective to punish it once it gets out of control (i.e. when the person moves from greed to avarice)."

By punish, do you mean, put someone to death? [/B][/QUOTE]

Punishment can take many forms.

[rm']

Originally posted by zxypher
i think it's utterly STUPID that they would do a thing like that... just so a bunch of ppl can watch him die and a company can make a profit? i mean, yay they give all the money collected to poor ppl and shit, but many MANY ppl will be at their site watching it, and through that and the clicksters who like to click the annoying ads, they will make more than just 1.98$ per person.


WHY WOULD YOU KILL TO MAKE PROFIT!?

No one is making a profit, except for maybe the emotional profit of the victim's families. Like you said yourself, all proceeds are going to charities. At an event like this, no one in their right mind would click on an ad, and miss out on the action.

[Thor]

DEATH PENALTY IS WRONG AND AGAINTS HUMAN RIGHTS !!!
The United States are always the first to point at other countries if they violate the human rights. They pretent to be the one country that is so good at it all they should tell the rest of the world what to do ...
I'm not an America hater, a communist, or whatever ...
But as long as you (since most of you are Americans) execute people, it really doesn't mather for what reason, you have no real right critise other nations !

And about broadcasting it ... That's just SICK ! It really illustrates how dumb the US authorities are...

The death penalty IS a mediaval practise !!!
But making it public is really going back in time ! Back to public hangings and burning on the town square !

And btw, Bush is a fucking dumbass !

-my 2 cents...

[ElChevelle]

Originally posted by Thor
DEATH PENALTY IS WRONG AND AGAINTS HUMAN RIGHTS !!!

RAPE AND MURDER ARE WRONG AND AGAINST HUMAN RIGHTS !!!